# Are you saved?:)



## Rozanne

It's a bit of a tongue in the cheek question...but I wanted to see if many people on here believe that they can be "saved" and find heaven on earth, ie peace of mind and tranquility of spirit.


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## Guest

I doubt ANYONE on here has found any "peace of mind".

Atleast a no from me.


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## jimmyb

I believe I will be saved, if not in this life then definitely in the next.

Have you ever had a karmatic reading Roz? Apparently in past lives I was a hard worker and looked at life from what I saw physically. In this life I am here to learn a lot about myself and to develop spiritually.

Jimmy


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## Rozanne

Hi,
Sorry to ask again, but my question was whether people here believe that ultimate peace is possible for the human mind.

I believe peace is possible. What you have got to keep in mind is that peace and enlightenment are possible. They are actually real. Masters aren't talking about something intangible but real experiences of the mind.


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## Pablo

I haven't ever met anybody who has peace of mind, although most people have more than me so that is what I am aiming for.

I believe it is possible though although very difficult when the whole world tries to bring you down, im not sure it can come in the form of permanent enlightenment though


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## Andy_oh

Yes i believe there can be peace of mind because i used to have it before all this started, i just want to go back to the good days but don't know how.


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## nu-power

im living in peace of mind most of the time. i dont know how or why though


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## jimmyb

Peace of mind is being able to balance everything in your life, make the right decisions and do the right things.


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## jimmyb

Everything you do effects your peace of mind.


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## Guest

jimmyb said:


> I believe I will be saved, if not in this life then definitely in the next.
> 
> Have you ever had a karmatic reading Roz? Apparently in past lives I was a hard worker and looked at life from what I saw physically. In this life I am here to learn a lot about myself and to develop spiritually.
> 
> Jimmy


youve falled victim to delusion... goodluck


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## 17545

I've been "saved", so to speak, but I've since stopped believing in Christianity.


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## falling_free

I think you can find peace of mind , although it won't ever be a permanant state , life is such a rollercoaster that you can't possibly be at peace all the time I think, especially in this modern age we live in with so much stress and all :? .


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## Guest

true true, life is a rollercoaster but without DPDR Pure O anxiety I cannot imagine life even being a challenge I'll go through like Mister Untouchable.
I know this from experience...and other recovered DPDR people said same.
So I cant wait to recover

And all of you will feel the same


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## DreamLife

Pablo said:


> I haven't ever met anybody who has peace of mind, although most people have more than me so that is what I am aiming for.
> 
> I believe it is possible though although very difficult when the whole world tries to bring you down, im not sure it can come in the form of permanent enlightenment though


Do you really believe that the whole world is trying to bring you down? How sad...


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## DreamLife

As for me, I believe peace of mind is possible at all times only through a higher power, i.e. not myself or another human being or some material possesion.

I do not have peace of mind constantly, but I definitely have it more than not. I understand the big picture, that it's not all about me and my world and what my problems are and what I can get from you. I try to see how I can contribute and who I can help and understand that life is full of pain and challenges, but in order for me to grow I must walk through those obstacles. I look forward to those things now, because each time I get over a hurdle I am blessed with more and more peace of mind and perspective and humility.

It's so much easier than constantly stressing about my miniscule problems when I realize that my life is bigger than that, that I'm going to do things in this life that will outlive all the everyday bullshit that seems like such a big deal at the time.


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## Rozanne

Copeful said:


> true true, life is a rollercoaster but without DPDR Pure O anxiety I cannot imagine life even being a challenge I'll go through like Mister Untouchable.
> I know this from experience...and other recovered DPDR people said same.
> So I cant wait to recover
> 
> And all of you will feel the same


What's the point in recovering from depersonalisation to embark on a life of ego?


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## Rozanne

I don't know why I'm writing this, but it does seem kind of obvious that dp should make you reassess what you are aiming for in life. At the same time as wrecking in harmony, it makes your question reality. Surely after having dp, one realises the importance of internal states, and the need to have inner happiness to ever really enjoy anything outside of yourself. So why not give up on ambitions of external success and start thinking of your internal life as important for its own sake. Instead of for an end, that is. Doing things is a lot easier when done for love, arising out of a peaceful soul.


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## jimmyb

Angel_Ariel said:


> I don't know why I'm writing this, but it does seem kind of obvious that dp should make you reassess what you are aiming for in life. At the same time as wrecking in harmony, it makes your question reality. Surely after having dp, one realises the importance of internal states, and the need to have inner happiness to ever really enjoy anything outside of yourself. So why not give up on ambitions of external success and start thinking of your internal life as important for its own sake. Instead of for an end, that is. Doing things is a lot easier when done for love, arising out of a peaceful soul.


Nothing more true than that. Even with DP I look at people and how they are and just think, take a look inside yourself, what do you see?


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## Rozanne

If you ask people, most will say that inner happiness is more important than money.

Many go on retreats and detox. BUT, there is a big difference between being vaguely interested in peace, and making it a first priority. Peace is a way of being, like the Tao. If you live for peace, you live in it. Like the hymns that say "God is love and those who live in Him live in God and God lives in them". Love and peace are contextual things in which you can live, not objects.

I'm only writing this because it's come to my attention recently that if you don't believe in peace, it may be harder to "find it". But if peace is the conscious aim, it may come more easily.


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## Guest

Ultimate peace is possible for the delusional. Peace is to be balanced out within Mother Nature, and it would seem we humans have our greedy hands on the weights of balance... and being the foolish beings we are, we pull forcefully down in what would seem to be in our favour. ?Extinction? how many creatures have ceased to exist due to our hands? Ignorance is blissful in the short-term, but in the long-term; it never lasts. For peace to be at a balance, us humans must become extinct ourselves, and if I had the power to make it so, I wouldn?t hesitate, although why speed up the inevitable? We?re self destructive? perhaps my DR/DP came along due to my pure hate of my own kind? I see us humans for what we really are, and I?m not better than any other.


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## christodenisto2

jimmyB,

why don't you do 10 karmic readings and see if they actually agree with each other.

when I was depressed I went to one spiritual healer who said my depression came from the breakage of the 'egg of Lemuria on Atlantis'. Two days later I went to another healer who said it actually came from a life in 14th century Europe when I was a practicing alchemist and endured an experimental accident that killed me.

Fortunately doctors and other medical professionals dont go around making extravagant, untestable claims about things, or we'd all be up the pole!

by the way, from what I've read, some small percentage of people do actually achieve a permanent altered state of consciousness they call enlightenment, or God-Consciousness, or Presence, or similar, where they do achieve both lasting inner peace AND a feeling of real connection to something Universal like Universal Love.

I just think that is really, really hard to obtain, and many people spend their ENTIRE LIVES meditating and following gurus in an attempt to find these states, only to never find them.

It is definitely possible though - and if you look hard enough you can find personal accounts on the internet of people who have found these states.

cheers,

Christodenisto


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## Terri

> Sorry to ask again, but my question was whether people here believe that ultimate peace is possible for the human mind.


Good question, but the very need which you feel to ask the question suggests that you doubt it, you even apologize for asking.

To answer this question requires us to ask a whole set of interlocking questions. Do we all feel "peace" essentially the same way? If so what is the common essence? Where do we draw the boundaries of what we willing to take on? etc etc


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## DreamLife

Jas said:


> Good question, but the very need which you feel to ask the question suggests that you doubt it, you even apologize for asking.
> 
> To answer this question requires us to ask a whole set of interlocking questions. Do we all feel "peace" essentially the same way? If so what is the common essence? Where do we draw the boundaries of what we willing to take on? etc etc


Whoa! I think you're overcomplicating the question. It's a simple concept that we as human beings try to complicate, I think because we're trying to justify why we don't have peace.

It's not that it's not possible or it's too complex for us to understand, it's just that we don't have it. Striving toward the ultimate goal of peace of mind helps us see purpose in life and gain a sense of perspective about ourselves and how finite and miniscule we are in the scheme of things.


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## Guest

A perfect world wouldn't be perfect.


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## NorrinRadd

Angel_Ariel said:


> It's a bit of a tongue in the cheek question...but I wanted to see if many people on here believe that they can be "saved" and find heaven on earth, ie peace of mind and tranquility of spirit.


I think it must be found somewhere...

Way on the other side of the Hudson, Deep in the bosom of suburbia

(Sorry, in light of your username, I couldn't resist.)

I'm "saved" in the Evangelical Christian sense, but I don't know that anyone finds permanent, abiding peace of mind here on earth.


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## Guest

*NorrinRadd:*

If you had not doubts about your Christianity, you?ll be border lining ?prefect peace".


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## Pablo

I guess the question is whether you can have happiness without suffering, because without suffering how would you know what happiness is?, everything exists in polarities so to experience happiness you need to have experienced suffering to know the difference.

But then again there is the concept of enlightenment which is the transcendence of all polarities, but in history there are only a few people who have supposedly achieved this so I dont think it worth aiming for at the moment, health and a degree of mental freedom is a much more achieveable aim I think.


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## Guest

christodenisto2 said:


> jimmyB,
> 
> why don't you do 10 karmic readings and see if they actually agree with each other.
> 
> when I was depressed I went to one spiritual healer who said my depression came from the breakage of the 'egg of Lemuria on Atlantis'. Two days later I went to another healer who said it actually came from a life in 14th century Europe when I was a practicing alchemist and endured an experimental accident that killed me.
> 
> Fortunately doctors and other medical professionals dont go around making extravagant, untestable claims about things, or we'd all be up the pole!
> 
> by the way, from what I've read, some small percentage of people do actually achieve a permanent altered state of consciousness they call enlightenment, or God-Consciousness, or Presence, or similar, where they do achieve both lasting inner peace AND a feeling of real connection to something Universal like Universal Love.
> 
> I just think that is really, really hard to obtain, and many people spend their ENTIRE LIVES meditating and following gurus in an attempt to find these states, only to never find them.
> 
> It is definitely possible though - and if you look hard enough you can find personal accounts on the internet of people who have found these states.
> 
> cheers,
> 
> Christodenisto


LoLol anotha bitch told me and a friend with both was from Leumuria shit too LOLOLOLOL.

And byt he way na, the state these people have achieved is no god no nothing, checkout UG Krishnamurti he exposes everyone from modern day guru's to jesus buddha etc. He searched enlightenment with Jiddu Krishnamurti Ramana Maharsi etc etc and he exposed it all.
It's waste of time, it's basically the same as lobotomy, dont use ur brain for 40 years straihgt and ull be still inside, yeah, but everyone of these englitehned beings has come forth later to say reincarnation etc doesnt exist, like Osho who wrote 650 books , many which included his pastlives, he adimitte it was all a fraud.
LISTEN PEOPLE GROW THE FUCKUP, if you dont bleievei n santa claus u dont believe in God either, they are one and same, PRODUCT OF HUMAN WISHFUL AND IMAGINARY THINKING TO COPE WITH QUESTIONS AND FEARS. GET THE FUCK OVER IT


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## Guest

Angel_Ariel said:


> Copeful said:
> 
> 
> 
> true true, life is a rollercoaster but without DPDR Pure O anxiety I cannot imagine life even being a challenge I'll go through like Mister Untouchable.
> I know this from experience...and other recovered DPDR people said same.
> So I cant wait to recover
> 
> And all of you will feel the same
> 
> 
> 
> What's the point in recovering from depersonalisation to embark on a life of ego?
Click to expand...

having fun? make meaning of your life?
Whats the point spending all ur life reading about fairytales n being used by big companies behind these "god" people? huh?
Sorry I grew up around 12, you'll come around


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## Cam

Copeful said:


> And byt he way na, the state these people have achieved is no god no nothing, checkout UG Krishnamurti he exposes everyone from modern day guru's to jesus buddha etc. He searched enlightenment with Jiddu Krishnamurti Ramana Maharsi etc etc and he exposed it all.
> It's waste of time, it's basically the same as lobotomy, dont use ur brain for 40 years straihgt and ull be still inside, yeah, but everyone of these englitehned beings has come forth later to say reincarnation etc doesnt exist, like Osho who wrote 650 books , many which included his pastlives, he adimitte it was all a fraud.
> LISTEN PEOPLE GROW THE flower*, if you dont bleievei n santa claus u dont believe in God either, they are one and same, PRODUCT OF HUMAN WISHFUL AND IMAGINARY THINKING TO COPE WITH QUESTIONS AND FEARS. GET THE flower* OVER IT


You must be a real blast at parties Copeful LOL
I think you are being a bit too aggressive in the way you try and get your message out. I get this picture of a guy just screaming at the computer waving his hands in the air when I read your post's. Try and calm down a bit LOL


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## Guest

Luckily my country is majorly atheists, like 90% so, we have moved on from kindergarden so we never discuss religion except make fun of it 

Calm down, no problem, point being STOP POSTING SHIT.

Aiyyo, if you go down on your knees, chop of your own dick, and sacriefiece it for the spaghetti monster ull be saved. GO ON TRUST ME, IT SAYS SO IN THE BIBLE SO IT MUST BE TRUE, PEOPLE HAS EXPERIENCED IT FRST HAND


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## Cam

MentallyIll AKA Copeful said:


> Luckily my country is majorly atheists, like 90% so, we have moved on from kindergarden so we never discuss religion except make fun of it
> 
> Calm down, no problem, point being STOP POSTING SHIT.
> 
> Aiyyo, if you go down on your knees, chop of your own dick, and sacriefiece it for the spaghetti monster ull be saved. GO ON TRUST ME, IT SAYS SO IN THE BIBLE SO IT MUST BE TRUE, PEOPLE HAS EXPERIENCED IT FRST HAND


I didn't say I was religious did I :?: 
Your finishing statement was quite interesting " Cut off your own dick " Look, there is no need to project your angst on to me, if you want to be a women that's fine, I am sure everyone here will accept you no matter what your preference is. It's OK


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## christodenisto2

I am finding this post hilarious!!!

:lol: 8) :lol:

I've not laughed this much in ages.

But seriously, Copeful and Mentally Ill, there is a guy in America called Ram Das, that did go to India and had way out spiritual experiences that he couldn't understand either. If you listen to his life story on audio CD you might be amazed at what he has actually experienced.

And seriously Copeful, I did have past lives in Atlantis. I was one of the special spiritual beings assigned to protect the egg of Lemuria as the energy source for Atlantis!!! By the way the egg broke, and I thought it was my fault. 

I knew I was special but I didn't realise how special!

lol,

Christodenisto


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## Guest

So.......... MentallyIll, I am guessing you don't think inner peace is possible.
"cut off your own dick"............OMFG :lol:


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## Guest

I wouldnt chop of my dick if my life dependant on it, we are biological organisms made to survive and reproduce deal with it.
If you dare to open up some books and figure out for yourself instead of feeding off your FANTASY and WISHFUL thinking you' figure out this too, so who's the one projecting insecurities on this delusionalpartyselfhelp forum? you guys are NONSTOP CONSTANTLY talking about bullshit and I as a responsible person tries to stop it, CAUSE THIS IS MENTAL HEALTH DISCUSSION NOT "YO WHO HAD THE MOST CRAZY HALLUCINATION/DELUSION?"

Funny you should mention Ram Das, read a lot about him in my spiritual investigation period.
People often use him as a reference because of his PhD and work at Harvard, seemsl ike people think that makes what comes out of his mouth any more true.
NATURE IS NATURE. It doesnt change after our wishes, if it did (if Law of Attraction) was real, the earth would be flat, simple as that, debunked in 1 setence

You got to fuckn realize, these people are advocating hallucinogens as aw ay to "higher awareness" and that you can a chieve the same DELUSIONAL TEMPORARILY PSYCHOTIC mind states by severe and chronic meditation.
saying this is supernatural is like saying a illusionist who FOOLED you preformed REAL magic.
You all got critical skills of 5 year olds and is more close minded than cops.

I guess ya'll support Sathya Sai Baba also, just because he talks some old mythology it's ok for him to rape 10year old kids, it's a nice world order your supporting
Fortunately though science will wipe out most spiritual faith in a 100 years and those who remain faithful will get the proper treatment in the looney bin where they belong.

One day...=\

Further... the thing is, what you guys are "searching for" is DP DR x 1000, which happens if you sit still for 10 000 plus hours meditating it fucks up your brain and mind chemically and makes u like those who's woken up from a coma who just a few neurons left is active.
U get one life so why waste it trying to die alive instead of just waiting for death if u SO not want to live?

Do I believe in INNER PEACE? Inner peace can be so much, you feel inner peace at the end of the day when work is done, at vacation, out in nature, with friends, when your sleeping, when inlove.
Do I want permanent deadnesss(peace) inside? NO life got to much to offer to be a brainless person.

realize these myths started 10 thousand years ago before we even mae good stone weapons, you HONESTLY think they knew more about "LIFE/REALITY" than we do now? Did I mention they did believe rivers was gods etc?
WHEN IS THE LIGHT BULP GOIN OFF IN YOUR HEADS?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

ironic how you all speak of "AWAKENING" when your in a coma


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## christodenisto2

So Copeful,

tell me what you think about Ram Dass.
He claims to have had a full on kundalini awakening.
He claims to experience Oneness and Universal Love.

do you think he is delusional or something?


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## Guest

Yeah, Ive had similar experience.

You can also have them on LSD and with magnets skeptic scientist invented and calle the "GOD HELMET".
It's all biologic changes in the brain


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## Pablo

Copeful you obviously believe in scientific rationalism is the only viable way of approaching the world and that you should base everything on objective truth (most people I know would agree with you), but cant you see that most of the anger and emotional outbursts in your posts arent in the slightest bit rational or objective? do you not see the irony in that?
Can you not see that applying scientific rationalism to every aspect of your life especially your emotional/psychological aspect is sickness because your emotional life is not rational in the slightest.
If you go to see a decent psychotherapist the first thing they will try to do is make you less rational in regards to your inner life.


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## DreamLife

> If you dare to open up some books and figure out for yourself instead of feeding off your FANTASY and WISHFUL thinking you' figure out this too, so who's the one projecting insecurities on this delusionalpartyselfhelp forum? you guys are NONSTOP CONSTANTLY talking about bullshit and I as a responsible person tries to stop it, CAUSE THIS IS MENTAL HEALTH DISCUSSION NOT "YO WHO HAD THE MOST CRAZY HALLUCINATION/DELUSION?"


There's nothing rational or responsible about the way you speak and think, Copeful/MentallyIll. It's crazier than anything I've thought of during my "delusions" in my "fantasy world," as you call it. At least I've moved on to human decency, which apparently they don't practice in your country.

It's okay to have your strongly-held beliefs, but it's pretty ridiculous for you to come to a mental health forum and talk shit to every single person who posts something. You're really missing the point of this web site, and of life in general.

And you think it's okay to go around calling people delusional and psychotic, but if anyone was to say anything like that to you, you'd freak out. I've heard you do that before when someone mentioned that they thought you might be schizophrenic. Honestly, I don't blame them.


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## Guest

Angel_Ariel said:


> It's a bit of a tongue in the cheek question...but I wanted to see if many people on here believe that they can be "saved" and find heaven on earth, ie peace of mind and tranquility of spirit.


I've pretty much skimmed the thread, and it does get a tad nasty hither and thither, but my two cents or pence?

1. I don't think someone with a mental illness (an I believe I have GAD, DP/DR, and depression, and believe it is a medical disorder) has an easy time finding "Peace of Mind." I know some who have come to "acceptance" and some who have indeed found their "Faith", be it any religion, or personal faith as strength.

2. I'd say "peace of mind" is living in the moment -- and that is Buddhist Mindfulness (plain and simple -- nothing more nothing less and it is NOT DP/DR) -- *living in the present, not looking back with regret, not looking forward with fear, but accepting the present moment.*

One can be of an organized religion to find this, one can have a spiritual faith to find this, or one can find this inside one's self. I use the Buddhist method -- Zen, simple (Thich Nhat Hahn) -- and it is extremely difficult for me. It takes work.

3. I know a lot of mentally healthy people with or without any spiritual connections to have "peace of mind." They overall enjoy their lives, their families, their work. I KNOW such people, and they do not understand my fears, my anxiety, not to mention DP/DR. My best friends make every effort. But to say these people are delusional is ... well ... I say it's mental health.

ALL people have difficult times. I have a girlfriend whose brother was killed in an auto accident last year, her father and mother are elderly and very ill, she is dealing with one son in uni and a daughter leaving for uni next year. She is as she is, one minute at a time. She is occupied, active and she deals with all the blows life throws at her with the knowledge that -- this IS life.

4. The Buddhist saying (and I do not apply this to illness, but to torturing ourselves with "what ifs, would have, should have", etc.) is "Life is Pain, but we choose to Suffer. *Again I am NOT saying that we choose to be mentally ill or physically ill - NO, NO, NO. But we can do the best we can with each moment. And trying, even the smallest thing, to find some peace of mind, is all that counts, nothing more.*

5. I forgot who said that great expectations for one's self are a hindrance to peace of mind. I can agree with that. I always have felt, since I was a tiny girl, that I had to be "the best." But this came from my family and my community which had high expectations for all of my peers. But most of my peers took it in stride. They didn't measure themselves against everyone else.

Because I had severe anxiety and DP/DR I did.

6. I find peace of mind when I am with someone who understands me unconditionally. And there are only about 3 people in this world who do. Also, I am in my late 40s. When you get older, peace of mind is a tougher nut. But my 87 year old mother in law is relatively laid back about things.

*One day at a time, no matter what takes you there. It can be personal FAITH (which is different from organized religion). One may partake in religion or ritual to help reinforce that, or to celebrate that faith.*

7. Whoever said his/her country was 90% atheist is living in a country on another planet. Your country doesn't fit existing statistics. About 16% of the world's population is atheist, secular humanist, yada. Christianity and Islam are the biggest organized religions, and their is no country in the world that does not have some form of organized religion. And many who don't attend church/mosque/temple, etc. may still have personal faith.

This seems like a Religious Debate topic, yet not. But it shouldn't be.

I'll be honest, I don' have peace of mind, but I'm trying to find it, and it takes a lot of work. Some do, some don't. Mental illness makes finding peace of mind very difficult.

Cheers,
D


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## Guest

Also, the concept "saved" would generally indicate, saved by Jesus Christ. This ignores all other religions on earth. It seems the subject line indeed should be "have you/can you find peace of mind?"


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## CECIL

Good to hear from you Rozanne - you really have changed a lot since I first read your posts on this forum, so keep up the good work! 

As for the initial question, "saved" isn't the right word, but I'm guessing that's why you said its tongue in cheek 

I agree with what Dreamer said (No way! ) and also what Dreamlife said:

You can definately achieve peace of mind. Similar to what the two mentioned above said, recently I've been learning that peace of mind doesn't mean that there will be no drama and hardship in your life, its more to do with how you deal with it.

You can choose to brood on things and let them consume you like I have so often in my past, or you can choose a course of action and implement it. You'll never, ever be put in a situation you can't deal with. We always have the tools to deal with whatever situation it is we are facing. Any hesitation is just fear, but we all have an internal compass that points us in the right direction. Our intuition will always make sure we make the right decision in the moment. The trick is to make sure that we are in tune with ourselves and our intuition - that we've dusted off the cobwebs on our compass, so to speak.

I think peace of mind comes when, like Dreamer and Dreamlife said, you are able to face those challenges and move through them. Learn from the past but don't regret it. Look forward to the future but don't fear it.

I've been realising the value in being able to just sit back and relax, taking each moment as it comes, which has been quite helpful of late


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## Guest

CECIL said:


> I think peace of mind comes when ... you are able to face those challenges and move through them. Learn from the past but don't regret it. Look forward to the future but don't fear it.


Yes, I am :shock: -- we agree on something.

Here's the thing. Both healthy people and unhealthy people can find "peace of mind." It is my contention that healthy people can find this easier, but it doesn't mean they ever do.

Also, another thought I had ... it has taken me years ... most of my life ... to discover what many of my peers discovered years ago. And the hardest thing for me personally, was a home situation where I was not loved.

For me at least, I truly believe this would have helped. My cousin who is bipolar/schizoaffective has a better attitude than I do about life. He is about 13 years younger than I am. He's been hospitalized at least 3 times.

But, his "acceptance" is not always happiness. He has given up on finding a girlfriend. He is on disability. He isn't sure what will happen to him when his mother dies (my first cousin who is ill). But he isn't dwelling on this stuff. He works sometimes (under the table) when he can. The main thing is he gets "peace of mind" by driving. He likes to drive long distances to beautiful places. Literally this is a form of meditation for him. He wouldn't call it that, but it sounds like it to me.

For him it is distraction from paranoid thoughts, he really is able to live in the moment FAR better than I am.

It takes many things to have peace of mind. If I won the lottery, I'd have a sense of financial security. I don't think I would have peace of mind. I still dwell on regret and loss, what I "could have been", and forget any good I HAVE contributed, things I've accomplished.

It sounds corny, but this "peace of mind" is in a sense a healthy "loving of one's self" -- ACCEPTING one's self. I can say this about my healthy friends as well as those who are mentally ill.

Cheers,
D


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## Guest

Oh, I would be a tad happier if I had purchased Google stock in 1999. I believe it is now $700/share. I read an article about a woman who got a job as a masseuse at Google in 1999 (an office in Texas?). Aside from salary and benefits she received some stock in Google as well. They were worth very little and she figured, whateva'.

Well, today she's a millionaire. LOL.

But what is more important, is in the past, I would say, how can one only aspire to being nothing more than a masseuse sp?! It is the stupidest thing to think that way. What I didn't see was that a family (for me) is what mattered most. I didn't "get it" and really couldn't work towards that goal.

And I'd give a million bucks I don't have for a sibling, an aunt, any relative. Save a few cousins I'm really not close to, I have no family. I can dwell on that and suffer, or I have to accept that pain. The acceptance that I can't change those things is peace of mind. Letting it go.

On the other hand, it helps with my anxiety -- sometimes -- "letting go", but not always -- DP/DR especially. Trying, working at this can get very exhausting.

But it's ... one, step, at a time. And I understand why some people give up. Healthy or not healthy.


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## christodenisto2

Geez Dreamer,

I really got a lot out of your last couple of posts.

A few years ago, I rejected every career because I didn't think any of them were special enough or exciting enough for me.
I couldnt understand how my friends could be satisfied with enjoying their lives as they were, at that time. 
But now my friends are successful, still enjoying their lives one day at a time, whereas I am unemployed, and constantly worried I am missing out on 'life'.

I am still trying to work out how to live happier.

It has something to do with stopping the constant comparisons with other people and stopping my focus on getting my dream life, accepting that I just cant control my reality and have to learn to accept what I have.

Gee it is so hard though, especially with a mental health issue (mine is numbness).

I think I will read your posts again!


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## Guest

christodenisto (I had to cut and paste that, lol),

Thank you.

What hurts me is for instance I always had a very clear goal. There is no time in my life, EVER, that I didn't want to be part of the entertainment industry. But even as a little girl I felt that I had to be "the top", win an Oscar, be a famous singer, etc.

I was a good singer, actress and won awards for this through college ... my whole life since a child. I have a BA and an MA. I won an internship to work on a top Hollywood TV series.

When I was there I felt so DP/DR I could barely function, but I kept pushing and pushing. Perfection or nothing. It hasn't been until just recently again... that I realize, Dear GOD, there were so many options WITHIN the entertainment industry.

I had an offer to be an apprentice editor, I could have been a professor of film/theatre, etc. I could have been a high school teacher. I could have worked say in adding scores to films. I even had an opportunity to audition for tiny parts on some of our shows. My DP/DR was so terrible then ... I lost those chances. I turned down exactly what I wanted to do.

I'm so angry that I didn't see these "smaller" jobs were making people happy, AND they had families and friends and weren't sweating the small stuff. I could have worked in properties for instance. I had a hoot of a time with the guys doing that. I did continuity basically which involved working with a lot of departments.

I had it all on a silver platter, but severe anxiety and this freakin' DP/DR (that drilled itself into my head long, long ago), kept me from ENJOYING it. From just being. This is my great pain I've realized now.

One thing I have done, is REALLY ask myself what makes me happy. Sometimes all it is is being with a close friend. Period.

I'm copying all of this for my writing. I am trying to write about my silly life. But I'm also saying.... it may never get published. And that is OK. I'm still battling with things like that.

It is OK to be who you are -- and also to treat others with the same respect.

I get angry here, as all I want is to be understood. I see others don't give a hoot what others think about them. For some, I see that as very healthy.

That .... as long as one is decent to others ... is peace of mind.
Tired. Time for bed.
This IS a good thread.
D


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## Guest

*"To fill the hour - that is happiness; 
to fill the hour and leave no crevice for a repentance or an approval." 
- Ralph Waldo Emerson - *

This is my new signature. I don't think I should change it. This is peace of mind. This is the key to enlightenment. It is SO simple, and for many of us, the most difficult thing to achieve.

Also, here is great Buddhist thought from Thich Nhat Hahn, Vietnamese Zen Buddhist:

*"I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but it is my chief duty to accomplish small tasks as if they were great and noble. We have to learn to live happily in the present moment, to touch the peace and joy that are available now."*

That is all Buddhist enlightenment is all about. This is not DP/DR. DP/DR is Hell and it keeps us from achieving this complete peace of mind.


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## christodenisto2

"to leave no crevice for repentance or approval".

Perhaps I am little slow on the uptake. What do you think this part of the statement means, Dreamer?

thanks,

christodenisto


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## christodenisto2

hey Dreamer and all,

I just thought I would add something here.
I hope it is relevant.

I have spent years trying to find happiness by trying to satisfy my manic desires and wild dreams and ideals. I spent several years in depression thinking my life was not exciting enough, that I was not accomplishing enough, that I was not experiencing enough Love or belonging, and comparing myself to those I thought had it all.

Then I moved on to thinking that a Real life, a Valuable life, would be one in which I experienced spiritual states - Oneness with God, a feeling of Universal Love, compassion for all humanity. etc. But more recently I have begun to doubt whether anyone ever gets to experience that - I have never met a single person who has achieved profound peace, bliss or spiritual love. And almost everyone in the new age movement that I have met has the same desires, concerns and daily life dramas than everyone else.

So how does one obtain real happiness? Or real spirituality?
It seems to me that the happy people I know are not blissing out on universal love - they are usually in the same neutral state that I am in.

But what they do have is a cheerful disposition, generally positive attitude, a career they get some enjoyment out of and a loving family life.

Yesterday while doing some research on the internet, I came across something that Christopher Reeve said back in 2002. Interestingly, he has dabbled in transcendental meditation, scientology and Muktananda.

About spirituality, Reeve said 
"Gradually I have come to believe that spirituality is found in the way we live our daily lives. It means spending time thinking about others"

I find that to be quite profound. Maybe this mundane, neutralness, is the only thing one ever gets to have (apart from occasional emotional highs.. and lows) - in which case maybe the best thing to do is just to get on with it and be a kind person.

I just can't work it out.


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## Guest

christodenisto2 said:


> "to leave no crevice for repentance or approval".
> 
> Perhaps I am little slow on the uptake. What do you think this part of the statement means, Dreamer?
> 
> thanks,
> 
> christodenisto


OK, all it means is to live in the present:

"To fill the hour - that is happiness; 
to fill the hour..."
and leave no crevice for a repentance or an approval."

Happiness is finding just one hour and leave no instance (not even a tiny sliver of an instant - even a tiny crevice) for seeking forgiveness or seeking someone's approval. Don't even allow these things (repentence and approval) enter your thoughts. Then you find happiness/peace of mind.

In other words happiness is what we are talking about here, in all of these posts, living in the moment allowing not even a tiny bit of regret or looking to be accepted. We must accept ourselves ...

not worrying about future, and not dwelling on past failures, etc.

Man, I took an anticongestant and I can't sleep to save my life. Having tea and trying to sleep!


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## Guest

I know i'm not the one you asked but I'll try to help you either way before i leave....

I've noticed a common factor in individuals with DPDR ADD Depression and OCD.
We are highly intelligent and creative, maybe a little bit over the average man.
We are wanting more out of life than just the 9 to 5 job, get drunk fuck someone without a condom, get a kid, then die.
We want something special, we are dreamers....

The blissful state you are talkinga bout do not exist, the mind would burn out if it were to produce a 24/7 state of bliss. This is a fact.
Think about it, even if biotechnology manage to eliminate the things in our atonomy that causes pain/stress/sadness/hate in the future, would you really take it away?
To me you need hate to know love, you need sadness to know happiness, you need stress to feel relief, you need pain to feel pleasure
Not only that, but there's a reason for these emotions, check out evolutionary psychology and it'll all make sense to you.
We learn from these experiences, their painful but worth a lot.

A wise person who suffered called Curedone here whom I spent a lot of time chatting with and sharing my suffering with(real supportive guy) was just as bad as me, totally deluded, suicidal, lost all hope.
Miracolously after 6-7 years he managed to cure himself of this horrible illness and now he's superman on red kryptonite

Remember when you were a kid? Playing with whatever toys you had could make you happy as hell(errr heaven?:S) or exploring new places, always emotions in you.
Why was this? IT WAS NEW. It was exciting, what happened a long the way?
We started day dreaming a lot, expectations from parents, friends, media, teachers, authorities etc. started creeping up on us.
Then when we figured out we didn't really have achieved that much and we went through a rough period of losing something dear and near we broke down(atleast mycase, everyone's individual).

Let me give you a wise quote I came up with during a sleepless night

"it's ok to have dreams, but if your living in your dreams, you will never be LIVING your dreams"

Take a minute to think about that quote

Look at Einstein, didn't believe in God, Charles Darwin, Nietzche, Richard Dawkins all of these people lived happy and were scientist dedicated to truth, atheists, but happy humanists.

I'm not saying "GO FOR SCIENCE", science can be boring complicated and stressing.
if art is what you prefer go for art, whatever gives you the feeling inside "This gives me something" GO FOR IT...

You are a unique conscious living human. Unique DNA, Unique life experiences, you need to find your unique happiness.

While others talk about becoming God, I settle for trying to fufill my dreams and get a girl I can love more than anything and die for if needed. Have children. To me thats enough...

To give you a good story I read on a spiritual forum awhile ago (my memory is a lil sturred up so if it's not 100% correct sorry)

2 men was walking on a road pondering the meaning of life, when they came to a cross road, one sign said "spiritual life" the other said "material life". They decided to split up, one went for the spiritual life, and one for the material life. they decided to meet up at the same spot in 20 years from that day.
the spiritual man came to a library filled with spiritual ancient sacred texts and started studying meditating all day 24/7.
the materialistic guy went to a city, got a company many kids, money and started helping out people in the street and was a busy man who helped many and lived a happy life.

After the 20 years had passed the friends met up at the spot again and shared their experiences.
The spiritual guy said: "it's been hard work but finally this morning I experienced selflessness, selfrealization that spirituality is talking about, it took me 20 years but I made it"

the materialistic guy said "wow, what you talking about? i havent thought of myself in 20 years"...

Hope you got the point\moral of the story


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## Guest

You don't understand what we are discussing.


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## Guest

I do think the topic heading should be changed to "Have you found peace of mind?" or something like that.


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## Guest

"Ok" I guess I'm just a ignorant 18 year old.
It's ok... I do not think neither one of you even know what you are talking about...

As for complete peace of mind? Forget it... 
Being dead inside is what you are now... really think thats the meaning of life?


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## DreamLife

Copeful wrote:


> After the 20 years had passed the friends met up at the spot again and shared their experiences.
> The spiritual guy said: "it's been hard work but finally this morning I experienced selflessness, selfrealization that spirituality is talking about, it took me 20 years but I made it"
> 
> the materialistic guy said "wow, what you talking about? i havent thought of myself in 20 years"...


Copeful, this man didn't live a material life at all! Can't you see that??? He may have chosen the material life but he ended up living a spiritual one. What you don't seem to understand is that spirituality IS NOT religion! This man lived a spiritual life through others, through helping people, not through going to church.

Einstein believed in his scientific version of God. And who knows if Richard Dawkins is happy? Did you ask him? You haven't got a clue! All you can do is observe these people from the outside and determine that they were happy, but you don't know what goes on inside of them. That's the only thing that matters--you can have it all together on the outside and be dying inside (I've been there).

I hope you find peace, whatever form that may take for you.


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## Guest

Your so stupid I wanna kick you the nuts.

Einstein didnt believe in "scientific god" there is no such thing as a SCIENTIFIC THING. Jesus, science is a approach method to learn and prove shit in reality.

he called the NATURAL laws of the universe God", thats why he said "GOD DOES NOT PLAY DICE WITH THE UNIVERSE".
He was a poetic humanist, he used God has a metaphor as I use soul as metaphor for my brain, material brain.

No I do not know Richard Dawkins I have to take his word for it but from his position I can see him very happy.
Many top seller books, loads of cash, will be remembered as a true fighter for truth when th rest of humanity gives up their fantasies.
I read/seen ALL his interviews, and this guy is a man of truth, he does not fuck around and lie and when people ask him "so how can you have meaning in life without a god" it's like he cannot even take the question seriously.
he got meaning in life.

was Einstein deperssed? except for when WW2 was going and or he had some serious problems with his science theories, he seemedl ike the most happy man I'ev seen.

And no, the material life, was a material PERSONAL life, DO NOT BRING IN THE WORD SPIRITUALITY just because u cant cope with reality u fkcn retarded stupid idiot


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## comfortably numb

Just because someone seems happy on the outside does not make them happy. I knew a guy quite well who seemed very happy and the next time i saw him was when he was in a coffin after he had taken his own life.

As for people with loads of money being happy well it's not like anyone with lot's of cash ever offed themselves now did they?

As for the truth it's rather subjective. There are very few absolutes out there even alot of different forms of science are not complete absolutes. It's constantly changing and evolving everyday.

And no im not a very spiritual person at all by the way. I don't believe in what most organized religion teaches and especially not what some members of said religions try and impose on people. Not that spirituality has shag all to do with religion in most cases. But i respect these peoples views on religion as long as they don't try and impose their views on me.

You remind me alot of the religious fanatics the people who won't face up to your truth. You both try and impose your views on everyone else and your as belligerant as the worst of them.



> whatever gives you the feeling inside "This gives me something" GO FOR IT...


 That much we atleast agree upon.


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## Guest

No, gravity = everyone experience = truth
Objective reality = everyone live in, otherwise we wouldnt be here = truth
1+1 = 2 = truth
God doesn't exist even if u hallucinate him = true for everyone, though everyone do not realize this = truth

As for morals, opinions, preferences, beliefs, personal things = subjective. Yes.

I face truth. the objective truth.
Its not like im here saiyng "NO THAT MOVIE IS THE BEST YOU ARE WRONG", cause preferences is ALL subjective. We see the same movie(objective) but our subjecitve experience and opinions on it, will remain subjective.

if you do not agree with this, call ur mental hospital immediately


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## DreamLife

Copeful said:


> Your so stupid I wanna kick you the nuts.


I'm a fucking woman. Don't disrespect me like that. Do you have a conscience at all? You're a waste of my time and everyone else's on this forum who has put their time in trying to help you.


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## Pablo

There are no scientists who are really happy, none that I have ever met anyway and I have met hundreds, many like Dawkins are very confident in themselves and have very strong egos but they dont radiate peace or happiness, just read 'The God Delusion' it is full of anger. Most scientists are somewhat obsessed with work and are definately affected by anxiety.
Whereas I have met some 'spiritual' people who are so at peace with themselves that they flow with compassion, not many mind you and there are many spiritual cronies and fakes but I have at least met a few who have found peace and they found it by embracing who they are guided by spiritual paths and dedicate their lives to helping and healing other people.

Being spiritual doesnt mean anything supernatural, most of it is just psychological advice


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## Pablo

Copeful said:


> No, gravity = everyone experience = truth
> Objective reality = everyone live in, otherwise we wouldnt be here = truth
> 1+1 = 2 = truth
> God doesn't exist even if u hallucinate him = true for everyone, though everyone do not realize this = truth
> 
> As for morals, opinions, preferences, beliefs, personal things = subjective. Yes.
> 
> I face truth. the objective truth.
> Its not like im here saiyng "NO THAT MOVIE IS THE BEST YOU ARE WRONG", cause preferences is ALL subjective. We see the same movie(objective) but our subjecitve experience and opinions on it, will remain subjective.
> 
> if you do not agree with this, call ur mental hospital immediately


Yes you face the truth when it comes to things like maths, physics and physical actions, you face objective truths when you are dealing with these things, but when it comes to just about everything that matters ie personal relationships, your health, understanding yourself and other people, your happiness, it is all subjective and everybody lives in a different reality.

Everybody lives in their own reality because the impact of everything you perceive in life is affected by all sorts of variables such as previous experiences, expectations and the emotional mood you are in, all of which affects the meaning we derive from what we have perceived. For example two people can look at a piece of art and derive completely different impressions, whereas the objective reality is that both people saw the same piece of art, but if you now say this is the only aspect of the reality of the situation that matters then you are living in 2D flatland reality and you are basically saying that the personal reaction aspect of reality is not as valid or as real as the objective, which is just a censorship of what is actually going on, you are saying that the personal reaction is not as important as the event, you are saying your emotions are not as real or as valid as your analytical mind, in other words you are living in DP hell.

Like I said living through your mind in this way is good if you are doing a maths problem or writing an essay but when in comes to things that really matter like dealing with people and dealing with your own inner states then you cant only give respect to your objective analytical rational mind you have to give as much respect to your subjective emotional body, which is often wiser than the mind anyway, and if you are listening to your subjective emotional side then you are living in your own reality and so is everybody else who is doing the same.


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## Rozanne

DreamLife said:


> Copeful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your so stupid I wanna kick you the nuts.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a flower* woman. Don't disrespect me like that. Do you have a conscience at all? You're a waste of my time and everyone else's on this forum who has put their time in trying to help you.
Click to expand...

Dreamlife, I can't believe you can say that. He didn't make you give anything to him, just because you want to make him well, you devalue him like that saying he is barely worth his space here. That isn't true. He's contributing, even if you don't buy what he says. I hate it when people blame people for being unhappy.


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## Guest

Angel_Ariel said:


> DreamLife said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Copeful said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your so stupid I wanna kick you the nuts.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a flower* woman. Don't disrespect me like that. Do you have a conscience at all? You're a waste of my time and everyone else's on this forum who has put their time in trying to help you.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Dreamlife, I can't believe you can say that. He didn't make you give anything to him, just because you want to make him well, you devalue him like that saying he is barely worth his space here. That isn't true. He's contributing, even if you don't buy what he says. I hate it when people blame people for being unhappy.
Click to expand...

Yeah I?ll have to agree with Angel Pants here, how dare you speak to Copeful when he?s been nothing but a tw*t and stated he?d kick you in the balls even though you?re female?! How could you even ?think? about devaluing him like that when he has being doing it to every one else?! Did you think that giving him a taste of his own meds would help this clown relate to how stooped he is? I mean, he put so much time and effect in this thread: ?How to recover? : http://www.dpselfhelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=13297 he can act how ever he likes now! That?s called ?Contributing?! I hate it when people blame me for making them unhappy! =*(.

P.S. I?m a tw*t too and I can handle that fact, I can sympathize and empathize when I want/need too, although I?ve been drained for quite a while now. I?m no better or worse then any one else. *Looks at his gold rind* kiss it .


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## DreamLife

Angel_Ariel said:


> Dreamlife, I can't believe you can say that. He didn't make you give anything to him, just because you want to make him well, you devalue him like that saying he is barely worth his space here. That isn't true. He's contributing, even if you don't buy what he says. I hate it when people blame people for being unhappy.


"u fkcn retarded stupid idiot"

That's all I have to say. (these aren't my words, by the way--they were directed at me)


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## Guest

Owned  :!: :lol:

I love it when people highlight quotes... lol, nice one DreamLife.


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## Rozanne

Ok ok....

I agree there's too much violence around here especially over whether God exists or not.

I don't condone violence....

This whole situation reminds me of Eric who was being verbally abusive a lot of the time as well. I just thought it was obvious that Copeful has a chip on his shoulder and that's the main reason he acts out.....

Just thought it was obvious to avoid reacting to it.


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## Cam

> I don't condone violence....


 :shock:


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## sunyata samsara

Rozanne said:


> Hi,
> 
> Sorry to ask again, but my question was whether people here believe that ultimate peace is possible for the human mind.
> 
> I believe peace is possible. What you have got to keep in mind is that peace and enlightenment are possible. They are actually real. Masters aren't talking about something intangible but real experiences of the mind.


yes. I think it takes a life devoted to meditation though.


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