# Rant



## peachy

I'm sick of people telling me that I'm "finding myself" or "figuring out who I am". Okay, shut up. I'm not twelve and forming my personality. I'm 26 and have depersonalization disorder. I'm also not confused. I know very well what I'm doing. Am I struggling? Yes, most definitely. Do I lack self worth? No, absolutely not. I just had a break down of self. Which is also different from a breakdown of personality. I am still a stable person when depersonalization hits. I just can't feel it the same way other people can. But don't belittle me and insult me by saying that I'm "finding myself". Is there anyone else that feels like when you try to describe dp to people, it completely misses the mark? It's either "oh yeah! I get that too all the time". Or it's "it just takes some time to figure out who you are as a person". Shut. Up. Unless you wake up in the morning and look down at your limbs and wonder how they belong to your body or you look in the mirror and your image looks like a stranger, don't try to talk to me about this.

Things that depersonalization is not:

-Anxiety

-Depression

-Confusion

-Lack of identity. (It's a dissociative break in identity, which is much different from just a lack of understanding of who you are as a person)

Do ya'll just wanna nominate each other for most misunderstood population of people? I am sick of needing metaphors to describe my state of being and still have it fall short. Do I keep trying to educate or give up?


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## Sa-lB

I can understand your frustration but you need to understand that because these people haven't been through what you're going through they aren't going get it, fully.

If I think back to who I was before all of this and someone had told me about their struggles with dp, I probably would have thought they were fucking crazy.

If these people mean a lot to you then maybe ask them to educate themselves on what you're going through? if they don't mean a lot to you then does it really matter what they think?


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## Guest

It's very difficult to educate those who refuse to be educated, but certainly do not give up.


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## Surfingisfun001

Well said Peach woman.

I don't try to explain it anymore.

For the reasons that people cannot understand in the same way that a blind person can't understand sight and also I don't like the stigma attached to being "mentally ill".

I rather just form subselves and talk to myself. They understand.


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## eddy1886

I call them the "Pull your socks up" people...They are those people who actually dont believe mental ill health is actually real and that your just having a bad day or few hours and you will be fine in a little while.....They are so ignorant to the suffering a person with mental ill health goes through i just wanna punch them through a wall...

It must be wonderful to go through life having not suffered with sadness or anxiety or pain so as not to have the slightest bit of empathy towards someone who does suffer on a constant basis....These people are self centered to the core! They care about nothing but themselves...The problem with people like us is we care to much about others! Chalk and cheese!


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## Guest

I know excatly what you mean...

It's hard when no one else understands...when people tell you to get over it or that you can fight through it..

They'll never get it they just give you that strange look and forget about it two seconds later..


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## Mira

This has been so unbearably frustrating fir me. People around me forget that I have dp/dr unless Im in the middle of a panic attack in front of their faces and panic attacks (hyperventalating, crying, overwhelm of anxiety) have NOTHING on full blown disociative attacks which are basically invisible. I have no will to try and describe it anymore. And I am in a more or less "recovery" state right now, I've been struggling with ut for 7ish years. I have to CONSTANTLY fight to be taken seriously-- no, Im not just *tired* when my sleep gets fucked up. Its like if Im not constantly giving some sort of "proof" (like having panic attacks, which is about the only time people consider my needs to be legitimate) if Im not proving it over and over, if I havent proven it recently enough, its like I've never had any disorder and my needs are exaggerations/ not legitimate. People need to be educated on how to support invisible/ mental illnesses because we collectively are REALLY, REALLY bad at it.

ALSO, while Im ranting, why does dp NEVER show up in mental health discussions?? (like, anywhere outside of this site). It is THE most common disociative disorder. Probably because of invisibility, but isn't that what all the anti-stigma campaigns are about??????


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## eddy1886

Well said Mira!


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## CharlieFreak

Yeah this one is tough, and I understand where you are coming from. An old member who has recovered once told me, "even the strongest and most developed personalities can get DP."


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## Dp123

Do you think that maybe this thing should be classed as something other than 'mental health'? I just really don't like the way that sounds. This thing is more like a neurological condition, in that it gives you physical symptoms like messing with your vision, and is totally out of your control.


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## Dp123

If it was classed in the same way as MS as a neurological condition that affects thousands of people, then maybe it would be taken more seriously and some serious funding given to finding out what the heck it is.


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## forestx5

Well, the brain issues are divided into two fundamental areas of expertise as in neurology and psychiatry. Unfortunately, patients don't get to do the dividing. How do you divide the brain from the mind? The way I see it, the mind and brain are related like electricity and magnetism. The are two manifestations of the same thing. The mind is the aura of the brain. But neurology deals with more physical issues of the brain and is perceived as a more legitimate science than psychiatry, which is based more on theory which makes no difference since it all comes down to "what pill seems to help more than it hurts". As for people not understanding dp/dr, the same can be said for major depression and other psychiatric illnesses. It is hard to explain the degree of suffering to someone who has only experienced normal variation of emotion or thought processes. It is best not to need the sympathy and understanding of others. I have had several treating psychiatrists over the course of my illness, and I doubt that any one of them could relate to my experience with mental illness on a level other than "I will treat you for depression, bipolar, schizophrenia et al".


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## Dp123

> Well, the brain issues are divided into two fundamental areas of expertise as in neurology and psychiatry. Unfortunately, patients don't get to do the dividing. How do you divide the brain from the mind?


Absolutely no offence meant here, but aren't we really talking about two different things?

There is Depersonalisation Disorder which is when people are abused emotionally or struggle to accept what is happening to them actually is (I guess something like sexual abuse would fall into that category) and so they disassociate from themselves. They become emotionally numb and 'feel' like they're not in their body. That is a pyschological issue and should be treated as such.

Then there are people who have had something basically go wrong in their brain through either an external chemical or extreme shock triggering some kind of messed up reaction in their brain. That is a neurological issue.

I would guess that people who have the 'disassociation disorder' (and have never used any drug or medication that could cause the neurological brain malfunction) don't have the visual symptoms, like the veil between them and the external world. It's more of an emotional sense of detachment.

Once again no offence meant to anybody.


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## Nayr_Enivel

Chemicals are chemicals, energy is energy, matter is matter

Semantics and scientifically unnecessary additions to fairly well-understood mechanics does much to contribute to the confusion of complex systems such as the mind/body, similar to how Freud argued against much of Carl Young's ideas as being redundant. Yes the complexity merits differentiating of differences that are pronounced enough to warrant their own unique identifiers, yet it does not merit creating identifiers that just generate redundant fluff overall.

The problem with all of this is that there is so much overlap and inter-connectivity between so many factors and systems that it is very difficult to be absolute in much of the cosmic experience. Without all known variables and factors to put into view, it's foolish to adhere to pure absolution on anything; with reason and empirical experimentation allowing for a pseudo-absolution.


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## Dp123

Yeah but let me put it this way: If somebody is yelling at you (say your boss at work) do you not do that thing were you just pretend you're listening but in reality you 'Disassociate' and start thinking about something else.

What I'm getting at is that I can tell how if someone was really emotionally abused that there's a chance they could be emotionally numb and depersonalized. Psychological help would I'm sure really help in this case.

However if someone's brain is shocked into a different state by chemicals or extreme panic. Then this is a neurological problem.

I just think that classifying it as such would bring more research into it, as then it wouldn't be dismissed as a psychology problem to be solved by talking it through.


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## Nayr_Enivel

The brain/mind are not forms of the same thing but interconnected as one large piece with partially-interchangeable components, to separate them for the sake of language and comprehension is not the way to go. Consciousness and "the psyche" at large are not as intangible and near-impossible to understand as even modern philosophers often portray. The entire field of psychology and even all social sciences need to be absorbed by their hard-science counterparts, qualitative research has no place other than for additional data in serious science or medicine and is perpetuated as a standalone mostly because of a lack of diagnostic methods and tools that can quantify these things so are thought of as per-cursors and/or co-existing scientific necessities before the technology becomes available.

It's not the right way to go about things at all, even though it could be argued that acting is more important than acting with wisdom in certain circumstances and sometimes it truly is; however in most cases there is more overall harm done when acting with woeful wisdom on a perceived urgency that would be objectively better off waiting for the wisdom to collect before action is taken, so as to minimize and maximize the outcome with greater aptitude.


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## mjones

Depersonlization is caused through ANXIETY for most the people here.

Many people are drug users...some not....but matter as fact is everyone experienced DP from a panic attack which is induced through bad trips, negative thoughts, and other issues.

Truth is I don't even experience DP at this moment, I've gone through a few days without any thing and the emotional feelings are now getting stronger in mean - I think that it's all about finding what can increase your emotions whether it'll be through anger, saddness, happiness or something. There has to be a triggering factor for one of your emotions which is what made DP a lot better for me like it's pretty much gone at this point. Only thing that stays even once you recover from DP is some questions of the feeling - I am me, I am in my body, like I'll never know how I am in real life since I am which isn't a negative thing nor a side effect of DP but it's just humane questions in general.

But truth is you need to become the better version of yourself, I think DP is not the stress factor here but instead depression that comes with it. It wasn't DP that got me down it was the depression caused through DP which lead me to some bad depression for a few weeks. I experienced TRUE DP after my panic attack for about 2 - 3 weeks and now I don't experience it anymore I honestly think I am fully recovered but the thing is.....that feeling is gone but in your head you still think it is there. That is the issue with most people.

Another thing is, most people who do have DP for over 3+ months is probably the following. 1. They are actually recovered but placebo makes them think they still have it 2. They are still smoking or doing some drugs or drinking 3. They actually have an extreme version of the disorder and genetics + history of mental illnesses played a roll but truth is it is usually number one I'm sure.

And I won't lie, the finding who you are thing is actually kind of relevant......DP was a way of finding who I really was and it truthfully made me beyond nice. I use to be a cocky piece of shit who was a gym rat, sports guy and just laughed at those below me. The beauty of life is that we are all UNIQUE, you don't know who I am I don't know who you are. That is the beauty in life....it's because you are YOU and the only one there with you 24/7 is YOU.

Another thing is we aren't Syrian refugees or the Afghans who are experiencing a shit storm. We all have great lives compared to others. I am blessed and DP had me thinking reality isn't real when it really struck me. But truth is it fades, and finishing this I believe I am recovered now but it doesn't mean I won't relapse who knows.

If you need anyone to talk to PM me. I am always willing to speak to those who need help. I got skype, AIM or whatever  I want to stay on this site since I'm a forum lover.....who doesn't love forums?


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## Mira

All mental illnesses are phsyical. All physical illnesses are psychological. Emotional trauma takes physical tolls on oud mind/body. Physical trauma causes psychological distress. People are extremely dismissive of emotional distress-- I can see how even in my own mind I want to focus on the more straightforward neorological symptoms like the way my brain is processesing sound and information right now is extremely fucked up rather than trying to explain the terror of this realm of alienation, because when I start talking about the latter I get responses like "ya I know what you mean sometimes I have existential crises" And I want to pull my eyes out in frustration (because my hair is already falling out because thats what these extreme "psychological states" are doing to my body--- I resent (to some extent) mental health campaigns which want to say "mental illness is real BECAUSE it is a physical illness" because yes it is extremely physical but my emotional trauma is not a less valid form of suffering. Its less easily quantifiable, and the pharma industry doesn't care for it much, but ya.. Fuck that. My disociative disorder is physical. My emotional trauma is real.


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## Dp123

Hey man,

Yeah it's weird why it stays with some people longer than others. The first time I got it it was through a weed panic attack thing, so I could think well maybe it's that people who have it chemically induced are giving their brain a much bigger anxiety shock than somebody who gets it through just stress alone, as the chemical thing is a kind of unnatural thing.

Thing is I really don't know how the heck me having a CT scan this time and having a panic attack worrying that it would bring it back, has actually brought it back. I've been suffering from it really badly now though 24/7 since the minute I stepped out of the scan back in January.

I'm really just mighty frustrated now, I just want it to go away again so I can actually enjoy my life rather than feeling like I'm just enduring it.


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## Disruption

yes youre right it sucks that we cant describe our situation ..i sometimes get really mad when my friends tell me its all in my head and shit...they just dont understand and cant imagine..no, dp/dr is something you can only imagine if you suffer from this yourself..its not something like a holyday trip which you describe to someone and he/she almost exactly knows what you mean..its like describing a kaleidoscope to blind man...



peachy said:


> -Anxiety
> 
> -Depression
> 
> -Confusion
> 
> -Lack of identity. (It's a dissociative break in identity, which is much different from just a lack of understanding of who you are as a person)


true...these things are not the dp/dr itself, they are only some of the results of dp/dr..its just what it leads to for most people.


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## kipsenpai

Explaining DPDR more or less just makes you sound crazy when you explain it to somebody who hasn't experienced it. And there's no real purpose in educating or explaining it to random people, because it almost always misses the mark if you don't have a good way to word it. I've talked about it personally with 5 people at most over the past 3 years, and I couldn't even get the dart on the scoreboard with 2 of them. I'd rather have somebody misunderstand me than to have them feel like I do anyways. No point in getting mad about it even though you labeled rant. But I'm on board with you about the "yeah bro, I know exactly what you mean, I have that too", one of my friends did that and made me salty as fuck, because it's not hard to see that they have no idea what they're talking about or they're just dumb in general. It's a shame though that DPDR is so underrepresented. Also kind of annoyed by how my friends disregard or forget about how I feel if I'm not talking about it or being depressed and holing myself up inside for days on end. Because of course I only feel disconnected or like I'm taking acid when I'm sad. cricri

+ people that even use the phrase "finding yourself" are probably the types you shouldn't bother talking to about anything important.


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## Chicane

Yeah, this is really frustrating. I've heard it all, from "you're achieving a higher level of consciousness" to "you're experiencing a lifestyle crisis and need to change your ways." I'm tired of people patronizing me about this disorder. Funny too how those who have never experienced anything like this are the ones with the most advice. In my case it's doubly frustrating because I am often forced to listen to lectures from my older sister who is a therapist/life coach. But the thing is, she's never even been depressed, and she doesn't even have a degree. She just loves the sound of her own voice and has some mickey mouse diploma which she thinks qualifies her to guide me on this whole thing. I mean, I was a healthy, happy young dude with a good head on my shoulders. People just don't understand that this can happen to anyone, from one day to the next. Mental illness can be so sudden, and have triggers, underlying factors, and both subconscious and hereditary elements to it that can't easily be identified.


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