# Is This What people call "Permafried"



## Life_less_dave (Feb 1, 2006)

Wow ... Stupid question but i was wondering is this what people call "Permafried"


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## Guest (Mar 8, 2006)

I've seen this term used before, but mostly in reference to people who've abused hard drugs like meth or taken a lot of hallucinogens or dissociatives like LSD or PCP. I think "permafried" refers more to actual neurological damage caused by hard drugs on the brain(dopamine receptors damaged by cocaine addiction, for example), rather than DP/DR, which isn't a result of actual damage to the brain, in most cases.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

perma fried is a very general term but it usually refers to a person who has taken to much of a psychedelic and just isint quite right anymore. i guess the medical term would be hppd. there really isint any brain damage done but the brain no longer works the same way. on the other hand if you took to much of a heavy dissociative like pcp or a strong stimulant like coke or even worse meth brain dead would be a more applicable term. i dont think dp/dr is similar to any of this.


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## 1A (Aug 12, 2004)

Life_less_dave said:


> Wow ... Stupid question but i was wondering is this what people call "Permafried"


Occupation = Porn Star.

LOLOL!

You should change it back to school, but misspell school.


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## Guyver-Gabriel (Oct 29, 2005)

> if you took to much of a heavy dissociative like pcp or a strong stimulant like coke or even worse meth brain dead would be a more applicable term.


this is inaccurate.


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2006)

Guyver-Gabriel said:


> > if you took to much of a heavy dissociative like pcp or a strong stimulant like coke or even worse meth brain dead would be a more applicable term.
> 
> 
> this is inaccurate.


Yeah, many tweakers have twitches, paranoia, poor memory, and other symptoms due to neurological damage cause by long time methamphetamine abuse. Damage like that does not heal itself with time like something like HPPD or DP/DR might, and thus "Permafried" is an appropriate term. They are by no means brain "dead" though.


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## university girl (Aug 11, 2004)

Well, I definitely feel permafried...


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

well ya there not brain dead but they usually show much more signs of brain damage then people who use hallucinogens. meth is the worst ive seen for causing brain damage. although ive heard that pcp is even worse but ive only met a few people who have used it and none of them were regular users.


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## LOSTONE (Jul 9, 2005)

I think that Meth/ICE is a lot worse then PCP but then again they are both very extream drugs. I have seen some major dammage from ICE in Hawaii though, it is becoming a huge problem out west.

I know more then one person that has been killed in Hawaii due to ICE.
I don't think that PCP has nearly as many users as ICE has.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

yes ive seen first hand the damage meth can do to people. its a very scary sight. there are much more meth users then there are pcp users so its easier to judge the damage from meth. pcp could actually be easier on the brain then meth because pcp is a nmda antagonist and they do have neuro-protective qualities. but pcp has effects not shared by other nmda antagonists so that could be irrelevent. from the studies ive read almost every heavy pcp user shows clear cut signs of brain damage. also the stuff sold on the street isint exactly medical grade so god only knows what the hell is in it.


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## LOSTONE (Jul 9, 2005)

I don't really know that much about PCP but I am scared to death to find out what ICE is going to due to our land in another 20 years. I fear that it is going to become more popular then pot. In Hawaii it is already about just as commen as pot and it scares the hell out of me to see how crazy it can make people act :shock: . Acid and shrooms is like candy compared to that stuff.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

LOSTONE said:


> I don't really know that much about PCP but I am scared to death to find out what ICE is going to due to our land in another 20 years. I fear that it is going to become more popular then pot. In Hawaii it is already about just as commen as pot and it scares the hell out of me to see how crazy it can make people act :shock: . Acid and shrooms is like candy compared to that stuff.


  yes meth is definatly the worst drug out there. its so popular because its cheap, very euphoric and readily available. its probley the most addictive drug around. the really bad thing about it is is that you dont have to be a real chemistry wizz to make the stuff. all you really need to do is follow the recipies. a basic understanding of chemistry would help though. with lsd you basically have to be a chemistry genius to make it thats why the production of lsd has gone down so much in the past few years. its much easier to make meth and theres more money to be made in it. this has also happened to a lesser extent with mdma as well because that is also harder to make then meth.


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## jft (Jan 10, 2005)

I find it interesting that some here if I remember right "got" dp/dr from anasthesia.
PCP was developed as an anasthesia but was too nasty for humans so it was used in vetinary (if I remember right) medicine only, for how long I do not know. We used to call it an elephant tranquilizer, whether it was ever used for that I do not know. But I do know that we laced our joints and hash oils with it and it was almost every time a powerful high. In fact we all gave up on lsd and replaced it with angel dust, thinking it was "safer". It was the pcp buzz. But it was indeed a true dissotiative, giving one extreme unreal feelings and percptions as well as some hallucinations. I think alot of media and also the govenment has given pcp (at least the formulation we used to take...who knows what is in it now) an incorrect percetion for it supposedly does not really cause violent behavior. From what I have read (on the net) it is when being confronted and overdly manhandled by cops that one many times loses it when on pcp because one does not feel the pain of the first billy club etc. Also of interest to me was when someone explained to me that pcp was used a great deal by the gangs in LA years back and seeing as how the gang members tended to be violent in nature to begin with that the drug came to be assotiated with violence.

All that being said I would not touch pcp again if my life depended on it. It very well could be the culprit rather than the lsd or pot that triggered my dp/dr. PCP is just like a very intense dr/dp episode. That is the best way to describe the high from it. I fully feel that even a person who had no predispostiona at all could get dp/dr from using pcp even one time (just my feeling). Also taking too much of it can send ya into lala land for a very long time. Also chances are real good that any pcp one purchases is formulated in someones garage. I do not know if it is even used at all legally anymore by vets.
jft


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## LOSTONE (Jul 9, 2005)

> Also of interest to me was when someone explained to me that pcp was used a great deal by the gangs in LA years back and seeing as how the gang members tended to be violent in nature to begin with that the drug came to be assotiated with violence.


I just watched a show about the history of drugs and it seems that all the disinfomation about drugs started along those lines. I don't know about PCP but most drugs like Pot and Coke were connected with the black minorities and the government started putting up ads that the reason black naborhoods were so violant were because of the drugs, funny thing is that at that time there were many more white people useing the drugs then blacks :wink: . Some of the old drug commercials were really funny, they tried to make pot look like it would cause you to go totally insane after just a few hits. People were not very smart back in those days I guess. Then again, people are still not that smart these days either. I see the same stupid commercials about cigarettes on T.V. all the time. Yes all these drugs are bad but the commercials are just stupid and actually pretty funny.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

ya pcp is basically just a dissociative anesthetic somewhat similar to ketamine or dxm. no doubt alot of the bad press it gets is just media hype. the violent aspect of the drug is not that different then alcohol. i mean lots of people get into fights with cops and destroy property when there drunk. but if your ordinarily not a violent person i doubt a drug would make you act violent. the main thing with pcp is you really dont know what your getting. there could be any number of cuts mixed with it. this could account for some off the odd reactions people get on it. all the same it would be best to avoid this drug like the plague as it most definatly does cause nasty brain damage after long term use. ketamine or even dxm would be a much safer dissociative to use.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

> I just watched a show about the history of drugs and it seems that all the disinfomation about drugs started along those lines. I don't know about PCP but most drugs like Pot and Coke were connected with the black minorities and the government started putting up ads that the reason black naborhoods were so violant were because of the drugs, funny thing is that at that time there were many more white people useing the drugs then blacks . Some of the old drug commercials were really funny, they tried to make pot look like it would cause you to go totally insane after just a few hits. People were not very smart back in those days I guess. Then again, people are still not that smart these days either. I see the same stupid commercials about cigarettes on T.V. all the time. Yes all these drugs are bad but the commercials are just stupid and actually pretty funny.


 i just saw a anti pot commercial yesterday. it had this girl sitting on a couch like a zombie basically just staring off into space. at the end of the commercial someone said this is what my daughter has been like since she started smoking pot. lol i cracked right up at that. all i was thinking was damn she must be smoking alot better pot then i used to smoke. the commercials are so over the top noone could possibly take them seriously. there a total waste of money and effort.


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## LOSTONE (Jul 9, 2005)

> the commercials are so over the top noone could possibly take them seriously. there a total waste of money and effort.


I actually think that they have a negitive effect because when I started useing drugs I knew that everything I was being told about them was a lie. I wish I would have known the truth about them because I would have never done them. I was in D.A.R.E. and I think that is what sparked my interest in drugs actually. I was even thinking of sueing the people that ran the stupid D.A.R.E. program because it is so totally stupid. D.A.R.E. might as well just hand out joints to kids because thats basically what they are doing anyway by sparking kids curiosity about the subject. I don't know who the hell makes up these programs but whoever them people are they are very stupid to think that kids are dumb enough to eat their B.S. about drugs. Their should be enough honest info about drugs that they wouldn't have to lie about it, I don't have any idea why they go so over the top and turn the issue into a comedy.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

LOSTONE said:


> > I actually think that they have a negitive effect because when I started useing drugs I knew that everything I was being told about them was a lie. I wish I would have known the truth about them because I would have never done them. I was in D.A.R.E. and I think that is what sparked my interest in drugs actually. I was even thinking of sueing the people that ran the stupid D.A.R.E. program because it is so totally stupid. D.A.R.E. might as well just hand out joints to kids because thats basically what they are doing anyway by sparking kids curiosity about the subject. I don't know who the hell makes up these programs but whoever them people are they are very stupid to think that kids are dumb enough to eat their B.S. about drugs. Their should be enough honest info about drugs that they wouldn't have to lie about it, I don't have any idea why they go so over the top and turn the issue into a comedy.


 we didnt have dare at my school but we did have anti drug propoganda apleanty. i remember they said alot about magic mushrooms and lsd and how they can make you feel like your in another world. i believe this sparked my interests in psychedelics cause magic mushrooms was one of the first drugs i tried. if only i had stuck to them and stayed away from booze things might have turned out better.


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## LOSTONE (Jul 9, 2005)

Yeah I think that shrooms all alone wouldn't be so bad but when you mix them with acid, pot or vodka then the game changes.

Shrooms are strong enough by themselves I think.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

ya alcohol definatly caused me the most trouble. in fact out of all the drugs ive taken its the only 1 to cause me any trouble at all. its cost me financialy, socially and mentally. there are times when i wish i never had to have that first drink. but then again i had alot of fun being drunk to. so i really have no regrets.


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## Guest (Mar 14, 2006)

> [quote="jft" I think alot of media and also the govenment has given pcp (at least the formulation we used to take...who knows what is in it now) an incorrect percetion for it supposedly does not really cause violent behavior. From what I have read (on the net) it is when being confronted and overdly manhandled by cops that one many times loses it when on pcp because one does not feel the pain of the first billy club etc. Also of interest to me was when someone explained to me that pcp was used a great deal by the gangs in LA years back and seeing as how the gang members tended to be violent in nature to begin with that the drug came to be assotiated with violence.
> 
> PCP is just like a very intense dr/dp episode. That is the best way to describe the high from it.
> jft


I know when I first started having DP/DR episodes I felt like I might go insane and become a psychotic killer or something, just because I felt so physically and emotionally numb. My passive nature, however, prevented that(thank god!  )

You always hear the PCP horror stories: the woman who fried her baby thinking it was a chicken, the man who tore his eyes out, or the guy who took 50 bullets to take down, but I agree that alcohol is far more dangerous, simply because it's legal and socially acceptable. Most violent crimes in this country stem from some sort of alcohol use.


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## just breathe (Nov 21, 2005)

I am scared that I might actually be permafried....I started using pot at 12 and consumed about 1/4-1/2 ounce a week till I was 17....during that time I experimented with multiple prescription drugs(primarily:vicodin,ritalin,valium,klonapin,xanax)from 17-21 I used coke on a occasional basis and popped ecstasy about 20-30 times....I am not writing this to have a drug diary but to say I did all this while my brain was in development.....which I hope did not cause permanent damage...funnily enough my dp was not drug induced...I just started having panic attacks from stressing over everyday things and not sleeping enough....I never messed with psychedelics because I saw what bad trips looked like and did not want to experience one first hand....


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## LOSTONE (Jul 9, 2005)

Just Breathe 
I have done most of the things you have done and even huffed gas for a while. I realized later in life that huffing gas does so much dammage to your brain so fast that you can die from doing it just within a minute or two of huffing. You can actually feel your brain literally frying when you huff because you get a very strong headache just after the high.

Even though I have done crazy stuff like huffing gas, my brain is still pretty functional and I think that most of the dammage I have done to my brain has already rapaired itself. The brain is very adaptable but if your mind is "stuck" then don't expect all that much from your brain because what is going on in your mind is more important then the functions of your brain. Remember your mind is in control of your brain, not the other way around. If you feed your mind with good and thought provoking things then your dammaged brain will start to repair itself.


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## just breathe (Nov 21, 2005)

Oh yeah dumb me..I forgot..I huffed gas a few times too.....

I do beleive you are accurate in the brain repairing itself...I read that the body replaces every cell in a cycle of about 7 years.....so this illness has to be a learned affliction and not a chemical imbalance or growth defect....I just worry too much....


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

just breathe said:


> I am scared that I might actually be permafried....I started using pot at 12 and consumed about 1/4-1/2 ounce a week till I was 17....during that time I experimented with multiple prescription drugs(primarily:vicodin,ritalin,valium,klonapin,xanax)from 17-21 I used coke on a occasional basis and popped ecstasy about 20-30 times....I am not writing this to have a drug diary but to say I did all this while my brain was in development.....which I hope did not cause permanent damage...funnily enough my dp was not drug induced...I just started having panic attacks from stressing over everyday things and not sleeping enough....I never messed with psychedelics because I saw what bad trips looked like and did not want to experience one first hand....


 well your probley not perma fried but you could have messed your brain up abit. the pot and opiates like vicodin i wouldnt worry about as they dont cause any brain damage. if you didnt use benzos too often i wouldnt worry about them either. chronic ritalin use may leed to depression. the ones that probley did your brain the most damage are cocaine and ecstasy. cocaine is neurotoxic if used heavily and can cause a whole bunch of psychological problems ranging from depression to full blown psychosis. ecstasy is neurotoxic depending on who you ask. the debate is still out on how bad it is for your brain but im pretty sure that excessive long term use can lead to serotonin depletion. this can leed to a whole bunch of problems such as anxiety and major depression. its ironic that you stayed away from psychedelics in favour of cocaine and ecstasy as those 2 drugs are much more likely to do you harm then the traditional psychedelics. lucky for you however most brain damage can heal over time.


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## LOSTONE (Jul 9, 2005)

> I do beleive you are accurate in the brain repairing itself...I read that the body replaces every cell in a cycle of about 7 years.....so this illness has to be a learned affliction and not a chemical imbalance or growth defect....I just worry too much....


Actually to be totally acurate, I don't think that brain cells regrow as well as the rest of the body but they are very good at making new connections and adapting to dammage. The DP/DR symptoms I think are totally an aspect of the mind and have nothing to do with brain dammage at all. This has to be true because so many of us got DP/DR in just a matter of seconds and most brain dammage takes a little longer then that. I can pinpoint the exact moment that my DP/DR hit me full force and it had nothing to do with brain dammage, I am positive of that.

Although I am still a little dammaged from my drug use I think..


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