# Dp and Buddhism



## Guest (Oct 15, 2010)

Here is an article on Buddhism and Dp by Buddhist Monk, Madawela Punnaji

http://www.dhammawiki.com/index.php?title=Becoming_a_Buddhist_by_Madawela_Punnaji

under THE VALUE OF CALMNESS and also at the end of the article..

he states

Depersonalization

'The final stage in the development of the path of Buddhism is depersonalization. This is when we are able to give up what has been personalized by seeing that there is nothing that we can call our own. When we see that all things are unstable (anicca), anxiety-producing (dukkha), and impersonal (anatta), we are free of all suffering. This is because there are no possessions or "self" to worry about. This depersonalization is what makes an individual completely selfless. When this happens one can even face death without anxiety. This complete freedom from anxiety is the aim of Buddhism.'

*The thing is that these monks and others who meditate are more prepared for an experince of dp to occur.. whereas many of us experince this because of other events and are in the dark about what we are going through. I have practiced a lot of meditation as well as physical activity (running, exercising, sports (for grounding).. both are crucial i feel in being balanced with this 'disorder'....)







*

In my own experinces i truly cannot relate to many who have had dp from drugs or trauma.

I got dp when i was 7 and i was looking in the mirror and asked myself who am i. I had been thinking profoundly on the self in that moment and suddenly i experienced dp for the first time. I do not suffer from bad dp anymore but know what it is like to be fully engulfed in that scary state of NO-THINGNESS...so no matter how one gets it we all experience it on that deep hard to explain level.. and i feel we can help each other regardless of how we got it.. and this is how i can help. Not by telling you what meds to take. Not by telling you that you have a disorder. But by showing you another angle of dp.

It has helped me to experience the most beautiful indescribable experiences.. I just wish with all my heart.. with all my soul i could share with you.

Dp is a teacher and has taught me for a long time what it is like to not believe that the body nor this world can limit my sense of self. And that the Love of God/Life has no boundaries.

I don't think Dp is the ultimate state of enlightenment... NO WAY... but it is a MAJOR stepping stone in some for getting there... to that state of oneness. So when people here say its the opposite of enlightenment... I agree. It isn't the ultimate point of enlightenment... it is the exact dual opposite.. when one experiences the BREAK down of FALSE identity and FALSE MENTAL CONCEPTS of the WORLD (which is a reflection of all our mental ideas here in 3d) one can then realize ourselves WHAT IS REAL. get over the fear of loosing your identity with DP.. by realize something within is just teaching you and breaking down what is not real.

maybe how long you have it depends on how long it takes for you to really realize this. Dp doesn't bother me like it use to.. so I can say this.


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## Nihil Dexter (Sep 9, 2010)

Very good post. I have a book about DP and dissociation in general. There is a chapter about DP and buddhism also.
It's claimed that buddhism people are scared when it comes to DP, as well. Anyways, DP would be a good teacher but 
somehow the lessons last waaaaaaaaay too long.


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## Guest (Oct 15, 2010)

danxiety said:


> Very good post. I have a book about DP and dissociation in general. There is a chapter about DP and buddhism also.
> It's claimed that buddhism people are scared when it comes to DP, as well. Anyways, DP would be a good teacher but
> somehow the lessons last waaaaaaaaay too long.


I know what you mean. It does last long. Mine lasted 15 years. Meditation, nutrition, physical activity, but mostly discovering a different persepctive of this 'disorder' has helped me to overcome. It's all in the point of view.. yet, i know how hard it is for someone going through it to just say, ok.. i'll see it differently.

I do know that if i can get past it and choose to learn from it anyone else can. And my heart goes out to everyone here.

Also, I wouldn't doubt if many of those monks become afraid... DP is an intense intense experience.. though i have met a few who say that they don't mind it and find the state of dp very interesting(people from other dp sites). I was like







noo way.lol


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## Guest (Oct 16, 2010)

I actually learned I had DP after 6 years of it. My brother was reading a book about Buddhism or the like, and he came across the term "Depersonlization" and said I should read up on it because it described how I described I had been feeling all those years. Now it's been 7+ years. I personally think DP isn't a desirable state of mind. Yet, I have learned loads because of it.


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## Guest (Oct 16, 2010)

ThoughtOnFire said:


> I actually learned I had DP after 6 years of it. My brother was reading a book about Buddhism or the like, and he came across the term "Depersonlization" and said I should read up on it because it described how I described I had been feeling all those years. Now it's been 7+ years. I personally think DP isn't a desirable state of mind. Yet, I have learned loads because of it.


yes def.. it's a stage process.. for many of us.

I wouldn't take back going through all i went through with it.


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## Guest (Oct 16, 2010)

ellatree said:


> yes def.. it's a stage process.. for many of us.
> 
> I wouldn't take back going through all i went through with it.


Same here... but I still want out!!!


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## Pablo (Sep 1, 2005)

A buddhist experiencing depersonalization will still feel all their emotions, infact their emotions will most probably be much more vibrant than regular people, the difference is that they wont be attached or show aversion towards them so they will come and go in their awareness like clouds with no attachment of self to them. Whereas I get the impresssion on this site the people here dont feel many of their emotions if any, this means that their ego is showing aversion towards them on some level.


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## babybowrain (Aug 24, 2010)

So what would we feel after all the anxiety and dp? I personally don't really like buddhism, but I tried drawing mandalas for a while for relaxation. Apparently drawing in a circle is more satisfying than drawing in a square, they did studies







I started after finding some therapist that did art therapy classes with mandalas only online


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## Guest (Oct 20, 2010)

Pablo said:


> A buddhist experiencing depersonalization will still feel all their emotions, infact their emotions will most probably be much more vibrant than regular people, the difference is that they wont be attached or show aversion towards them so they will come and go in their awareness like clouds with no attachment of self to them. Whereas I get the impresssion on this site the people here dont feel many of their emotions if any, this means that their ego is showing aversion towards them on some level.


Hello Pablo..

possibly the ego is showing aversion to them on some level because dp forces one to loose attachments to concepts even if just temporarily and for a moment to view an altered nature of self. One without the concepts we have for so long identified ourselves with. mainly.. MENTALLY, PHYSICALLY, and EMOTIONALLY. The Buddhists on the other hand IDENTIFY themselves with the SPIRIT self or infinite consciousness. therefore their experiences with dp wont have an averse reaction to their emotions.

so you mentioned that the ' Buddhists wont be attached or show aversion towards them so they will come and go in their awareness like clouds with no attachment of self to them.' - isn't this because they know what to IDENTIFY themselves with beforehand? They practice non attachment for a reason. They no not to identify with anything other than the eternal state. Therefore they have no false concepts of self... unlike ourselves.

Many people identify themselves with their emotions ALL THE TIME. How many times have your emotions determined your state of mind? Guess you wouldn't be in this forum if this wasn't true.

I got dp from asking myself 'who am i?'. Later when i was older and began to meditate.. i came across the same meditation.. to ask myself 'who am i?'.. i was being led by a meditation instructor. I kept saying.. OMG.. ive already done this.. and i know the result lol

I later came across another monk and mentioned dp in my life to him.. and he said that I was experiencing awakening states.

now I am 26 .. after a few years of consistently meditating.. dp is no longer present. Though i can go in and out of it.. for example if I contemplate on the emptiness/detached feeling i had when i had dp.. i can feel it back... but then let it go. Not saying I'm a fully enlightened human being but i can say that the detachment I felt from dp revealed to me all that i am not in order for me to finally realize all that I AM.

this is indeed a very difficult topic to discuss as people get dp because of different things... drugs, trauma, philosophical talk.

Though i don't see the dp that monks describe as being any different than our own dp. I just feel we VIEW it different because many of us identify ourselves fully with the physical, mental, emotional bodies. I'm sure this would not be the case for people who experience dp in the east. Does this disorder even exist over there? lol.. they'd just say it's someone awakening to their true nature.

I see these types of topics are very hard to have here because *each* have their own opinions and views of dp. My view is that this is in fact the same type of separation as the one the Buddhists describe. Now each of us will *judge* our experience of dp.. view it and label it.. as terrible.. or interesting.. horrifying.. or self-revealing

So far, I do not suffer from dp anymore after 15 years with it. Possibly because of this realization.. but also because of meditational practices.

I recently read a book called kundalini rising... it described a man from the US who begins to meditate and later enters advanced meditation techniques. He develops dp shortly after. The instructor of the group who was from India explained that many in the west will experience.. dp.. which only EXISTS in the WEST BECAUSE we are not familiar with those types of states of mind in the west Unlike in the EAST where they are widely practiced, ACCEPTED and UNDERSTOOD. Many of the monks who reside in ashrams are all taught since young ages about their nature of self being ETERNAL BEING.

Therefore it is the same DP to me... the ONLY difference is our reaction to the heightened states. Many of us will become anxious, fearful, stressed, and disconnected from ourselves (false identification of our self). We don't know what else to identify with other than that we are use to (mind, physical, emotional). In result.. our experience with dp is completely shocking and even horrifying.

Our schools do not teach us about consciousness, ego, self-awareness. Our society has for so long ridiculed or condemned anything that has to do with being spiritual. Finally now it is changing and so many more are open to yoga and meditation. So it is very likely and obvious that anyone experiencing altered states of consciousness in our society will label it a disorder.

I've also talked to a Shaman about dp. She told me also that it was an awakening. Now, for the people who get dp from trauma.. she explained that.. sometimes in a fearful event the person/soul... will leave an energy imprint wherever the event took place. This energy imprint is a piece of themselves. If the trauma was so bad.. then they can leave the imprint there for however long it takes in order for them to heal. The shaman in this case will do a SOUL RETRIEVAL. The person may feel dissociated until the event or by healing themselves. Now, i still feel the DP (separation) is still the same as the one the Buddhists describe.. because I believe that traumatizing events are very important lessons. An important lesson placed in our lives only to teach us more about ourselves and our potential. This lesson can like the experince of DP teach us and help us to become awake to the true nature of self. Guess it depends how much we choose to learn from the impactful event.

And i feel indeed i can speak for this because i have been the victim of abuse and only have to say that it has too helped me to be where i am.


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## Guest (Oct 20, 2010)

ellatree said:


> Though i don't see the dp monks describe as being any different than our own dp. I just feel we VIEW it different because many of us identify ourselves fully with the physical, mental, emotional bodies. Im sure this would not be the case for people who experince dp in the east. This disorder doesnt even exist over there lol.. they'd just say it's someone awakening to their true nature.


This is EXACTLY what my brother keeps telling me! It's annoying, but I know he is right. He basically says that we suffer because of our attachment to a false sense of self. He says that if we can understand the "No Self" of it all, then it wouldn't be a negative experience. Again, it's annoying, but I think he's right. It's kind of ironic too, because without him, I wouldn't have discovered the term depersonalization. He read about it in some spiritual book. And I had for 6 years sometimes told him I was going through SOMETHING, and I would describe my symptoms as best I could. He said I should read up about depersonalization and you know, he was right!


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## Guest (Oct 21, 2010)

ThoughtOnFire said:


> This is EXACTLY what my brother keeps telling me! It's annoying, but I know he is right. He basically says that we suffer because of our attachment to a false sense of self. He says that if we can understand the "No Self" of it all, then it wouldn't be a negative experience. Again, it's annoying, but I think he's right. It's kind of ironic too, because without him, I wouldn't have discovered the term depersonalization. He read about it in some spiritual book. And I had for 6 years sometimes told him I was going through SOMETHING, and I would describe my symptoms as best I could. He said I should read up about depersonalization and you know, he was right!


*kaachiiiinnng* lol I think he's right too!







!!!


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## Pablo (Sep 1, 2005)

Yeah I wouldn't ever want to disrespect anyones experience and the cause of their dp is probably different for each person, but yeah I agree reflecting on who you are is a natural thing to do and without proper support in investigating this process you can end up in all sorts of trouble and there isn't much support in the west anyway to help with this. The thing is I think many of the people here are trying to work out who "I am" by diving right in with their analytical mind as this is the way we are taught to think in the west, but diving in like this can cause a lot of misery and unnecessary suffering. paths like Buddhism have a step by step safe and reliable process of investigation into who we are, there is a analytical investigation part but that is done in a precise way and at a later advanced stage once you proficient in the concentration practices. The people before us have drawn safe step by step maps of the process.

I have heard that there is a certain terror involved with the loss of the ego which could make people run away into dissociation, but also Buddhism training starts from a place presuming a decent level of mental health and it's not designed to actually heal people of their neurotic problems, whereas there are methods within Taoism which are designed to bring a person to balance, to ground them in their bodies and to the earth and to release psychological tensions before you start meditation, for me personally this is what I do as I found sitting meditation unsettling but each person is unique so whatever works is best I guess.


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## Guest (Oct 22, 2010)

Pablo said:


> Yeah I wouldn't ever want to disrespect anyones experience and the cause of their dp is probably different for each person, but yeah I agree reflecting on who you are is a natural thing to do and without proper support in investigating this process you can end up in all sorts of trouble and there isn't much support in the west anyway to help with this. The thing is I think many of the people here are trying to work out who "I am" by diving right in with their analytical mind as this is the way we are taught to think in the west, but diving in like this can cause a lot of misery and unnecessary suffering. paths like Buddhism have a step by step safe and reliable process of investigation into who we are, there is a analytical investigation part but that is done in a precise way and at a later advanced stage once you proficient in the concentration practices. The people before us have drawn safe step by step maps of the process.
> 
> I have heard that there is a certain terror involved with the loss of the ego which could make people run away into dissociation, but also Buddhism training starts from a place presuming a decent level of mental health and it's not designed to actually heal people of their neurotic problems, whereas there are methods within Taoism which are designed to bring a person to balance, to ground them in their bodies and to the earth and to release psychological tensions before you start meditation, for me personally this is what I do as I found sitting meditation unsettling but each person is unique so whatever works is best I guess.


wow yes, there is a lot of useful information in what you have said. Guess each needs to find out what works for them. I'm glad we have all kinds of points of views on the site. I just wish people would lay off of the meds. But so many would go against me in that case... mainly because many got dp from marijuana. These man made drugs in my opinion cause other harms to our energetic feild that we do not see. There has been a high sucicide rate in people on these types of meds. I also know how difficult it is to see the value in something like dp and to also accept it. It has helped me in significant ways.. and if it hadn't, i wouldn't be here to share how it has helped me. It is a process and people need to learn to have patience with it.

anyway, thank you for sharing your views Pablo.. much peace and love to you on your path..


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## Guest (Oct 24, 2010)

DP.DR teaches us that we are not who we thought we were. Who here can say that before they had DP.DR that they KNEW who they were? Let's face it, being "normal" before DP.DR wasn't exactly a state of Enlightenment. I think that is one of the biggest reasons why recovery is so difficult. Because not only have we forgotten what Reality was like, we didn't even know BEFORE DP.DR what Reality was. We were experiencing it, yes, but we sure as hell weren't clued in to the Secrets of the Universe, be it Macrocosm or Microcosm, Without or Within. DP.DR has shown us that we just don't understand reality, as it were. This is where Spirituality like Buddhism comes along. I think it's highly plausible that the first Meditation Practitioners actually HAD DP.DR and were looking for the same answers that plague us today.


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## goinginsane (Nov 14, 2010)

I dont think it's a good thing to correlate the DP we are experiencing with the one that buddist on final stage of development are experiencing. These are two totally different things. One get's you to enligthened state of peace, happiness, joy and freedom, the other to depression, supression numb-semi anxious suffering state. I think the articel was a little misleading with the term depersonalization. The buddist final stage deperzonalization is actually ultimate identification with everything that occurs/arises (in the way that no feelings or parts of the self get supressed) in the ultimate conciousness.If you identified with everthing you'll see that theres nothing that can crash in to you, because there is no-separate self to begin with. There's no fear, but only a deep feeling of ecstasy and freedom. Different parts of the self (pshysical, emotional, mental, trans-mental) co-exist in harmony and don't get detached and supressed by each other. Detachement in the context of buddism means "being aware/concious of feelings/mind/body. Detachement in DP context however is not "being aware of" but rather being unaware and supressing feelings/thoughts and so on.
So i think those are very very different things.


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## Guest (Nov 29, 2010)

goinginsane said:


> I dont think it's a good thing to correlate the DP we are experiencing with the one that buddist on final stage of development are experiencing. These are two totally different things. One get's you to enligthened state of peace, happiness, joy and freedom, the other to depression, supression numb-semi anxious suffering state. I think the articel was a little misleading with the term depersonalization. The buddist final stage deperzonalization is actually ultimate identification with everything that occurs/arises (in the way that no feelings or parts of the self get supressed) in the ultimate conciousness.If you identified with everthing you'll see that theres nothing that can crash in to you, because there is no-separate self to begin with. There's no fear, but only a deep feeling of ecstasy and freedom. Different parts of the self (pshysical, emotional, mental, trans-mental) co-exist in harmony and don't get detached and supressed by each other. Detachement in the context of buddism means "being aware/concious of feelings/mind/body. Detachement in DP context however is not "being aware of" but rather being unaware and supressing feelings/thoughts and so on.
> So i think those are very very different things.


i def can agree with you... i dont think dp is the final stage.. but it is what needs to take place in order for us to get to peace.. dp teaches you what you are not.. and then its up to you to see in this separation../ all that you truly are.. beyond your own individuality... you are everything and connected to everyone..


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