# Checking myself into a hospital



## missjess

I feel really fkn depressed I can't deal with this anymore. I feel Luke I'm gonna have a psychotic breakdown at any moment.

This is going into year 7 with this shit. I feel hopeless and seriously fkn depressed. I don't want to be around ppl anymore, I don't want to do nothing. So there it is that's how I feel, yep I feel weak right now and I don't fkn care thanks for listening


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## sunshinita

I fyou go to the hospital you will start thinking abou yourself as an ill person and it can make your dp even worse. You should engage in your everyday life,it is hard,very hard but you should push yourself,are you on any kind of medication?


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## missjess

Im here, I've been sedated... No one fucking knows anything about dp and they just think I'm fucking depressed which is accurate.

I've been told I need to make purpose in my life and deal with my personalíty disorder and that there is support out there and they can help get me back in the community.

It's my attitude I know this but I just can't deal with these horrible symptoms I hate dr the most! I know I need to do something but Fuk I just want to give up sometimes this condition has got to be the worst thing in the world worse then any other mental problems!

It's gotten to a point where I feel ashamed about dp so if I'm ashamed about this how the fuck am I gonna get my confidence back I've identified with this shit and I feel like crap!!


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## missjess

Considering natural anti depressant supplements but I won't go on medication don't want to feel even more numb


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## Ruhtra

> In the hospital, nothing will happen to your condition. Just to prepare you.


Agreed.

I spent about six months in a psychiatric hospital... big mistake. They will do nothing but sedate you.

I'm pretty convinced I would have recovered much faster if I hadn't been there.



> I fyou go to the hospital you will start thinking abou yourself as an ill person and it can make your dp even worse. You should engage in your everyday life,it is hard,very hard but you should push yourself


This


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## sunshinita

Not all of the antidepressants make you feel numb,I was on Effexor and it made wonders for my anxiety,and then the DP slowly faded away,because when there is no anxiety you stop overthinking,analyzing and paying attention to the symptoms,so it goes away.You can try and,of course, if it doesn't mke you feel better you can stop it. SSRIs or SNRIs, I am no doctor but I studied Psychology in university and also I am speaking from my experience.SSRIS ans SNRIs have side effect but not that much and they fade away in the first 2 weeks,the worst side effect (especially for females) is the gain weight but it's less important than feeling good in your own mind.


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## missjess

Thanks guys


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## missjess

All opinions are appreciated


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## Ruhtra

Keep in mind you're not ill ; DP is only a mild dissociative disorder and it's 100% reversible. Live your life as if nothing was wrong. Keep yourself busy, socialize, exercise etc. and eventually the symptoms will fade away. But it certainly can't be cured with drugs.


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## missjess

Yeah but that's just it...even when I do that stuff I just don't enjoy it


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## missjess

Ruhtra

Have u gotten out of DP?

Another reason why I don't enjoy these things is bcoz I feel terribly hurt underneath


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## Ruhtra

Not quite, but I've made a whole lot of progress.


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## missjess

How long have u been in DP for ?


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## missjess

By the way at wat point did u go to the mental hospital? I can't believe u stayed there 6 months !! Fuk


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## King Baba

Ruhtra said:


> Keep in mind you're not ill ; DP is only a mild dissociative disorder and it's 100% reversible. Live your life as if nothing was wrong. Keep yourself busy, socialize, exercise etc. and eventually the symptoms will fade away. But it certainly can't be cured with drugs.


You're talking about it as if it's the same for everyone -- it's not. It "certainly" can't be cured with drugs? How do you know this for certain? By saying this, you're potentially dissuading people from getting the help that could possibly alleviate the mental anguish they're experiencing. Don't do that. And if, like you say, it's a dissociative disorder, then that means your brain chemistry is altered. And the thing to change your abnormal brain chemistry would be drugs.


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## King Baba

Fearless said:


> Thank yourself. You've been fooling yourself hard and now playing the martyr. "Mental problem" means that YOU ARE doing something wrong. YOU.


Do you also tell schizophrenics to "snap out of it"? This is not an illusion. It's a split in your personality and it's something that needs to be healed. To dismiss it entirely as some fabricated illness is not going to help anyone.


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## L.Z.

missjess said:


> Yeah but that's just it...even when I do that stuff I just don't enjoy it


That's exactly how it is for me... Everytime when i do things i like it makes it worse


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## Ruhtra

I've been in DP for about two years.



> at wat point did u go to the mental hospital?


Just like you, when I could no longer tolerate the symptoms. Worst mistake of my life ! I was kept by force for 4 months actually. Then I moved to another hospital.



King Baba said:


> You're talking about it as if it's the same for everyone -- it's not. It "certainly" can't be cured with drugs? How do you know this for certain? By saying this, you're potentially dissuading people from getting the help that could possibly alleviate the mental anguish they're experiencing. Don't do that. And if, like you say, it's a dissociative disorder, then that means your brain chemistry is altered. And the thing to change your abnormal brain chemistry would be drugs.


You're right.

Well, I highly doubt it can be cured with meds. I'm no doctor but there is an abundant literature on this subject (in fact, some psychiatrists claim that DP isn't even a dissociative disorder, rather a symptom of depression, anxiety or more serious mental illnesses such as schizophrenia).

Also, I was prescribed all kinds of psych drugs and none helped with my DP, so...


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## SamodrotAgressivoDrot

> "Mental problem" means that YOU ARE doing something wrong. YOU.


You are right. And one of the things that it may be is autoaggression

Misjess, next time if your condition becomes unbearable, rather then going to hospital better try to look inside yourself. What is wrong there, what is going on there? There can be numerous reasons, and numerous ways how you can make your condition better. At least you can practice in trying to understand your inner world . You can attend a psychotherapist. Also you may read some of the PT books(on the first level even this may help).


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## missjess

Fearless said:


> Schizophrenia is not DP.


He is saying that DP is a split in ur personality that needs to be healed..


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## missjess

L.Z. said:


> That's exactly how it is for me... Everytime when i do things i like it makes it worse


Yeah no shit...I fucking got my make up artistry certificate DPD ... I attended a class...got my certificate all the while DPD it was fucked


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## missjess

Ruhtra said:


> I've been in DP for about two years. I went to a mental hospital in December 2011, where I was kept by force for 4 months (I had been misdiagnosed with schizophrenia). then I moved to another hospital.
> 
> Just like you, when I could no longer tolerate the symptoms. Worst mistake of my life !
> 
> Fuck that I could only imagine the frustration....the docs didn't even know what a dissociative disorder is they just said I was depressed stupid fucks...I told them they were wrong of course and could not pass judgement only having spoken with me for 5 minutes
> 
> 2 years is ok...ull get out easy coz ur determined to get back to ur former self quickly like I was back then. But now I think I've forgotten wat that feels like
> 
> You're right.
> 
> Well, I highly doubt it can be cured with meds. I'm no doctor but there is an abundant literature on this subject and in fact, some psychiatrists claim that DP isn't even a dissociative disorder, rather a symptom of depression and anxiety.
> 
> Also, I was prescribed all kinds of psych drugs and none helped with my DP, so...


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## Ruhtra

Well at least you have Internet access in your hospital lol


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## Surfingisfun001

.


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## Guest

Ruhtra said:


> I've been in DP for about two years.
> 
> Just like you, when I could no longer tolerate the symptoms. Worst mistake of my life ! I was kept by force for 4 months actually. Then I moved to another hospital.
> 
> You're right.
> 
> Well, I highly doubt it can be cured with meds. I'm no doctor but there is an abundant literature on this subject (in fact, some psychiatrists claim that DP isn't even a dissociative disorder, rather a symptom of depression, anxiety or more serious mental illnesses such as schizophrenia).
> 
> Also, I was prescribed all kinds of psych drugs and none helped with my DP, so...


*Ruhtra,* I see you are from France. I'm not clear how you were hospitalized for 4 months. Worldwide, there are not enough hospital beds for even the sickest individuals. Here in the US they have shut down many psychiatric units for lack of funding. I think in France there are 10 beds for every 10,000 people.

What was the diagnosis to keep you hospitalized for 6 months? *And how could you be forced to stay?* There are no resources to keep individuals in a hospital for that long on a psych unit. I have a cousin with severe schizoaffective disorder who could only stay one month after his first break, and he was completely unable to care for himself. Was violent, psychotic in his manic states, etc. He was kept for one month as he was a serious danger to self and others -- they had to find the right meds for him to get him stabilized. This has happened a number of times with him, but he can't get good care anywhere now.

And *MissJess,*

If you are feeling suicidal and you can actualy get admitted ... which is so difficult in the US (you have to already have slashed your wrists to gete a bed, essentially to get stitched up) ... it is essential. *You shouldn't feel ashamed about any of this.*

I have been suicidal several times in my life. On one occasion, I had some option of waiting weeks for a voluntary admission. The main thing, is not getting cured. When I have felt suicidal I go day to day, hour to hour, minute to minute ... I was so close once. I had to keep saying ... "hold on one more day." *But what is helpful from a short hold in the hopsital is that time you can get -- to NOT act.*

But I'm especially curious Ruhtra how and why they would put you in hopistal for such a long time? Was it a private hospital? Most people in the US can't even afford that. Even for the sickest of patients. And the wealthiest can't get beds either.

But *MissJess*, *you should not feel ashamed for asking for help, no one should. * I know of several people who commited suicide over the years -- one was my best friend. She was ahshamed to ask for help -- I knew she had issues, but never knew what she planned to do -- I was stunned. She may have been alive today had she not been ashamed. And her act was not impulsive -- I found out later she had been planning it for months. Perfectly planned out so no one could save her.

These days it's a miracle that anyone can get a psychiatric bed unless they are violent and the police have been asked to intervene. My cousin destroyed an apartment and beat his friend -- then the police could be called to place him on a 72 hour hold for him to "cool off." *Danger to self and to others is about the only way you can get a pscych bed. I know many families who have waited for 24 hours in a hopsital to get a loved one a bed only to be turned away, then charged $1,000. It's ridiculous.*

*Few here can afford decent mental health care. A worldwide problem.*

*And no one finds a "cure" in a psych ward. They get stabilized if they are very sick -- many with schizophrenia, other psychotic disorders, bipolar, SOME suicidal people -- as I said, if you are in serious trouble.*

Take Care,

Le Chat


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## Ruhtra

Le Chat : I had been (mis)diagnosed with schizophrenia and clinical depression and I had ''suicidal thoughts''. Which apparently is a good enough reason to keep someone hospitalized for several months, in France. But many patients stay even longer. A guy in my unit, he had been there for two years !



> But I'm especially curious Ruhtra how and why they would put you in hopistal for such a long time? Was it a private hospital? Most people in the US can't even afford that. Even for the sickest of patients. And the wealthiest can't get beds either.


No, a public hospital. And for people who suffer from serious illnesses, Social Security covers 100% of the costs. Why they kept me for such a long time, I don't know.


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## Guest

Hope ur feeling better today missjess.

Someone mentioned dp is a 'mild dissociative disorder'.. I don't agree. Dp and dr can go right to the end of the scale.


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## missjess

Thanks philo

And after hearing ur story I can believe that too !!!!


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## missjess

Ruhtra said:


> Le Chat : I had been (mis)diagnosed with schizophrenia and clinical depression and I had ''suicidal thoughts''. Which apparently is a good enough reason to keep someone hospitalized for several months, in France. But many patients stay even longer. A guy in my unit, he had been there for two years !
> 
> No, a public hospital. And for people who suffer from serious illnesses, Social Security covers 100% of the costs. Why they kept me for such a long time, I don't know.


It's so common for phys to diagnose schizophrenia to just about anyone who looses the plot.


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## missjess

surfingisfun001 said:


> .


?


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## wise

Be a fighter stay strong..Demons are hard to deal with but don't let them get to you. Monitor your thoughts and try to find peace somewhere as elusive as it may be.


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## missjess

Yeah thnx....


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## Guest

missjess.. it may not feel like it right now, but every time you get through a terrible patch like this, you get just that little stronger you know?

Hope you're having an okay day!

Take care.


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## lautje

I really didn't want to take meds to. And I know most of the time its not helping with dp. 
But I was at the point you ate right now and I have a child so I tought I have to try it. 
Only the first 3 days where hell but with oxazepam I could do it. 
Right now I don't have side affects, I can laugh again, enjoy thing again. Do things again and want to stay alive. 
My anxiety is ALOT less , I still have dp but a lot less.

I know someone who had dp for 11 years.She started medication for the first time and now she is 100% dp free.

Meaby you shouldtry it. Sometimes you just to tired to do it yourselve. I was.

You now what I say to myself. Some people need medication because they got a infection like in there longs. They don't feel shit because they have to take medication. I need done medication because my thinking has a infection 

And I tought if I want to end my life, why wouldn't I try any thing first.


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## missjess

Thanks guys ....but I haven't had anxiety for a long time that's just it.

It was more the symptoms of emotional numbing and some dr that is fucking me off.

I'm fine, I can do normal things. But everything is without emotion, I don't think that's something an anti depressant can help me with.


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## sunshinita

You can at least try before being so stubborn,just give it a chance


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## missjess

I have been looking into 5htp to help me with depression anyone used that before ?


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## lautje

But from a depression you can feel like that to.And anti depressant can make you feel happier. 
For me it really did.

Just give it a try if it won't work you can stop and all the side affects will be gone. 
I


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## sunshinita

lautje said:


> I really didn't want to take meds to. And I know most of the time its not helping with dp.
> But I was at the point you ate right now and I have a child so I tought I have to try it.
> Only the first 3 days where hell but with oxazepam I could do it.
> Right now I don't have side affects, I can laugh again, enjoy thing again. Do things again and want to stay alive.
> My anxiety is ALOT less , I still have dp but a lot less.
> 
> I know someone who had dp for 11 years.She started medication for the first time and now she is 100% dp free.
> 
> Meaby you shouldtry it. Sometimes you just to tired to do it yourselve. I was.
> 
> You now what I say to myself. Some people need medication because they got a infection like in there longs. They don't feel shit because they have to take medication. I need done medication because my thinking has a infection
> 
> And I tought if I want to end my life, why wouldn't I try any thing first.


When I asked my doctor why are there so many people that have DP for 10,20,30 years and never get better? And he said to me-I bet they never tried to cure it.(meds)


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## Ruhtra

False. Antidepressants, especially SSRI's, can have heavy side effects and some can last months, even years after you quit. Not to mention they have been proven to be absolutely ineffective in treating depression. I wonder how psychiatrists can be allowed to prescribe such poisons. And yes, depersonalization is a mild disorder. You're not going crazy and nothing's wrong with your brain.

Lautje : I suggest you check out the video in my signature.


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## sunshinita

SSRis and SNRIs are nothing like MAOIs that have a lot of side effects. SSRis and SNRIs especially the second ones are proven to not have that many side effects and if they do they last for 1-2 max 3 weeks. In my life I took two different kinds of SSRIs and once SNRI and the only side effect I got was a weight gain and when you stop the antidepressants and when your blood is antidepressant free you start to lose weight on your own. It helped my depression,my anxiety,OCD thoughts and DP. I was a normal person again.And I know a lot of people who take antidepressants because I was a psychology students and, trust me, they do MIRACLES and save lives.


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## sunshinita

Antidepressants work that way. In the first week your symptoms worsen, everysymptom you have you feel it twice as bad and it's not a secret, You shoul keep it together for 2 weeks and then you will see the light,my friend. And from what I know you shouldn't mix 2 or more antidepressants,if you take one it should be just ONE,if you mix them it's dangerous.


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## sunshinita

And if someone hits the rock bottom as a lot of people on that forum, I really can't see how trying a medication can make it worse,seriously!If you are already thinkg of suicide well an antidepressant can't make it worse,it will either help you,or not.

The choice is yours to make.


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## sunshinita

The chance of dying from antidepressants is equal to the chance of dying from any kind of medication if you have an alergic reaction to it,you can even die from a tomato alergic reaction.It's a fact some people don't react well,some do but it isn't proven to NOT help with depressions it's nonesense,it helepd me and a lot of other people,I don;t think it was magic. Some brians react to it,some don't ,I highly doubt that if you try you would die. Sometimes it's your last hope to feel better.


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## Ruhtra

I had the worst panick attacks when I was on AD's too. Things started to get better as soon as I quit. Enough said.


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## missjess

Fearless said:


> Some people act like they have unlimited days to waste.


And what exactly are u getting at with this comment


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## missjess

In my opinion anti depressants can Deffinately help in times of crisis...I used to be on Lexapro in the earlier years of DP and it rlly helped get me back on track and onto recovery until I didn't need them anymore.

But I just don't feel I need them now, I'm all for natural anti depressant supplements tho so ima look into them.


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## missjess

I hated going thru the trial and error period with anti depressants ... I tried Effexor & pristique back when I used to get panic attacks it was hell lol

Lexapro works for me so I'll stick to that one for if ever I need it


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## sunshinita

Eveything is individual,for example Effexor was the best for me,I am not taking it now because my DP is not that intense this time,if it gets worse I will take it again.For now I am taking just my Omega 3 and vitamin B complex and I drink a lot of tea ( it calms me down immediately).


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## lautje

There always be a discussion on meds . 
I really didn't want to take them to. 
But for everyone its different . It can help you or it can make you feel worse . But if you allready think about suicide why won't you try that first. 
That's what I thought.

i'm taking lexapro and I really do not have side affacks . I ques i'm one of the lucky ones. 
And it really helped me to feel more happy.

4 Weeks ago I just wanted to die, or just wanted somebody to give me something so I could sleep all day and wake up when dp was gone.

But its everyone's own choice. 
But you really can't say meds are always bad because for some people its a life savvier. And don't have side affects.


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## lautje

I forgot to say. 
That I don't think meds us the only cure. 
Now that I feel better and have the energy again and the willing to live, I'm gonna work on myself. 
Find out why it keeps coming back.


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## wise

Fearless said:


> Some people act like they have unlimited days to waste.


I think this mindset promotes dp, good call


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## missjess

Right so it's ok for everyone else to state how they feel and to for me when I'm having a bad moment?

Get fucked ... Don't post I didn't ask for ur input


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## missjess

*not for me


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## missjess

No one said anything about "promoting DP"

I'm just having a bad moment, and I have every right too after struggling with this shit for almost 7 years now. Doesn't make me any less of a person and negative. There are many ppl on here who are and do get fed up with this shit...I too am one of them.


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## missjess

Huggy Bear said:


> I hear ya. I have DP burnout, too...


Omg u just stated the perfect phase for this experience "the DP burnout" !!! Well done that's exactly how I feel

How long have u been in this for huggy bear ?


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## Guest

.


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## missjess

Thanks delicate and I completely agree with u....it's only when I do inner child work and acknowledging myself that I can pick myself up. But yeah I just feel burnt out at the moment ....seriously

Huggy that is horrible I'm rlly sorry to hear that...how old r u and where r u from ?


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## branl

TOKE 3 BRANDS of 5htp, total shit.

plus I think serotonin fluctuates , thats why when you eat carbs u feel better etc

thats the big pharma saying dopamine, serotnoin, norepherene causes depression..i think depresison can alter these to some degree but its more than that.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Depression-Cure-Program-without/dp/0738213888/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1376916753&sr=8-1&keywords=6+steps+depression

best practical no nonsense book on depresison, very much simplified. or download it for free internet


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## Ivan Hawk

Surviving depression takes a lot of mental and physical changes of habits that cleanse the body of the depressive curse.

Most articles about curing depression are complete b.s. that just keep depression alive... and medicine won't do anything long-term.

Most advice on depression is absolutely not helpful, WILL not help.

- depression affects everyone in very unique ways because it infects our core fundamental aspects of who we are... identity, purpose, dreams

There are enduring ways to evolve the body and mind out of it.

You have to test the human limits to the extreme - learn your boundaries well from experiences. simply engage more new experiences too

It takes gaining a serious reassessment of who you TRULY are and building greater PURPOSE to live.

Rebuilding FIRE that depression is extinguishing.... rebuilding through highly mentally and physically engaging stimulating (quite the shock therapy) experiences and engagements that contribute to your true purpose.

that and having more dreams and goals. Not letting go of future... but embracing and focusing hard of the future and now. letting the past be the past. The past can have great stories, but let it be the past and not the prime focus.

do things right and the brain gradually modifies its physical structure out of depression

simply: gradual consistency of stimulating changes and various positive constructive habits make the change

also: the more truth you learn about anything in your body, the more you now know how or how not to control it. Learn a ton more about anxiety and suddenly your coping strategies get more powerful and effective. same for depression while you reduce it gradually.


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## D'annie

this is my version of what this has felt like...do you share some of these feelings? I made a video below


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## missjess

Yes


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## Midnight

Fearless said:


> What some of these people call depression is maybe the victim ego state. Which will not respond to any type of medication, or self-talk.


Can you elaborate on this a bit please? Remember reading something about being incapable of having positive thoughts that had something to do with this and i felt like it matched me


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## Guest

Ruhtra said:


> Le Chat : I had been (mis)diagnosed with schizophrenia and clinical depression and I had ''suicidal thoughts''. Which apparently is a good enough reason to keep someone hospitalized for several months, in France. But many patients stay even longer. A guy in my unit, he had been there for two years !
> 
> No, a public hospital. And for people who suffer from serious illnesses, Social Security covers 100% of the costs. Why they kept me for such a long time, I don't know.


Well, this is news to me. But France offers socialized medicine yes? Indeed it seems you were misdiagnosesd with schizoprhenia. That is beyond me. And how you could be kept against your will -- I don't understand that. Were your parents involved? Any other family member who could get you out?

I did do some research and there does seem to be some debate about mental health care in your country -- about length of stay. Very different from the US. I'm sorry you had to live through that!


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## Guest

Midnight said:


> Can you elaborate on this a bit please? Remember reading something about being incapable of having positive thoughts that had something to do with this and i felt like it matched me


I looked this up myself as this comes from yet another school of thought -- now I forgot -- Transactional Analysis -- I'll have to Google again to be sure.

"TA is a neo-Freudian theory of personality. Berne's ego states are heavily influenced by Freud's id, ego and super-ego, although they do not precisely correspond with them.[5] A primary difference between Berne and Freud is the former's treatment of the observable transactions known as "games". A number of books popularized TA in the general public but did little to gain acceptance in the conventional psychoanalytic community. TA is considered by its adherents to be a more user-friendly and accessible model than the conventional psychoanalytic model. A number of modern-day TA practitioners emphasize the similarities with cognitive-behaviorist models while others emphasize different models."
--------------------------------

*"The Victim:* This player gets their needs met by having other people take care of them. They tend to blame others for whats wrong in their lives and play the "why dont you, yes but" game or the "I cant do that, because" game.

_Victim Ego States..._


Stuck in First Position the Victim vacillates between the feelings of the Vulnerable/Needy Child and the Angry/Rebellious Child - One moment expressing helplessness and hopelessness...the next throwing a temper tantrum.
When the Victim can't get someone to persecute them, they turn their own Critical Parent inward and persecute themselves. When they can get someone to persecute them, perhaps by playing a game of "Kick Me", they can feel fully justified in their Victim role."

----------------------

I agree this "victim ego state" is a variation on a personality problem. IMHO this is neither clinical depression, nor reactive depression (normal grieving in respones to a loss, etc.) Clinical depression is not fully understood, but it is clearly a medical problem -- post-partum depression as well. Researchers have already been wokring on a blood test for depression. I won't post any article but one could look in PubMed or Fierce Biotech Research. Possibly Google Scholar.

Also, antidepressants do not make one "feel happy." They can bring someone out of a pit of hopelessness and despair, feeling dead, having no ability to function. Antidepressants can reduce anxiety. And everyone responds differently to all types of antidepressants. Also, some medicines (of various types can CAUSE clinical depression.)

They can be used to jump start a recovery process as someone said. Or someone may need to take them for a long period of time.

I fully advocate seeking help if one is genuinely suicidal. Reaching out is critical. You don't want suicide as an option. And falling into a suicidal state is very strange. I've had that thinking 3 times in my life. In two instances, going OFF of a particular medication caused depression to lift. In another instance I needed an antidepressant as I wanted to die. In all three instances I knew exactly what I would do. It wasnt an idea; it was a strange feeling of relief and was almost a peaceful feeling. When I have come out of suicidal thinking I say, "WTH was that?" "How could I have been thinking that way?"


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## Guest

> Some people act like they have unlimited days to waste.


Right. Sounds like my mother again who would say to anyone who didn't get something done in 2 seconds -- "Shit or get off the pot." Said that to me as early as I can recall, to my father (who left), our housekeeper (who wanted to leave but needed her job), and my mother would talk about her patients this way -- a psychiatrist. Just a peach of a person. She had no friends. *None.* She was divorced twice. Brief failed marriages. She hated her sister and her brother. They were "low clas" compared to her. Etc., etc.

What I learned was that this was no way to treat me, my father, our housekeeper (who basically took care of me), no way to speak to any of us, or any person for that matter. This is what used to be "normal" for me but I knew it was cruel -- I saw my father's hurt and rage. I worked through this to find I was not as useless as my mother made everyone else (but herself) to be. She was superior everyone in her own mind. She truly believed that.

I no longer believe it. But it is more difficult to feel self-condifent.


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## missjess

Le chat

Can I just ask u...in all this time uve been DPD ... What have u been doing to build up ur identity again? I know u say uve been pretty active, you have friends...u do things...been to therapy groups. Do u participate in any hobbies, things that u love?

I'm just rlly curious to know wat u have done. Thanks


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## missjess

Fearless

As much as you call "DPD ppl" stuck in the victim state this is simply not true....it's more of a feeling that you have lost a massive part of yourself that u don't have nothing left type state....victim state was before DP which most likely was severe codependance


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## missjess

And I would also like to comment on your attachment theory above.

The 3 ego states you speak of is actually your child self (you) your mother self ( persecutor or rescuer) and father self ( persecutor or rescuer)

The reason why ppl with disorganized attachment split is because they are mimicking what happened all throughout there childhood and it is unresolved relationship dynamic struggle inside yourself between child, mother and father. So if u have a father who persecutes you in real life you will have that aspect inside you as your father model, if you had a mother who was the rescuer then that's ur mother aspect inside of u and the of course you have yourself.

It's about unresolved self states inside you because of awfull parental role models. So resolving your parental states would be the way to go...changing your inner states to kinder inner parents.

Mayb this can shed some light on that for a better understanding


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## missjess

I like to call it surrender state because u have nothing left...ur spirit is dead


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## missjess

I never said nothing can't be done about it tho.

I was just saying what it is


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## Cotillion

Fearless said:


> I believe DP is something like a fixed state of the victim. DPd people are "Professional Victims". Doesn't matter what kind of help, advice, suggestion they are give, they either find a good sounding excuse for why it is not the solution, or ignore it.


Interesting. I had an argument with my mother yesterday, which turned out to be beneficial because it let my victim state resurface, and actually resolved a thing or do, but I'm not going to get into the details.

What I want to say about that state is that it's fucking difficult to describe. The picture I drew in my mind in order to describe it is kind of ridiculous to be honest, but I think it does the trick: picture a lion who has been maimed. You're born this awesome creature with unlimited fighting potential, then something terrible like that happens (let's say some sadist cuts off your paw and leaves you there) and you're basically left with nothing. You still try to live, but the more you try, the more you see, how hopeless it is. After a while, you just give up, because there is simply nothing for you there.

[edit]

Actually, I think I should expand on that.

Obviously, that state is caused by trauma. For me it's disorganized attachment acquired from early childhood + the continuous emotional abuse I suffered later on, and the abuse I inflected on myself with my fucked up thought patterns.

The more I analyze that state, the weirder picture I get, at least how it operates in me. The most fucked up thing I've discovered is that one part in me doesn't want to recover and actually gets off on the misery.

Then it gets even weirder, there's another part of me that cannot accept myself and the state I'm in and always seeks to improve something, whether it's my surroundings or myself - that's probably the part that is fucking with me the most. I cannot remember the last time I woke up with a sense of peace and knowing that everything is okay, there's no rush to improve things.

Anyway, I know that description is kind of inconsistent and weird, but that's how it looks like.


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## seafoamwinterz

DP is only bad when you think it's bad.


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## Guest

missjess said:


> Le chat
> 
> Can I just ask u...in all this time uve been DPD ... What have u been doing to build up ur identity again? I know u say uve been pretty active, you have friends...u do things...been to therapy groups. Do u participate in any hobbies, things that u love?
> 
> I'm just rlly curious to know wat u have done. Thanks


MissJess,

Didn't see this.

SInce around five when I first had DP/DR and a lot of crying spells and anxiety, I did everything I could as a young person -- all of the things I loved -- mainly because I wanted my mother to love me, yet on the other hand to get away from her -- which I did when I started university. Sing, piano, dance, theatre, etc. I went to a private school. I have a BA in Liberal Arts/Psych and an MA in Film/TV production. I worked on a popular TV show as a production assistant in the 1980s. (FOX studios) Boyfriends/best friends in school/university. Friends at work.

I am married. I have raised many pets (dogs/cats long gone) -- my old terrier is now 15 and 1/2!

Problem: no break in the DP -- ever -- which has worn me down -- I can't lie. I worked my entire life at someting, up until 1994 when I lost a great PT job to the Northridge Earthquake, lol -- the freeway collapsed and I couldn't get to my job. I have been everything from waitress, librarian, literacy tutor, working backstage in regional theatre, research assistant to a mental health attorney, and the biggest thing which I have always done is mental health advocacy. I got into that way back -- work with NAMI. Assistant at mental health half-way houses, etc. (All of this in California) .. here the same. I go to local/state meetings, conventions, etc. Raise funds.

Also I always take continuing education, etc.

SO, I can't say I haven't tried like Hell to live a normal life.

Getting older with this is not easy. I will be 55 end of the year. I deal with the DP much better, but get depressed a lot, and extremely anxious.

My projects now (interrupted by surgeries since 2010 which really piss me off)

1. Memoir of my life with DP and abuse -- I have the bulk of it on my website and am fleshing out much more of my experiences. I have about 250 pages completed -- hardest thing I've ever done -- pick at it every day -- it is worse than writing a Master's Thesis.

2. Preparing (again) to speak publically -- it is very difficult for me to speak in public (and I used to sing and act) to try "In Our Own Voice" for NAMI and Active Minds. Speaking about my experience. I want to join a chorus in January -- singing again -- what I wanted to do my entire life

3. Taking community college classes (one a semester) to see if I want to apply for an MA/MS in Public Health. Not sure.

4. I listen to music and dance

5. Yoga

6. Cancer support center. Take classes there (cooking, shoot the breeze with other survivors, etc.)

7. READ.

I do a lot more.

The key:

1. Regular routine - up every morning for coffee out with someone or on my own.

2. Project for the day -- volunteering, errands, endless house repairs, depending on the day

Go to concerts, movies -- I am seeing a play starring Helen Mirren in about 2 weeks and am ready to faint with excitement.

Travel -- I visit friends or they visit me, I love the Northern part of my State

So, for since a young girl I have tried to excel and have suceeded. I have been suicidal and I have been engaged in activities. I have been hopeless and hopeful.

I do what i can do. I have decided I am through with therapy. I have group therapy which is very relaxed -- no therapist -- just sort of an AA model.

Keep going, even wen I feel hopeless.

Hope this answers your question.

And yet, I still have DP/DR 24/7, 365. But it isn't as scary as it was in years past. I have adjusted to it. I have bad episodes now and again, but fewer than when I was younger. And don't think I'm mad as Hell about all of this. And don't think I don't have very bad days/weeks. You do what you can.


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## missjess

Wow I'm actually really impressed... You have done and achieved a lot. I'm actually puzzled as to why you are still DPD ?

Perhaps you have unresolved hurt still deep down?

Congrats on doing all that you have done tho its very impressive, you have still lived your life and still are that's great


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## Swansea

Fearless, do you think it's possible to have these states with just depression too? I find myself going in and out of different consciousness states which i would directly correlate to mood. I feel lucid one week and then one morning I will wake up and feel dpd or depressed. I get completely what you are saying by whatever state you are in your thoughts reflect that. And that your thoughts really aren't a pervasive reality more a mirror of the brain state. I try to keep a journal to keep track of those thoughts and the state that it reflects. Its really very bizarre because when I am feeling depressed or dpd the thoughts I attract are isolation, depression, rumination, low motivation, social isolation, and fear but when I am lucid a cloud lifts and i can connect to thoughts of motivation, activities that will engage me in life, friends, dating, sex, etc. At this point I am just trying to stay lucid which is really difficult. I feel a multitude of things trigger my dp and depression. Even as simple as recently the protein i had been using as my protein shake had an herb in it that I believe set me off again. Maybe that's a cop out but I feel very sensitive to a lot of triggers physical or emotional.


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## missjess

I find it comical how so many ppl are asking fearless questions on my post lol
Why not pm him instead? Any if you have to ask ppl for questions about urself constantly then that proves that u don't trust urself and ur continuously looking for approval and advice when u have the answers inside yourself!!


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## Swansea

missjess said:


> I find it comical how so many ppl are asking fearless questions on my post lol
> Why not pm him instead? Any if you have to ask ppl for questions about urself constantly then that proves that u don't trust urself and ur continuously looking for approval and advice when u have the answers inside yourself!!


That was kind of rude. I read this post from beginning to end and was sparked by something fearless said and wanted to create dialogue. I learn and realize myself through communication and dialogue. That is my style. It's not validation that I'm looking for if that's what you're getting at.


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## missjess

I wasent just talking about u I was referring to everyone on this forum...why don't u just pm him ?


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## missjess

Hahhaha well I don't blame u then.


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## ShouldHaveTakenTheBluePill

ive come to the belief that dp can also be due to dopamine/adrenaline deficiency. mix that with childhood issues and such and your in for a ride! best of luck.


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## missjess

Yeah I'm in agreement with u


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## Swansea

missjess said:


> I have been looking into 5htp to help me with depression anyone used that before ?


I just started taking it today. I'll let you know how it works/if it works. My current supplement plan is 5htp, b-complex, b12, mega-dose fish oil, ashwahganda, skull cap, magnesium, zinc, multi. And I take an anti-histamine for anxiety which just sedates my CNS it isnt mood altering.


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## clockwork8

King Baba said:


> You're talking about it as if it's the same for everyone -- it's not. It "certainly" can't be cured with drugs? How do you know this for certain? By saying this, you're potentially dissuading people from getting the help that could possibly alleviate the mental anguish they're experiencing. Don't do that. And if, like you say, it's a dissociative disorder, then that means your brain chemistry is altered. And the thing to change your abnormal brain chemistry would be drugs.


You can't "cure" any psychiatric condition with drugs. You could suppress the symptoms until you cure it, or for the rest of your life, or something you're doing while on drugs may cure it over time without your awareness (i.e. you're on drugs for 3 years and during this time you move to a new house and live with new people and you change as a result). But it will not make the cause of a psychiatric condition be "cured", it just suppresses the symptoms. This is basically true of drugs that are used for many physical conditions as well.


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## clockwork8

whatislife69 said:


> ive come to the belief that dp can also be due to dopamine/adrenaline deficiency. mix that with childhood issues and such and your in for a ride! best of luck.


Could you provide some evidence as to why you believe the part about these neurotransmitters? It doesn't really make sense to me, especially the adrenaline part.


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