# You Are NOT Going "Crazy"/Schizoprhenic



## MasterMind. (May 9, 2008)

There is a common symptom-phenomena anxiety disorder sufferers will experience, called "depersonalization and de-realization". These occur commonly in patients with anxiety disorder and sometimes also with clinical depression patients, who suffer with co-existing anxiety and are very concerning to them. What I wish to do in this article is to explain what these symptoms are and to offer some comfort to those who may suffer Anxiety Disorder by relating the fact that both of these are experienced commonly with these emotional disorders and the vast majority of the time, they are neither harmful nor dangerous.

First let's look at "depersonalization". This symptom phenomena commonly found in anxiety disorder sufferers, but especially those with panic attacks, is a symptom-induced experience, where a patient feels they are "unreal", like they no longer exist as a person. They may even feel they have become invisible and that others around them are real but they are not. Some patients describe it as feeling like being a robot and no longer like a human being. Patients have described episodes for example, of looking at their own hand, in front of their face and wondering if it is really there. Patients will also describe experiences of looking into a mirror and actually feeling as if they do not recognize them selves and they feel as if they are having some type of identity crisis. Obviously, these are very scary and very unpleasant experiences for anxiety patients and ones they certainly do not want to continue or reoccur.

These episodes of depersonalization are reported by some anxiety disorder sufferers, to happen immediately preceding the onset of a panic attack or with other severe anxiety symptoms, while others experience depersonalization during an attack of severe anxiety or panic symptoms. Once the depersonalization symptom is experienced by some anxiety suffers, they report that it will occur more frequently and will be triggered more easily, even with less severe anxiety symptoms.

"De-realization", is similar but in this case, that which seems to become unreal, is the person's surroundings. With de-realization, an anxiety sufferer will have episodes of experiencing feelings that their surroundings have become unreal. They will feel as if even reality itself is no longer something they can fully grasp, during those moments. They may even question the existence of things and wonder if life itself is a dream of some type. Some descriptions I have heard of this experience are; "like being inside a bubble", or "like trying to see everything, through a curtain" and "like everything is covered with a thick fog".

Many anxiety sufferers, will experience both depersonalization and de-realization, at the same time or these may alternate, so that they experience each at different times. During episodes of either, they will also commonly have mind fog, meaning they feel hazy and unable to concentrate. These features only add to the unpleasantness of these experiences.

What causes these strange feelings of depersonalization and de-realization that are so concerning to anxiety sufferers? Well we know the "fight or flight response" itself is a protection mechanism, created in us, to help us flee or flight danger and to help us perform more powerfully, with important tasks at hand. These unreality type symptoms, where things seem to become unreal, is very likely part of that same protection mechanism. It may be that our minds will cause ourselves and our surroundings, to temporarily fade from our minds, in order for us to concentrate more intensely, on locating the actual danger that threatens us. It is similar to the reason an anxiety patient's mind will race, because it is trying to scan for dangers that have threatened them and set off the fight or flight response. We also know that all senses are heightened during strong anxiety responses and this too likely adds to these feelings of unrealities.

What is important for anxiety sufferers to know and to understand is the fact that these unreality symptoms, do not indicate the onset of insanity or of one losing their mind. They are very common occurrences with anxiety conditions and will not cause damage to a person's mind or sanity. This fear of going crazy is a very concerning one to those who experience severe anxiety and also those with clinical depression and these two often co-exist but are irrational thoughts and will never take place!

True psychosis, the true term for one actually losing touch with reality and having actual delusions and hallucinations, is the term for actual mental disorders that may or may not have significant emotional aspects to them. Anxiety and common clinical depression are both in the neurosis category, meaning they are stress related and not caused by an underlying mental disorder. Persons with really severe forms of depression, such as Bipolar Disorder, may have psychotic episodes but your more common type depression, called Clinical or Major Depression, is not in the psychosis category. Estimates by some Mental Health Organizations state that psychosis affects an estimated 1% of the U.S. population, whereas, the more common anxiety and depression conditions, affect a much, much higher percent of the population.

Patients with severe anxiety conditions need to learn not to fear these symptoms because adding more fear will intensify and extend the duration of these episodes. This is of course more easily said than done but with time and effort, those with Anxiety Disorders can learn to have less and less fear of these unreality symptoms, to where these symptoms are what fade into the background rather than the realities of self and surroundings.

If you are an anxiety and/or depression sufferer and are concerned by these unreality type symptoms, I challenge you to do a search on the internet, using the search term "Anxiety De-realization and Depersonalization" and you will find many other articles stating how common these unreality symptoms are and the fact that they are not dangerous. In fact do another search, using the term; "Anxiety Depersonalization and De-realization, neither harmful nor dangerous" and you will find even more articles that will help you. These unreality symptoms are common and not dangerous.


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2008)

But do you think someone stressing themselves out 24/7 going on ten months straight with unrelenting dp/dr can do permanent damage to themselves?
My dp has led to severe depression , suicidal thoughts, and unremitting anxiety for which I refuse to go on meds for. I think my ocd contributed to my condition. The hardest part for me is accepting this is just anxiety because my ocd tells me I'm actually dead.
People tell me but your here and I see you, but to me it's not just as simple as that. How do I know where not all dead and everything is just an illusion. How about the people who die so fast they didn't know what hit them and are now floating around in limbo still thinking their alive? Sounds crazy I know.


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## MasterMind. (May 9, 2008)

NOT AT ALL. From PERSONAL experience, I've been in DP/DR hell for 5+ months & am NOW getting a grip on myself. The problem with a lot of people is they expect immediate results, myself included! Over the coarse of these past 5 months. I realized that I wasn't giving it time. These past few days i've noticed a HUGE improvment, even NOW i'm looking at things & seeing them ALMOST so clear, i'm RIGHT THERE. The problem is people don't give it time. You just have to realize that this is NOT permanent & you CAN overcome it, it's a struggle but you can do it!

Distraction (for me and a lot of others) is a HUGE factor, if not the hugest! The 1st day I just did anything to get my mind off of it, I cleaned my house, went outside, & EVERYTIME my mind started to drift back to my DP, I would sing, or do ANYTHING to get my mind off of it. Even when I wasn't feeling different right away, I could feel SLIGHT changes, my perception on what DP was started to life. Even today i'm still going through it, but it's like it's lifted 80%! I'm more calm, & am in the stage where i'm accepting it & just doing what I can to move foward.

I believed I had brain damage when I got off antidepressants, but EVERYBODY told me that it wasn't brain damage, doctors, thereapist, they just said it was in my mind. It's true!

Start now! Stand up & say NO MORE! go do something productive! Get your mind off the DP, but don't give in when you don't see immediate results, but just accept it & know that it'll get better, cuz it will! I PROMISE.


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## MasterMind. (May 9, 2008)

If you want more of an imtimate converstation, feel free to send me a message or we can converse on AIM! I know the hell us Dp/Dr's go through, after seeing/feeling hope, I know it's possible for ALL of us to get through it!

Any of you feel free to hit me up! I'm there for y'all! :mrgreen:


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## cyberafrica (Feb 14, 2008)

Hi Mastermind

Thanks for your very rational explanation of DP/DR.

This is what all DP/DR sufferers need is reassurance. What I seem to see is the "time factor", on how long it takes to recover from DP/DR, and this is a huge variable.Some people take months, others take years.

I reckon a big question is also, what about drug induced DP/DR? I can only relate to my own experience, where I was experiencing a lot of stress with prior panic attacks, but had pot which "triggered" the DP & DR. I am still trying to convince myself that I have not gone mad, as I have had it for 18 months now, where I have reached a "plateau", where there does not seem to be any change. One would want to measure some sort of progress, but unfortunately I have not, in fact some days it feels like I am going backwards.

So would you say a way forward with DP/DR would be to let it run its own course, and not put any time frame or expectation on it, when one would feel progress? By having this attitude, one would be less inclined to get frustrated or push up one's anxiety levels. Or another way of explaining it, would be to let the "fire burn out" in its own time.

Would be great to hear your view on the above.


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2008)

Dear Mastermind,

Did you write that yourself, or did you get it from a summary? I think that should be posted at the top of the Main Forum, in the Intro Yourselves section, and who knows where else. The subject heading should be, *You Are Not Going "Crazy"/Schizoprhenic*
*Note I hate the word "crazy" as it is a derogatory lay term to me, but it means something to all of us.

If you could get the source, I'm going to PM this to Revelation. I know the Links section as well.

Thank you. It's a great summary and is my theory behind DP/DR. I think bottom line, in most cases it is a secondary symptom to anxiety. When it is chronic it is more or less debilitating, but I still see it as secondary. I also see that in my case it was a learned behavior, wherein I didn't know what was happening to me, got no help, etc.

This reinforces this so much.

Thank you!
What is the primary source?

I will PM you as well.
Dreamer 8)


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2008)

Hi Dreamer. Same here. I had no idea what this strange feeling was and what was happening to me therefore my mind thought the worse and shut itself down. I had no idea people actually experienced this. I also received no help and family and friends said it was all in my head and I was simply sufering from depression, but I knew there was more to it. My dp I bellieve came from a nervous breakdown triggered by anxiety and stress. The depression came afterwards and no matter what positive things other people say to me to try to overcome dp, my ocd thoughts keep me locked in this condition. Horrible. Any tratments or medications work for you.


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## MasterMind. (May 9, 2008)

http://hubpages.com/hub/anxiety-deperso ... ealisation

This is where I got the article! =) It truly is inspiring & soothing to read it. I agree, this should be pinned! A lot of DP/Dr could be prevented or at least rid of quicker if people realized just exactly what it was!

_So would you say a way forward with DP/DR would be to let it run its own course, and not put any time frame or expectation on it, when one would feel progress? By having this attitude, one would be less inclined to get frustrated or push up one's anxiety levels. Or another way of explaining it, would be to let the "fire burn out" in its own time._

From my personal experience, my DP/DR only reached an all time high because I fed into it. I was SURE that my brain had been damaged from smoking weed / and because of taking antidepressants. I know for a fact that if I never had gotten the thought of "brain damage" in my head, I would've never went down this hellish road.

I wouldn't say you have to sit around & let it run it's course, however it DOES take time to overcome DP/DR. The main thing for me was getting fed up with it & taking control of a horrible situation, & am I glad I did! One thing that I KNOW helped is DISTRACTION from it. I basically went through steps, I sat down & told myself that this is DP, it's a chemical imbalance & that it WILL go away, IF I let it. The next step was getting off my ass & distracting myself, whatever it takes just DISTRACT yourself until you get to a point where you start to see a difference, it's hard believe me but it's a surefire way to overcome it! I can honestly say just 4 days into this, I already feel 90% better! Sure I still have moments where I feel it, ONLY because I let my mind drift back to it, but I simply just do anything to get my mind back off of it & pretty soon i'm feeling almost totally normal! So yes time is a factor but it's also self determination to take control of your life & not fear the fear of DP. I deal with depression & anxiety as well, but like anything, you take one step at a time.

I added you on AIM but didn't see you online, so when I do I'll IM you & talk to you more about it, I am living proof that you can overcome DP, just like any challenge in life, with willpower & determination, you will win.


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2008)

Excellent. I have asked the site admin if this could be pinned as noted. I also book marked the site. I may link it from mine. What is frustrating is, for those of us who've had this for so long, it sort of "gets in a groove." I could have used this board about 40 years ago, and I ain't lying.

This should give newbies a lot of hope.


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## Neil1427 (Jul 18, 2008)

Wonderful post!

I would love to hear you thoughts on...

I've only recently found the accurate diagnosis of my illness (DP), rather than General Anxiety Disorder, which is pretty close ?. 
I've been fighting mine off slowly (distraction, etc..) and using SSRI's which are working. I've come from being unable to communicate and freaking out every 2 mins (24hr panic attacks), to now 3 years later a good job and now looking to travel and see old friends in Aus.

My anxiety is based around, not being ones best, example, saying the wrong thing or not just not thinking clearly enough to be who i know i could be, and a full relapse.

I love to read that we can fight our way back to a full fix, which i feel im closing in on with a 80% recovery to date. However my concern is that many people, including myself always refer to a high percentage fix but never cured/resolved. This may well be because the people who make it dont come back to keep talking about their 100% cure, or is this an 'illusion' of nearly resolving it something else we create??

This illness exists because we are aware of it... True irony!


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## sgravel (Dec 23, 2008)

HI GUYS

I could use some help about 3 years ago I fell into the Anxity trap with horibble bouts of unreality and anxity after being on medication and lots 
of talk therapy I actually overcame so I thought the Anxiety condition I was fine for about a Year the last January it all came back but much
stronger the unreality the Anxity and then in march an odd symptom occured and its been with me for the last 9 Months I started to 
feel like I did not recognise the person I was very strange feeling. I got threw the summer by kinda of ignoring it and occupation but
still the feelings that I have with my wife and Kids even vacation was not the same It did not feel authentic and to this day these
feelings are there its like even laughing does not feel authentic the way I used to think is not the same. All day I am plagued with unreality 
and the feeling where I can not connect I get thoughts of what If I hurt someone I feel like scince I do not feel like myself that I could be
capable of doing harm or something els. Im afraid that the next step is going completly insane Please anyone can offer me some hope as to 
the recovery of this dreaded condition..


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## Monkeydust (Jan 12, 2005)

To chuck in my two cents to this...

A fear that you're going insane in these states is not only baseless, but actually very common when people are suffering from DP/DR mixed with anxiety.

It actually results from a very logical, i.e. non-schizophrenic train of thought. Your brain is, in effect, processing the idea:

1. I feel like I'm disconnected, losing grip on reality and so on
2. This clearly isn't right, something has to be wrong
3. Therefore, I must be going insane

And this fuels the anxiety and keeps it in a loop.

I have seen countless people express a fear like this, and without exception none of them has gone insane, or developed schizophrenia. The fact of the matter is that schizophrenia and other psychoses follow very different paths to this. Usually the person developing the illness will not see it as "going insane" at all, merely as something that happens. It's been said before and I'll say it again: if you think you're going insane, the chances are you're not.

MonkeyD


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## FireBird (May 2, 2009)

its so wrong to call, schizophrenics "crazy." They are human, just like the rest of us. I have been diagnosed with schizoaffective disorder....does that make me,"crazy?" I also have a lot of schizophrenic friends, and they seem perfectly fine to me and are very nice. Its a bleeping chemical imbalance! What I think is crazy are true psychopaths which is NOT the same thing as a schizophrenic. Psychopaths, or anti social personality disorder, they kill people for the fun of it and don't even care what they did. Now that is crazy! Schizophrenics are rarely violent to others, but sadly they are to themselves. Suicide is very high for them...in fact 10% succeed. I am not insane or crazy in the least bit. They're coming to take me away, he he! I love that song!! Just needed to educate people here! Do the research here, people!!! I know its a common fear of people with DP or DR that you are going "schizophrenic" like its the worst thing on this planet.....you know, being schizophrenic. It can be successfully treated. People think I suffer from "delusions" of the "bizarre" type. I have seen the evidence of it, it HAS to be real! I have symptoms of DP/DR all the time, but not the actual disorder. I think its part of being over stressed in life. Especially for the last few weeks! I just "love" being depressed!


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## dxstarr (May 15, 2009)

You are so right!Most schizos i know are perfectly "normal" LOL


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## FireBird (May 2, 2009)

Are you being sarcastic? I bet you don't even know any "schizos" at all by the look of your message. After all, you did laugh. Please don't shoot them down.


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## dxstarr (May 15, 2009)

No i wasnt being sarcastic.I really mean it.My best friend was diagnosed with schizophrenia and he is one of the best friends Ive ever had.Two of my other friends also are schizophrenic and they are really good people.I would never make fun of people with any disorders...especially not schizophrenia because, although I myself am not schizophrenic, I have seen what distressing effects it can have on one's life.Im sorry if I made it seem as if i was laughing by putting the "LOL" lol. its kinda a habit for me to put lol in messages :/ haha


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## FireBird (May 2, 2009)

Thank you so much!! One of my best friends is schizophrenic. He is very nice and you wouldn't even know anything is wrong with him because he is getting proper treatment. Sorry if I hurt you. Yes, it was the "lol" that kind of made me wonder. Once again, sorry.


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## dxstarr (May 15, 2009)

really?aww well thats good I'm glad for him!
lol its cool sometimes internet talk can become a little ambiguous


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## IFEELWEIRD (Jul 4, 2009)

DpDream said:


> But do you think someone stressing themselves out 24/7 going on ten months straight with unrelenting dp/dr can do permanent damage to themselves?
> My dp has led to severe depression , suicidal thoughts, and unremitting anxiety for which I refuse to go on meds for. I think my ocd contributed to my condition. The hardest part for me is accepting this is just anxiety because my ocd tells me I'm actually dead.
> People tell me but your here and I see you, but to me it's not just as simple as that. How do I know where not all dead and everything is just an illusion. How about the people who die so fast they didn't know what hit them and are now floating around in limbo still thinking their alive? Sounds crazy I know.


exactly what i felt when i got depersonalization. i guess im crazy then...


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## jfromaz (Mar 23, 2009)

No not brain damage, dp/dr & anxiety can cause mental anguish, but it does subside if you go about it the right way.


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## anxietyboy (Aug 3, 2009)

IFEELWEIRD said:


> DpDream said:
> 
> 
> > But do you think someone stressing themselves out 24/7 going on ten months straight with unrelenting dp/dr can do permanent damage to themselves?
> ...


I think it is just human nature to think about these things at times. The human brain is the most complex biological machine to ever exist on our planet, it has to be normal to have a few problems controlling the damn thing lol


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## dancintrulife (Jun 18, 2009)

But what if like me you've been dagnosed with both dp and schizophrenia, how can I know I'm not going crazy? Please.


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## herb (Dec 29, 2009)

thanks all this page has been a great help as i think i have (dp/dr) and have had it for 18 months have been poping in here for 2or 3 months and it helps so thanks to you all


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## Mario (Oct 26, 2009)

Wellcome to the forum

All the best


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## S O L A R I S (Dec 24, 2009)

Hey,

I was wondering if anyone has this symptom. Lately, I have been having a hard time going to bed. I get immensly terrified, Its like someone is watching me - or maybe its me freaking out at DPDR, or maybe im being paranoid Im not sure.

Later, when I close my eyes I get these wierd thoughts, visions, what I am not thinking. It really becomes like watching a faint hologram of some sort. Its weak visuals and mostly thoughts. Its freaky. I get scared of closing my eyes, because I dont want to see the visions.

I dont know if this is schizophrenia or just panicking. Can anybody relate?


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