# Confessions of a SEX junkie



## sebastian (Aug 11, 2004)

Okay, okay...now take SEX out of the subject heading and replace it with "masochism", "self-destruction", or something else along those lines. You see, "Confessions of a self-destruction junkie" just doesn't have a snappy ring to it. Nor does it have that sensationalistic swagger. I needed to get you here to read what i wanted to say, and thus i needed a grabber for my subject heading. Sorry. Didn't mean to manipulate your limbic system or anything, but that's the way these things are done. But here you are! Bravo! And since you've already read this much, you might as well read the rest. 'Twon't be long...

After quite some time analyzing oneself, one can arrive at a few immutable truths. I've found out some things about me these last few weeks, and while i suppose i've always been aware of them on some level, realizing it in all it's logical lustre certainly gives one a new perspective on one's own psychology. I have noticed that i am, without doubt, a Destruction Junkie. Let me explain a little of what i mean...

For as long as i can remember i have wantonly craven the excesses of life. I have never been satisfied with just a little of anything. How do i express this without making it sound like a virtue?

I drink a lot. Like, really, quite a helluva lot. Ever since i was 19, i've drank excessively. And i don't mean "excessively" by the standards of medical doctors or a similarly stodgy perspective. I mean like if i was on a barge with some Irish sailors, they'd probably have an "intervention" to try to get me to slow down. I don't keep a flask at my work or anything (although now that i think of it, that doesn't sound like such a bad idea), and i don't drink "excessively" every night (although there is rarely a night that will go by when i won't indulge in an aperetif or two...or three). But when the weekends come around, i drink like Dean Martin at a Vegas strip club. I'm never satisfied with "getting drunk". I seem to want to achieve alcholic oblivion every time i go out, and often succeed in doing so. I've been sick this week, so i didn't go out last night, but even staying at home i managed to polish off a 1.5 litre bottle of wine. I went to bed at about 5:30, but then sprung out of bed at 10. It's like my body just says, "Oh what's the point in making him sick, he's just going to do the same thing tomorrow, might as well get an early start."

I guess that all sounds rather frightful. Strangely, i wouldn't consider myself an alcoholic. I don't NEED to drink. I just enjoy it a lot. But my point here isn't specific to drinking...it is the excess of it that i'm alluding to. Another example:

I gamble. Quite a bit. I've recently discovered the joyous world of online poker. I've blown a couple of grand over the span of a month. And it's strange too. It's not that i'm a bad player. I'm actually quite good. The problem is that if i win, i'll just gamble more and more money. There is no ceiling too high. I suspect that if i won a million dollars on a lottery ticket, i'd gamble to make it two million. It's absurd. I'm like Philip Seymour Hoffman in that Owning Mahoney movie. I'd reckon that throughout my life i've lost close to $50,000 gambling in some form or another. And yet, i wouldn't consider myself a gambling addict. I never spend more money then i can afford. I can go extraordinarily long periods without gambling. And I really could stop anytime i wanted to. Again, the problem is with the excess. It's almost like i WANT to lose, if that makes sense. If i'm up, i'll keep gambling until i lose.

Smoking. I don't smoke anymore, but i did for a long time, and let's face it, it truly is a ridiculously self-destructive habit.

Eating. I love food. Thankfully, i have a metabolism that works extra fast so i'm not yet obese. However, i'm not exactly washboard stomach man these days either. The thing is, i will gorge myself on food. I'll eat until i'm completely stuffed. Instead of eating dinner and feeling comfortably full, i'll order another round until i can't eat another bite, much like that guy in Monty Python's Meaning of Life.

Relationships. I am simply never satisfied. And it's so stupid because i should feel lucky to get just about any girl, let alone the fastidious standards i've set the bar at. Every relationship i enter into is doomed from the start because i will immediately go into sabotage mode, ultimately undermining any chance of happiness i could have had. It makes me want to weep when i think of the chances i've had in the past to really get intimate with a woman. I've had a few long term relationships but i sabotaged those as well, or i was just outright rejected.

Basically it's this: Any time things are going well in my life, it's like a part of me is looking for a way to make me fail. It makes so sense. If i'm drinking, i want to pass out. If i'm gambling, I want to lose. If i'm in a relationship, I want it to end badly. If things are going well in my life, if i've got a good job, enjoying my interests, etc. I will find a way to make things go wrong. Paint myself into a corner. It happens time and time again. It really does. And i just don't understand it.

I think this has a lot to do with my DP. I think it's caused by anxiety and this personality conflict. I guess part of me is somewhat relieved at all of this because to know that DP is based on a personality disorder, rather than something biological, i think gives us all a beacon of hope. We can change it if we really have the will to do so. But changing one's personality after decades of indoctrination, is damn near impossible. How is this done? And can any of you relate to any of this?

Thanks,

s.


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## person3 (Aug 10, 2004)

sounds like you're having a form of extreme impatience

you have to do something to excess to block out any sense of ambivalence or even feeling

maybe you don't want to face the feeling of "i don't know, i'm scared, i could lose this good thing" and sit with that.

or you put so MUCH investment into that "good thing" (like the job or relationship) that you cannot possibly AFFORD to lose it unless you destroy it yourself. Maybe this because you are convinced that that particular good thing is the ONE thing you need or the thing that will fulfill you.

And you don't want to feel bad when you don't expect it.

Truth is, we feel good and bad whether good things are happening or not. You can be in a good relationship and feel bad about it or something else and there's nothing wrong with it...happiness is relative. It seems like you're depending on these external things to make you happy. So you try to control them as much as possible.

But the real way to cope with things is to go through them, let them happen, and survive the outcome. not destroy it first or drink it away or control it. You seem very afraid to just let things happen in your life that are out of your control. I hear you there 

It seems like you're afraid of living life the way it is supposed to be lived, with its ups and downs and its discomforts; you have to be able to know what you'e going to feel before you feel it, etc.

And don't use time as an excuse not to change your personality. I was as hard-headed at age 19 as some people were at 40 and it had nothing to do with time. Time will only make habits more comfortable and such...but don't hide behind a long-time personality disorder and think that you can't change yourself because of that. You may not WANT to change yourself. But you can.

You may not necessarily be an addict of one substance, but your behaviors seem to follow some traits shared by alcoholics and such...you can go for a long time without a binge (such as gambling) but when you do it you are out of control. And that out of control "you" is probably the part of you that comes out after a long period of too MUCH control.


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## Dreamer (Aug 9, 2004)

Dear sebastian,
Since you mentioned one of my favorite films -- Owning Mahowney sp? -- starring one of my favorite actors -- Philip Seymour Hoffman, I have to respond. I am also rather low today. Just can't get going.

Remember in Owning Mahowney at the end, the psychiatrist asked him, "How would you rate how you feel when you gamble, on a scale of 1 to 10?" He said "A 10" (He may have even said "A 20") Then the psychiatrist said, and w/out gambling, your normal life?, I think Mahowney said "A two."

But of course in that film he was arrested for what he had done and had to try to confront all of this. He had destroyed his life, his relationships, lost his job, etc. He said something like, "I guess I'll have to live with a 2." Somthing like that.

Strange, you remind me a bit of our Martin here and of Mahowney. Sort of an "all or nothing" stance on life, but being extremely self-destructive. Losing $50,000 isn't ... well it isn't good. I'm not judging you, but Hell, I could use that for a downpayment on a condo right now, LOL. I'd have a place to live instead of throwing my money away on rent.

It sounds as if you have addictive behavior at minimum. And it seems addictive behavior is like a high that makes up for an internal emptiness like the dude in the film.

My father was a surgeon. But he was also a gambler. Horses, stock market. He also had OCD/hoarder-clutterer, and was basicially an unhappy, anxious man. He was meant to be a bachelor. He married my mother at 50, they had me when he was 53, and she tossed him out the door soon after that. He couldn't handle responsibility. It terrified him.

I'm not sure what would have helped him -- he might have had some response to Zoloft if there had been any in his day (he was born in 1906), but he also didn't believe in psychiatry at all. I also don't know where this came from as he came from a family of 4. His 2 brothers were all fine and successful, and his sister was a regular housewife. To the best of my knowledge, she was "high strung". I never met any of them but one was a playwright, one in the military, and of course my father was a surgeon. But of course, emotional problems can affect anyone, in any profession.

I'm wondering if this isn't sort of a compulsion to either break away from feeling empty? I forgot what you wrote already, as I've seen this pattern in a number of people I've known. An inner sense of ennui, for lack of a better word, or a sense of worthlessness. That film was incredible. Captured the whole thing for me.

Did you connect with the film, or does any of this make sense.

All I know is how unhappy my father was. How he couldn't have normal relationships with people/women -- he was passive/self-conscious, and the "risk taking" I think was a high, and was self-destructive hence proving him right that he was "not a good person."

I didn't know him that well, but at his funeral, many people came. MANY. And what really flipped me out was a woman who came up to me. She said, "20 years ago, I had lung cancer, and your father operated on me. I am alive today because of him, and that's why I came to pay my respects when I saw the obituary."

So many different facets to him. He also was known to throw a fit and fire all the nurses in the operating room if they made a mistake. Real rage that I NEVER saw. He was never angry with me.

Very complex person, as was Mahowney. In certain ways, Mahowney and my father seem very alike.

Do you connect with any of this?

Best,
D


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## person3 (Aug 10, 2004)

Dreamer,
that story about your dad in the operating room kind of reminds me of the movie the cutting edge, where the hockey player is like "you know, I dont think she even enjoys ice skating"

its like a person keeps going, blazing a trail and getting more and more impatient w/those around them because hell it's probably not what they want to do anyway and they're doing it to prove something


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## Dreamer (Aug 9, 2004)

person3 said:


> Dreamer,
> that story about your dad in the operating room kind of reminds me of the movie the cutting edge, where the hockey player is like "you know, I dont think she even enjoys ice skating"
> 
> *its like a person keeps going, blazing a trail and getting more and more impatient w/those around them because hell it's probably not what they want to do anyway and they're doing it to prove something*


Very interesting, that last paragraph. My father was so proud of being a surgeon. He went to Harvard. That was a HUGE accomplishment for a kid from a no name town in Ohio near the turn of the last century!

Strange thing is, I don't think he ever believed that he graduated from Harvard and became a doctor. He was the "pride of the family" so to speak, yet even his accomplishments meant nothing to him. I fully believe he wanted to be a surgeon. He was good in Chemistry/Science as was my mother. BOth were sort of destined to go into medicine.

It's odd though, my father was both proud and afraid of being so successful. The success held great responsibility. Yet, I know that in the operating room he felt most in control. Being a hoarder-clutterer he lived a life out of control -- a mess. But in a sterile, organized operating room where you have a VERY specific task -- remove this lung, cut here, suture there, etc. -- he felt "under control."

I can't figure him out, other than that he was unhappy. He enjoyed certain things, like reading literature, he loved Jazz ... all sorts of music, he loved travel.

I can't explain him, and we never had time to talk until near the time he died. He was very awkward in social situations.

A true enigma.

Sad, I'll never really know him. He died in 1990. I can't believe it. He was literally 53 years older than I. People though he was my grandfather. Very distinguished, handsome. You'd think he had the world in his hands. And he felt very lost.

I'll never know why.


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## Guest (May 15, 2005)

You know, I'm a person of excesses too. Sex, drugs & rock n' roll has become my motto lately. It's a long story that lead up to that.. I probably reached a breaking point a few times with relationships to get to the point where I don't want a relationship. I just want a lot of sex, if I had the money & the means I'd smoke pot constantly but actually I don't have any idea where to get the stuff so I haven't actually had it in forever. But I do have a few of those legal alternatives that are on the net. There's more out there than I could ever afford to try though. They're so-so. The real deal would definately be better. I love food too. I grew up always being fat, I'm losing weight and dieting now, it's hard though because I'll always love all kinds of food. I love all kinds of foreign food imaginable. I'm not much of a drinker, just one drink can make me deathly ill most of the time. That's probably because I used to drink so much underage that by the time I got to 21 my body had had enough. I know I'm afraid of life and being alive. it's the reason I've enver been able to sleep much. For many, many years I've jsut tossed and turned and couldn't sleep with dread of being alive for the next 50-60 years and I wake up with the absoulte deepest dread of having to live forever and do hard labor forever because I was born poor and that's all I'lle ver be worth. And I even wrote something similar to what someone else here said in my lyrics before. Minutes feel like hours to me, hours feel like weeks, it really feels like eternity that I have to be here and suffer this life. I very much want it over with, although I'm not interested in killing myself.


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## Rektchordz (Feb 6, 2005)

what the fuck?!!!!! i think u just explained my life, get in contact with me mate, [email protected], ive never heard anyone with dp say stuff that really hits the exact point.. and yes its its quater to to four and im really drunk, and ive had enough i hate dp more than anything right now, i know alot of u are probably say ooo whata twat.. yeah get drunk and that will. make it better.. but ive had enough.. ive gone into dead mode.. the only reason im still alive is for my mum. jx


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## CECIL (Oct 3, 2004)

I'm going to hijack your thread and go off on a bit of tangent, but its relevant to the self-destruction thing.

I do it to - if I go out to get drunk, I get slaughtered. I often end up in a place where I just want to drink myself to death. Self-harm factors in here - I often (not as much anymore though) would throw myself off balconies, cut myself, punch walls and the like all while getting as smashed as I could. Same sort of thing with pot although it tends to make you more mellow.

I look at my life and I see myself repeating the same patterns and cycles over and over. I am overweight yet I eat too much junk food and don't excercise. I have been smoking lately. I drink and take drugs. All of these things I know for a fact are detrimental to my health yet I can't seem to stop myself and I can't seem to care that I am destroying myself.

I live in a share house and we are completely filthy. I mean nothing gets cleaned until its beyond funny (mould growing on the dirty dishes, for example).

Its like I am stuck in a decaying cesspool and all I want to do is to decay more. I hate myself for not having the will power to break the cycle and so the cycle continues endlessly.

My latest tendency towards paranoid delusional thought is that I am not actually a human being. I don't possess one of the most fundamental instincts of life - self preservation. Not only do I allow myself to decay into nothingness I also deliberately harm myself (self-harm) and even consider suicide. Its discusting.

It really highlights something that was posted a few months ago - once you have opened that "corridoor" to the possibility of your own demise then revisiting that with every ounce of your being becomes a permanent fixation.


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## sebastian (Aug 11, 2004)

Thanks for the responses all, and the advice as well. Some of it was right on the money.

I think what's interesting about this though is that i'm able to actually dissect my personality to the point where i can see that this causes this, that causes that, etc. Alas, i'm still far from being able to modify these personality defects in a way that will effect change.

I can see that the DP is caused as an outgrowth of my obsessive anxiety. I can see that the obsessive anxiety is an outgrowth of my personality type. And I can see that my personality type is effected, in a reciprocal way, by the things i do...actions i take...negative emotions i perpetuate by doing these things.

And it all boils down to the naked truth about it all, which is that i have problems dealing with (as Person said), control. Control over myself, over others, over my destiny, etc. This single aspect of my personality is, i suspect, effecting all the others in immeasurably detrimental ways, which manifests itself in the behaviours aforementioned. Ultimately, i assume, it's that atavistic fear of the unknown...of death. Everything else is really just a microcosm of that fear.

I guess the question is though, if i know this, how can i change? It seems such an arduous task. I've tried to change my behaviour soooo many times before and i always end up back in the same place. I really think though, that if my personality can change, if my actions become more positive, then the anxiety will subside, and the DP will vanish. Is this a reasonable assumption? I've had the DP go away for very long periods of time just by forgetting about it, relaxing, doing other things. If you rip out the foundation, does the whole dp house collapse?

DREAMER: I quite enjoyed that film as well, and yes i saw a lot of myself in it. Not so much in the sense that i was filling a void in my life. I mean, i don't think i'd put gambling at a 10 and the rest of my life at a 2, but definitely the compulsion part of it. My favourite scene in that movie, and i think one that typifies the whole illness, is when he's at the casino, and he's actually up something like 7 million dollars! He now has the money to pay off the enormous debt he had dug himself into. He even has a few million of his own to spare, where he could quit his boring job, hop on a plane with his wife (who i felt horribly sorry for, i might add), and go island hopping the rest of his life. And yet what does he do??? *He keeps gambling!!!* And it's funny because John Hurt's character, the casino boss, knows him so well, and he says something like, "Don't worry. He has to lose all."

I identify with that quite a bit. Of course, in my case, it happened on a much smaller scale. I was up about $6,000 when i had just gotten my student loans, and i would have been set up for the entire year. And set up in style at that. I had the student loan money plus this $6,000 that i'd won at blackjack over the span of a week. I even had a job at this point as well, and so i was just flush with cash while the rest of my friends were struggling to find beer money. But did i stop? Did i tuck the money away for later? Did i have one big party to be remembered for generations of university students to come? God No. I marched back to that casino again and again until i lost every dime. Not only did i lose the $6,000 i'd lost, but i flushed out most of my student loans in the process. It was horrible. I'll never forget that night.

But yes, i very much so identified with Mahoney. Another bit i liked in that movie was how the casino boss had that janitor or whatever he was, hang out with him, just because Mahoney happened to eat some of his ribs that time. Hilarious. That's a true story, in case you didn't know. Poor schmuck.


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## gem (Aug 10, 2004)

Sebastian, here is my view on this. I have a feeling that it is very difficult for you when you succeed. You may be afraid of failing. I believe you can reach your goals to succeed but you are frightened. I set goals to high for myself and and then sometimes do not reach them and then I am very hard on myself. You seem to tend to do things that keep you from succeeding. For me the problem is reaching the goal and keeping it. Once I am able to do things I then feel scared because my illness I know at some point will make it difficult for me to keep up. I could be wrong on this just a thought.

gem.


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## Guest (May 16, 2005)

One of the hallmarks of Ego Strength (or mental health, if you will) is this question: what does the person do in response to not having what they want?

Some of us throw tantrums (literally, or symbolically).
Some of us destroy meaning in everything.
Some of us reach for "fixes" at every turn - as desperate as if we were literally addicted
Some of us reach for fixes and at the same time destroy things. Take with one hand and wreck with the other. We are Zues and Hera - creating all, destroying all at will. And we live in a 3 by 3 patch of ground, never going anywhere. 
Some of us shut down and feel nothing because the pain/humiliation of longing is too great.
Some of us "destroy the world" 
Some of us are able to take the best of what we DO have and build something progressively better. But that requires (i) being able/willing to SEE reality and (ii) tolerate the pain/frustation of seeing ourselves as less than Special or Extraordinary in the Larger Scheme of Things; (iii) while holding onto (i) and (ii) without denying them through alcohol, delusion, symptoms, or fantasy, begin to deal with Reality as it IS, and let go of the hopeless grudge we have against it for what it ISN'T and never wil be.

I've said it before, and shall say it again. It's VERY very common to see DP states spring up in people with severe narcissistic disorders. They are some of the HARDEST disturbances to treat because the work requires the patient to ENDURE/tolerate not feeling good about him/herself enough to FACE reality - without reaching for a "quick fix" of "Grandiosity in A Bottle" (or whatever form the fix takes)

it took me YEARS guys, years...and it was hard hard work.

But...if you can change these kinds of reality-disturbances in yourself, you'll be free of symptoms...and life is GOOD on the other side (despite your convictions that it wouldnt' be worth living)


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## Dreamer (Aug 9, 2004)

This is an incoherent rant, forgive.

Firstly, I find it fascinating how many MEN on this board ... and perhaps the board is skewed... are incredibly self-destructive. My sense of course is that this was part of you *before* the DP. Also, I think men self-destruct in more "masculine ways", more dangerous ways, have much higher risk taking behavior. I don't have statistics on that so I may be totally wrong, but it's what I see here.

I'm not physically self-destructive, and I don't sabotage myself with rec drugs, gambling, risky behavior....
but a lot of things that hit home for me actually in this.

I am at a nadir right now to be honest -- haven't given up on life completely but haven't been out of my apartment for about a week for lack of any motivation, lack of any good feelings about the future.

Someone here said, they have given up on life but doesn't even consider suicide as an option -- I feel exactly like that. I believe these feelings I have will pass, but I can identify with that. I'm not actively self-destructive in that sense, but passively self-destructive. I've sort of "given up" right now. Thrown up my hands at the crap thrown at me.

I've had some incredibly stressful things happen to me in the past few months and have found I have one physical disorder that can be limiting (but I don't want to go there), and another that is reminding me I'm getting old (don't want to go there either). I feel old at 46 and am not looking forward to things as I had last fall.

Right now, I look at my life with complete hopelessness to be honest, and I was very optimistic last fall.

*Gem* mentioned "fear of failure" -- I put my father into that category, and I put myself in that category for most of my life. Right now, I couldn't care less. I actually feel cursed right now. Kicked in the stomach just the right number of times to keep me from getting up for a while.

I was so excited about change and good things to come, and I literally in real life get socked with painful stuff that is really too much for me to handle. I've really withdrawn and shut down, though strangely my DP/DR is not a big problem right now. I'm more depressed again.

Anyway, my main observation is the powerful self-destructiveness of many men here on the board. The women can be self-destructive as well, but some of the men here even in this brief thread -- everyone seems to have "given up."

All I can say is, I feel that it has always been in my personality to see the worst possible outcome in things, and yet to push ahead when I can. Yet sometimes there are points where things are too much. And one sort of self-implodes in one way or another.

I don't even know what I'm talking about. But right now, I can't get anything accomplished. Nothing. I'm afraid of the future, and I ask, in my pitiful way, "Why me?" "How is it I ended up in this situation?" For me, the thing I ask is, "Why don't I have a family?" Why can't I pick up the phone and say, 'Mom I'm feeling lousy right now'" I NEVER could do that. My mother didn't give a shit about how I felt. I'm angry about that. That I have no family, etc.

I don't think I fit into the active self-destructive category here, and I guess I'm just venting again. But I feel passively self-destructive again, depressed, imploding on myself. "Why me?" etc. My life is one damned soap opera of misadventure it seems.

My personality doesn't allow me to take these inevitable life blows and keep going. I start giving up. And as I get older, it is more and more difficult to find hope, security, happiness. I feel worn down.

End of rant.

And *Sebastian*, yes, that film was brilliant. John Hurt was excellent as the casino boss, and it was indeed hilarious that the waiter, or janitor who brought Mahowny ribs is suddenly promoted to being his "escort". I loved that film. And yup, that was a true story. Happened in Canada in the 1980s I think? One of the largest embezzlement cases in the history of Canadian banking. I think Mahowny actually embezzled about 10 million from that bank he worked for.

*All you men who posted here.* You remind me in one way or another of my father, who while dying, said in a lucid moment, "I was a terrible surgeon, I was a failure." And yet many people came to his funeral to recognize all the good he had done as a doctor for so many years. He never believed it. And he self-destructed to add insult to injury.

Cheers all :roll: 
Sigh,
D 8) 
I have GOT to get out of this apartment or I will ROT. It is, for me, a giving up, that is self-destructive. But the men here have such dramatic ways of hurting themselevs. For women it is more "private" personal destruction? I don't know what the hell I'm talking about.

Everyone should see "Owning Mahowny" -- a real gem of a character study, based on a real person. Brilliant acting by Hoffman and Hurt.


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## Guest (May 16, 2005)

For me, I was carrying constant rage - CONSTANT - at the world. I detested reality.

ON good days, when it looked like maybe I could control reality, I could stand it. But as soon as IT loomed larger than moi, I rebelled. Sadly, like many people, my rebellion was in the form of self-destruction. Like Rumpelstilkstin who got so angry he stomped his foot through the earth and it swallowed him up (that part of the story always freaked me out by the way)

It wasn't just that I didn't know how to live, it was also that I didn't WANT to live unless I could make reality bend and swirl to suit me.

Until I started to really see how much of a lifelong grudge I carried against the world, I made no substantive change.

This is why for ME, I keep emphasizing that it's not necessarily enough to love/accept oneself, etc....some of us are carrying banners of rage and making them our lives. If we can FACE how much we CHOOSE to hold onto our hatred of reality, we can maybe make different choices.

It can be very useful to really LOOK at self - and see how much we hold our breath to teach the world a lesson.

Mental strength is measured by how we do or not cope when we are face to face with the inevitable failures to have reality be the way we want.


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## Monkeydust (Jan 12, 2005)

I'm probably guilty of many of the behaviours that Janine listed and can relate to much of what Dreamer said as well.

I'll often go for "all or nothing". If something in my life doesn't turn out exactly how I think it should - or if some minor aspect goes wrong - I'll often act "as if" all if lost, which really is pretty silly, but I can't help it. I'm working on it.

One thought that comes into my mind when reading the list of maladaptive behaviours Janine listed is that they often seem, in a way, childish. It's as if many of us, myself included, aren't reacting in a mature to way to things in our lives, that we don't accept things going wrong, get self-destructive, give up in resignation and self-pity or do something similarly irrational.

It's almost as if, in a way, we haven't "grown up yet".

It's the worst thing for DP, since, in the first place, such traits help to bring it on, and, as well as this, they perpetuate the suffering by aiding an irrational and ineffective reaction to them.

I like this thread, by the way.


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## Guest (May 16, 2005)

Like you Dreamer I feel Im at the end of my rope. I have given up and have no idea how to get through-or get back- to an energy level that I need to continue with my life.

Also my destructiveness is passive (in the sense I dont actively harm myself: gambling, drinking (sometimes though), cutting etc. I do smoke myself to death almost and isolate myself. Your post resonates with me, because Ive had quite the same week(s) as you had, thats why my response. Im not posting much here lately, since I need all the energy for myself. I cant think straight, my mind is a mess, Dp is a mess, Im a mess.

Ive been working on myself for the last 15 months in grouptherapy, 4 days a week. Its coming to an end next week. Ive been looking in a huge gap from the time Ive known I will quit. Im fearfull, have nightmares. I can now see the therapy was way too much for me, and the last few months Ive been spiraling downwards. Complete madness. I have things I can do to continue with my life, but honestly, I dont want to. I feel Im at the end of my rope and want this kind of life to end. I will continue with individual therapy, but I actually dont want that either anymore. But suicide is not an option either.
I dont know, the pain is getting to much to deal with. My battery is empty.
I think of wanting to die, but its not that I want dead, I just want the pain of life to stop and I dont know how to do that anymore.

I know Im resisting the change, but I just dont want to get back to how my life was before I went to therapy, and that is what is happening now. I have to move on, but Im burnt out.

Anyway, good post Sebastian, and I learned a few things from other's posts.
Its good to be able to share this, makes me feel less alone.


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## terri* (Aug 17, 2004)

To Wendy and Dreamer,

If someone you loved needed you to be there for them *right now*, could you ?

terri


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## Guest (May 17, 2005)

Sebastian two words............addictive personality.
I've known many addicts over the years and what has struck me is that they are either completely out of control (while thinking they have it together)or they are totally in control.
Control to the the point of almost being OCD.

Addicts are excessive people.They switch addictions for eg give up drinking take up exercise,work or study to excess.They are rarely moderate type people.

If you went along to a narcotics annon and just listened in,I'm certain you would here people singing your tune.

Male addicts can have big egos.They loath to see themselves as ordinary.
They get a thrill out of living on the edge,pushing limits and fucking things up generally.
I know a few recovered ones who are forever restless.They either move all the time or keep stopping and starting new jobs or projects.
They just never seem fulfilled.

You might well dismiss my observations(particularly if you have an addictive personality lol).
Sorry but when I read what you have written,I personally couldn't say it resonates with me but I sure I have heard the story before.

Best Shelly


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## Dreamer (Aug 9, 2004)

terri* said:


> To Wendy and Dreamer,
> 
> If someone you loved needed you to be there for them *right now*, could you ?
> 
> terri


*Terri*, that's an excellent question. I think I could say yes. The sad thing is, I don't feel there is anyone in my life right now that needs me like that. I want to be needed, and I feel less and less that I am loveable or wanted myself.

Very good question. Very sad.

*Wendy* sorry you are in the dumps.

*Shelly*, yes, addictive personality was my first impression, and if it isn't one addiction it's another. Have you seen "Owning Mahowney"? Mahoney was "owned" by the casino so to speak, or more specifically by his addiction to gambling.

Ah, terri, all I want is a normal life right now. I can't seem to find it. And there's always a new curve ball.

Feeling quite sorry for myself.
L,
D


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## terri* (Aug 17, 2004)

Dreamer, my friend, I _know_ you would be there for someone else.

I want to be needed too. I feel I can climb a snow covered mountain with a raincoat and a pair of flipflops on if someone needs my help. And yet, I can't get out of the bed some days because there is nothing for me.

What are we to do about this? How can we find energy and life to save others but not ourselves?

I feel sorry for you and me both. If I could get to you, I'd get out of my jammies right now, come to your place and throw myself in to helping you move and get things in order and make you laugh. I truly feel I could gather that kind of energy. And I would feel good for that moment in time.

Help me learn not to just love and help others but love and help myself...amen.

Smile sweetie, at least you're younger than me. :wink:

Love to you,
terri

Shelly, you always have excellant post, Mate.
Wendy, I've sent you an email.
Sebastian...that was a dirty trick using the S word to get me to look. :lol:


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## terri* (Aug 17, 2004)

Oh yeah! P.S. like the Hairball :shock: always has to do. :wink:

Dreamer, I know what I said is old, old hat to you, but worth mentioning out loud now and again.

Now, I'm finished. lol.


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## Guest (May 17, 2005)

I'm really only responding to the first post. Thanks for messing with my mind and getting me to read on :wink:

I relate with your self-destructiveness. I also do it on a regular basis. I think I'm an extremely productive person. When I'm in a "good" phase, that means I work alot toward positive things. When I'm in a "bad" phase I'll work hard too, toward making it worse. Really, it may just be a problem of too much energy (kidding of course).

I'll drink every day for a month. I drink with the purpose of getting drunk (I posted in the "DP stories" board section a poem on this particular subject if you are interested). I switch kinds of alcohol alot. Sometimes I wine-binged, sometimes beer binge, and only when I go out do I hard-liquor binge, which only happens in really disconected-with-the-world times.

I also wouldn't consider myself an alcoholic. I will spend long stretches of time without drinking at all... during the "good" phases. Like everything else in my life, I shuffle from side to side. There is never a middle, just two extremes.

I often wonder which preceeds which. Does the feeling of disconnectedness come first, and thus lead me to alcohol. Or is it the other way around. I think the feeling comes first and I'm just looking for a way to block it.

If it's not alcohol it will be pot. Again, I'll spend days smoking all day, and then stop altogether, in regular intervals. Sometimes I wonder if bipolar doesn't really apply to me. Doctors have suggested it before, but I don't read myself in the description of all the symptoms. The only thing that really points to bipolar is the cycling aspect of my behavior. I've discovered more and more that I can't recall experiences from one phase when I'm in another. A weird form of amnesia.

There's also the food issue, but not in excess. When I decide to let that self-destructive aspect of myself come out, I can easily loose alot of weight, to the point that it is noticeable to others. I stop eating with the goal of destruction in mind. This always goes along with alcohol or pot. It's a very bad mix. That kind of food-control + alcohol only happens about once a year. Thankfully.

I really don't feel I am dependent to drugs or alcohol. I feel I'm incapable of feeling (again, refer to the poem I wrote). Like Sebastien said, the point seems to be to self-destruct. And the weird thing about it is that you are conscious of that goal. I drink, smoke, restrict my diet to numb out feeling. When you don't eat much you don't do much, you don't participate in life as you would. With alcohol or drugs you really disconnect. That is why I do it. I know it's awful for me but it's something that seems beyond my control. Since I'm not going to take meds for it, whatever it is, I'll have to figure other ways.

And then, when I'm not drinking or doing anything else bad to myself, I lead a normal life. I'd say my adulthood has been evenly divided between good and bad phases. Hard to classify someone as an addict when most of the time he/she has things under control, and does not think at all about numbing feelings out.

Nancy


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## gem (Aug 10, 2004)

If you look at all the posts you can see that we are all there for each other right now. The question was would be there if needed, the answer is yes because one of our own who is suffering needed us and here we are and the posts are growing. I think that is beautiful. I think all of us here are very kind and caring people. I feel that I cannot cope with one more thing in life, I feel like all of you do , I am exhausted from all the pain and trying so hard only to find that each day is bringing more than what I feel I can handle, but for some reason I keep hanging in there in hope that someday we will see the rainbow.

In the last while I suffered the loss of a dad who did not want me, a family who did not want me. I stood in a funeral home saying goodbye to a father that could not care less how I suffered in life. I suffer like all of you with severe dp/dr, anorexia, many other physical illnessess and now just got told I have three spots on my liver. I am told I will be okay but you know I just say to myself how do I do this? How do I have the strength to keep up the fight? My answer, I come here and I see how hard everyone works at being well again and I say to myself never give up. Life is worth fighting for. Thank you to all of you for being here and helping each other everyday.

gem.

gem.


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## Guest (May 17, 2005)

Sorry to hear of the bad news about your liver Gem.
I do hope all will be ok.
In some weird way I'm almost glad that my parents died a long time ago so I don't have to go through the pain.Honestly I don't know how people do it.
Gem you sound so sweet but obviously there is a strong fighter inside of you.

Sorry to hear of others having a hard time lately,Wendy and Dreamer.
I don't know how to help but I can take you shopping,its my drug of choice,it's my pub.

Love Shelly


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## Martinelv (Aug 10, 2004)

What an extraordinary post.

Patience. Yeah. I feel I can empathise with Sebastians plight. I have the patience of a crocodile in a cage. My boredom threshold is nil. Actually, it's in negative figures. Nothing holds my attention for more than ten seconds. Nothing.

I'm bored of boozing, chasing women (which, it seems, like Sebastian, it my sole program in life) and restless like I've got sand in my eyes. What can we do ? What should we do ? I dream of being able to lie on my bed with a head full of nothing, waiting for nothing, expection (or thinking I deserve) something.....


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## Guest (May 17, 2005)

Dreamer said:


> Firstly, I find it fascinating how many MEN on this board ...


Just so you know, I am female....


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## Guest (May 17, 2005)

ashesinwinter said:


> Dreamer said:
> 
> 
> > Firstly, I find it fascinating how many MEN on this board ...
> ...


Didn't know that. :shock:


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## sebastian (Aug 11, 2004)

mrmole said:


> ashesinwinter said:
> 
> 
> > Dreamer said:
> ...


Then this is REALLY gonna shock you...here is a snapshot of me coming out of the shower...


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## sebastian (Aug 11, 2004)

Dreamer and Wendy, i'm sorry to hear you're both feeling especially down these days. I'd love to say something inspiring or helpful but i'm too drained right now to write much of anything. In any case, i'm positive you'll come around, as i'm sure you both are as well. It's amazing the resilience we all seem to have. We just keep bouncing back for more, stronger each time. I was in a very bad state a few weeks ago...just feeling incomporably depersonalized. Hard to explain really...how can there be degrees of something of which one either is or isn't. But there are. And it was really bad. And these days i'm feeling all right. Extremely busy but feeling quite real. You'll both be back in the ring in no time. In fact, you're probably already there.

Shelly, I think you're right on the money with the addictive-personality suggestion. I was cringing as i was reading that thinking..."Yeah, that's me. Okay. Right. That's me." etc. Anyway, thanks.

And thanks all who wrote and contributed. It's interaction like this that keeps us fighting this monstrosity instead of analyzing it in a vacuum, which is hugely dangerous.

I've just kind of realized that this post is quite lacking. I'm sorry, but i'm exhausted and i've got to do a seminar tomorrow and have no idea what i'm going to say. Ugh. It's time for bed.



gem said:


> If you look at all the posts you can see that we are all there for each other right now. The question was would be there if needed, the answer is yes because one of our own who is suffering needed us and here we are and the posts are growing. I think that is beautiful. I think all of us here are very kind and caring people.


You said it, Gem...


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