# Naltrexone ??



## Sketch2000

He is great.
Don't know what I would do without him (despite our differences over "my story" and how I got "here"...)

Nonetheless, he usually spends about an hour with me.
Today I came prepared. I bought both books -
"Feeling Unreal" - with the pages folded on what topics I wanted to cover
"Depersonalization: A new look at a neglected syndrome" - same deal

** So we talked, a lot about things I wont mention here...but he was kind enough to read through the medication studies - especially of the newer ones including naltrexone (spelling is likely wrong, its 2:45am...lol) and the intravenous version of it.

Therefore, we made a decision to give this drug a shot. In addition to the already (recommended) combination of DPD medications I am using -

Luvox CR 300mg
Klonopin 2.5 mg daily
Lamictal 150mg daily

So I will now be switching to the generic Luvox (for insurance purposes), but keeping the same dose.
And adding the Naltrexone at 100mg daily (starting slow, then weaning my way up) to see if it has any effects.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed. The studies look promising, but I know that medication works differently for everyone.

Just a quick update. If any of you have tried it and had any good/bad experiences (I'd like to hear both), I would appreciate it.

I'm still pushing him to give me the questionnaire I gave him months ago for my disability claim, and he has recently sent back the Treating Doctors Report to Australia (as they have an agreement with the SSA); but thats a whole nother story and issue. I've been really depressed lately - if anyone ever wants, needs, or can help me out - chatting...lemme know, or hit me up on Myspace (I know...everyone is on FaceBook these days).

Its hard back at school (grad) and I'm dumber than a rock....I look around and think of the life I lost....(another thing we discussed)...

Neway, hope all is well with you all.

Much Luv.
Chris

MYDEPERSONALIZATIONEXPERIENCE.COM
MYSPACE.COM/SKETCH2000


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## Surfingisfun001

wow 100 mg of naltrexone seems like a lot. i think most of the people here who tried it were taking 2.5 mg/day or some low dose like that. if you type "naltrexone" in the search bar on the right at the top it should show you all the naltrexone posts on here. good luck.


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## lucasnevil

Hi..
i think most of the people here who tried it were taking 2.5 mg/day or some low dose like that. if you type "naltrexone" in the search bar on the right at the top it should show you all the naltrexone posts on here.


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## voidvoid

Now mimicking users is where I draw the line Mr.Bot, prepare to die by fire.


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## Sketch2000

lol...


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## Guest

I'm confused again, but was just skimming. This is oral? I thought it was IV?


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## Guest

Sorry, looked at an older post. Oral administration. Man I want this to work for you SO BADLY. I am toying with the idea of trying this, especially since both of us are on the same meds combo.

Hang in.

Also, pushing meds to high levels is necessary to bring results in some people. As noted, everyone responds differently to meds. I weigh 114, take 6mg/Klonopin and 200mg/Lamictal and 40mg/Celexa a day and they don't make me tired. I was tired when I was 5 years old. I also can tolerate anesthesia (before meds) -- my level of anxiety is extremely high -- that's my "normal" anxiety. I didn't even know for years it was off the charts. It was "normal" for me. Also didn't know that endless sadness, sorrow, crying, worthlessness was depression. Figured life was misery, LOL.


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## voidvoid

So what are these Lamictal and Celexa that i keep hearing about? Im only on Klonopin right now since I quit Lexapro a couple of months ago, and I really dont want to start taking a new medication, but I?m interrested and I might have to.


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## Guest

Inzom said:


> So what are these Lamictal and Celexa that i keep hearing about? Im only on Klonopin right now since I quit Lexapro a couple of months ago, and I really dont want to start taking a new medication, but I?m interrested and I might have to.


Inzom,

If you search Lamictal on this site or in this forum you will hear a good bit about it. It is also an anti-convulsant (I guess first marketed for that), but it is a mood stabilizer. I found that adding Lamictal ... well it VERY subtly took away my "fear" of the symptoms and I am able to "control" them better -- even bad episodes -- but my DP/DR remains chronic -- about 60% in the real world 365, 24/7, even in my dreams.

It is very difficult to explain. But this has been recommended by the IoP in London (Dr. Sierra) as well as the Klono-Combo ... the SSRI WITH Klonpin.

I have depression, but have considered trying to lower/taper/eliminate my SSRI. But slowly, as the Lamictal acts as an antidepressant (again I have mild "mood swings" that are not bipolar, but it is used for bipolar.) I went through just about every anti-convulsant -- Depakote, Lithium, Neurontin, etc. Lamictal was the ONLY thing, just like Klonopin (of all the other benzos) that helped me. I know one person whose response to Neurontin was what he would consider an elimination of the DP/DR. He is still anxious and gets depressed ... always been an anxious person -- as myself.

And also .. with Lamictal you must have a LOT of patience. You also must start slowly and build up your blood levels. It seems to take forever to do anything. But after a month? at 200mg ... something started "changing." Something for the better I simply can't articulate. And it has been my experience with certain meds, like Lamictal ... you need to push the level ... if you can tolerate it. I think people often give up at a lower dose of something when if they pushed it and waited they would see a result.

If you are looking for an adjunct med, IMHO, and I'm not a doctor, Lamictal at this time seems like a rather logical choice.

I worked with a psychopharmacologist for several years to find a proper combo.

Also, there is one risk with Lamictal -- a serious rash that can be life threatening. But if you notice this and immediately get treatment at a hospital and discontinue the med, there should be no problem. That scares some people away from it, but people have gotten such a reaction from antibiotics and other drugs. Depends on the person. "Steven Johnson's syndrome" -- forgot.

My concern with dropping my Celexa is I have been suicidal on and off a few times in my life. This is why I stay on it. I went through that recently, but was able to crawl out of that hole -- or still am -- I think due in part to the Celexa already being at a good level for me. If I didn't get better, I might have UPPED it.

These meds take TIME. And again, I don't think people give them a chance, or don't PUSH the dose, then pull back to see if symptoms return.

Then the meds have helped me with CBT to help me control my thoughts and improve my attitude towards taking care of my health, etc. When depressed, I can barely brush my teeth, not to mention trying to fight the DP/DR with all the non Rx ways.

Hope this helps,
D


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## voidvoid

Thank you Dreamer. You always take time to write a good response. I wish I had the energy and awareness that you seem to have.

Peace.


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## hd83

I'm just about to start 75mg naltrexone (I've been weaning myself up to this dose). I feel about 10 to 15% better, but not where I want to be with my treatment. I'm going up to 100mg and then may go up higher if I need to. Hope this helps!


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## Sketch2000

Heather,

I meant to ask what meds you are currently taking in addition to the Naltrexone (or what you've used, tried, or have been using before), as I am currently on the "combo" -

Luvox 200mg daily
Klon 2.5 mg daily
Lamictal 150 mg daily

In all honesty. I've felt better going down to 200mg of Luvox (generic) from the CR (300mg), but do have an increase in anxiety. But my DP/DR symptoms have been much better since starting this "liver cleanse" my nutritionist recommended (seriously) - which pretty much consists of some specific vitamins and supplements that support detoxification - if anyone wants info lemme know.

Chris


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## hd83

I am on 1mg of Klonopin, 40mg of Paxil, and 75mg of Naltrexone a day. I take the Klonopin in the morning and Paxil and Naltrexone at night time. What supplements do you take for your liver cleanse? And how have you been feeling better with your DP/DR?

Heather


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## Sketch2000

So your basically on the recommended SSRI / Klonopin dosage (although the klonopin dosage is a little low), but NOT taking lamictal...This is good for me to know, as when i begin my Naltrexone, I could have different results (we all react differently).

As per my liver cleanse, I have actually begun feeling "closer to reality". For me, my DP/DR feels like I'm either stoned when I get extreme anxiety, trapped in myself, but for the MOST part, when its not anxiety related, i always feel like i have a lower sense of consciousness or awareness. Like I can't focus / looking through a jar.

Since my liver cleanse (and I always use good supplements) I've felt considerably closer to reality (for what its worth).

Basically, for 25 days I'm taking -

- 3 B-complex's (B-right, by Jarrow formulas)
- 4 NAC (Jarrow forumals, its a great detoxifier)
- 2 (Liver support factors)
- One and Only Pure essense Superior Tonic Multiple Multivitamin

** Keep in mind, prior to this i was taking the B complex and NAC (not the liver support factors) IN ADDITION TO MY other vitamins and supplements (which are basically recommended per the books I've read from Dr. Amen and Dr. Hyman - whether they hold any real truth is another story).

The ones I take regularly (and have throughout this process) are -

multivitamin (generic like centrum, which i will be staying away from from now on per the nutritionist recommendations)
Fish oil (Life extensions Super Omega 3)
Ginkgo (Ginkgold, the most studied and used - not to mention expensive form of ginkgo available in the U.S)
Panax Ginseng (Natures Way)
Vitamin D3 (Jarrows)
Calcium Citrate (Just Citracel from the drug store)
and thats it.

So i would do -

post breakfast - 
Multi vitamin
Fish oil
ginseng

post lunch -
b complex
ginkgold
d-3

b4 dinner -
fish oil
flax oil (also cut this out per nutriotionist recommendations)

after dinner -
nac
vit c (nac is better absorbed w/ vit c)

** and always kept some space between that and my meds (i take klon 3x daily, luvox at morning and night, and the lamictal only at night).

** My nutritiojnist's exact words were - You are using all the right supplements (the only thing he really wanted to get rid of was the multi vitamin because its synthetic, and he's right. And get rid of the flax seed oil) but just not enough. Since starting, i am not lying. I have felt "closer" to "snapping" out of it. If you read "my story" Heather (not necessarily the one on my website) but my first thread. Before I started meds and was COMPLETELY DP'D AND DR'D - literally, hallucinations and everything u name it. I would have these episodes where my eyes would "focus" and it was like a "snap" and i was back and felt fine, but the minute i got anxious, ruminated, or anything it was gone. Now I feel closer to that snap again. Its never happened since being on meds but shit...if i wasn't i would not be alive now.

Chris - keep me posted.
my 25 days is almost up, then i will do another metabolic panel (labs) to check the liver function again, and then start the naltrexone.

These are -


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## Guest

HD,
Wow, I'm glad you are also in on this "experiment." I am more and more tempted to suggest this to my doctor. But I am so scared. I recently had a TERRIBLE DP/DR episode and I thought, OK, this is it, I'm done. And I pulled through, back up to this normal misery.

I am out of insurance for this year. In 2010 I will see the shrink ... and discuss Naltrexone.

I simply fear getting worse. I am so tired of all the experimenting.

You all are my guinea pigs 8) but I may be joining you.

It is SO difficult to compare experiences. I also should have liver panel done. I'm not happy that my GP moved away. He was one person who was always helpful in terms of being supportive of monitoring my blood levels. Now I have to start all over and explain to the new GP about myself. And I hope to God this person has some clue about anxiety and DP/DR as my other doctor did -- more than the medical resident I see. My fear is I will have to go over the resident's head to ask his supervising psychiatrist to give me the med ... I don't know if he will cooperate.

We shall see. I have a ray of hope. I have a great deal of fear.
One day at a time.
D


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## Sketch2000

Dreamer,

I understand. It always is a bad deal to have to explain this horrible disease all over to someone - the onset, duration, medication, etc....

** I have a bare bones insurance policy from "Cover Florida" - the Governor put in place some bare bones shit for low income people.

** BTW - My "great" psychiatrist has not responded to me in 2-3 weeks. I don't know whats going on. I haven't received the questionnaire i need for my disability claim. So now my disability attorney (the one i was working with) isn't responding either. The Australian Government also didn't receive the Treating doctors report so i got an extension and my pdoc said he re-sent it outside of regular clinic mail channels (otherwise it would take forever to get there, and that may be the reason they didn't receive it within the 28 days).

Anyway, this is really unusual, last i heard he was sick with the flu - hopefully not swine flu - the guy could be dead. he's usually somewhat good at responding to emails, calls, etc. but i haven't heard from him.

Neway, i should be starting the naltrexone in a few weeks once this cleanse is completed. Take the new book to your pdoc and tell him the success rate. Take these posts and tell him everyone is trying it.

Can't wait for socialized care.

Chris


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## hd83

Chris,

I've been trying Tommy's supplement "package" - sublingual B complex, Centrum multi-vitamin, inositol, and choline but never felt any difference from it. And since I started taking Naltrexone, all I'm taking is the B complex and Centrum. Naltrexone is pretty expensive (about $70 for 30 pills and $195 for 60 pills - I don't have insurance so it is probably less if you do have insurance). So I don't have any extra money to buy a whole lot of different vitamin supplements. So have you actually felt real and "snapped out of it" since doing your current liver cleanse? And why did your doctor recommend this for you?

Heather


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## Sketch2000

Heather,

Agreed. my insurance company actually stopped covering my medications as their is a limit. I'm taking student loans to live - literally !!!

** Neway, I don't feel "snapped out of it" or completely better, but I do feel "closer to reality" - without a doubt.

** The reason that they recommended this is because I recently had a metabolic panel done which showed that one of my liver enzymes was high (SLIGHTLY HIGH, ONLY 5 OUT OF RANGE). I didn't think anything of it, either did my Pdoc, but my PCP, thought it may be something to look at. (I have had liver enzyme levels higher than that before, way before all this shit came into my life...) So I thought I might as well. So he ordered an ultrasound of my pancreas, kidneys, gall bladder, and liver. Everything came out fine but the liver. It came up with "infiltrated fatty liver" - you can find it on Wikipedia. I believe its when fat cells infiltrate the liver. Thats why he then referred me to a nutritionist (free of charge mind you) who recommended to increase certain amounts of vitamins i was taking (i mentioned to him what i was taking but he doesn't have a clue about DP and isn't a doctor).

** Yeah, shit is really expensive, i just spent $80 yesterday ordering more vitamins to "re-up" so to speak so that I can keep it up (even after the liver cleanse, i want to keep taking the important stuff iv'e been taking - like the fish oils, ginkgold, ginseng, nac, etc...)

** And this is coming from someone who hasn't worked since November of 2007, officially diagnosed in October of 2008 (onset on June 15th, 2008 of Severe DP/DR). Neway, like i said, i had to enroll in school (half time - 2 days a week, not much) not only to better myself but to get aid, i took as much as i could, I'm in debt over 30 grand. But I have to live, and i'll do whatever it takes to get better.

** As for the vitamins, i will say this, if ANY of you are serious about taking them, make sure u talk to your doctor / pharmacist about any interactions (especially with ginkgold or any herbal stuff), and a good place to shop is vitacost.com - they have the cheapest prices, but sometimes the availability on the products due to high demand isn't so good.

I can't wait to start the Naltrexone! Your 10-15% better may be just what i need to get to 70-90 % better !!

Chris


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## Sketch2000

Hey all,

My "liver cleanse" ends TODAY!
Which means I will begin the naltrexone on Thursday - CAN'T WAIT!

Still currently on -

Luvox (generic) 200mg daily
klonopin - 2.5 mg daily
lamictal 150 mg daily

Will keep up with my supplements, although not with the liver cleanse portion.

Heather, any progress or updates?

I'm starting at 50mg then going to 100mg.

Chris


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## Sketch2000

I found this interesting site whilst during some research on Naltrexone -

http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/

Chris


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## hd83

No new updates here. I'm on 100mg still and still feel about 10 to 15% better. I'll let you know if something changes!


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## Sketch2000

Thanks Heather.


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## Sketch2000

I FINALLY got the results of my Metabolic panel (liver function tests) from my PCP after the liver flush. Everything checked out okay, therefore I will be beginning the Naltrexone tomorrow morning.

My current medication regimen consists of -

100mg Luvox (generic) twice daily (morning and night)
2.5 klonopin daily (.5 in the AM, 1mg in the afternoon, and 1mg at night)
150mg lamictal (at night)

Therefore, I will be adding the naltrexone in the AM, beginning at 50mg for 2 weeks and then increasing to 100mg.

I am still keeping a very strict and good vitamin regimen, which i don't think has any effect with my medications (has not to date and from speaking with my Pdoc it is fine; the high quality b vitamins, fish oils, NAC, ginkgold, etc. that i recommended earlier in the thread).

Wish me luck!

Chris


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## guest123

I never knew you could hallucinate with dp/dr, that sounds more like psychosis. I mean when I was really bad, everything looked surreal and slightly more colourful but the doctor even said that that sounded like a minor psychotic episode. Interesting stuff.


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## Sketch2000

CORRECTION -

I wont be starting with 50mg of Naltrexone but with 25mg.
(25mg - week 1, 50mg - week 2, 100mg - thereafter).

I'll keep everyone posted.

Re: hallucinations, I had them really bad after my "episode"....As far as a psychotic episode, people who have a psychosis don't know they are having one. i.e - they go into another "state" and are unaware of what is happening whilst they are in this state so they are unable to explain it to a Dr.

** Its a touchy subject. I for one, am experiencing minor psychotic episodes such as autonomic hallucinations now since getting DP/DR, but I believe that its directly correlated to me having DP/DR (if i didn't have this damn thing, i wouldn't be hallucinating. So my Pdoc and I agree that it is nothing "independent" of that).

Chris


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## hd83

From all the reading I've done on DP/DR, which is a whole lot, I've never heard of anyone having psychotic episodes or any kind of psychosis related to DP/DR. I think it's probably a co-existing condition with your DP/DR. DP/DR doesn't cause hallucinations - you can read either Dr. Simeon's book "Feeling Unreal" or the new one written by the research group in London (can't remember the name of it off the top of my head), but neither say DP/DR has anything to do with psychosis. You may want to see about taking an anti-psychotic to see if it helps. I've taken Risperdal before (didn't help my DP/DR) but didn't have any bad side effects either. I think it could help with your auditory hallucinations or any other psychotic symptoms you may be experiencing. It will make you really tired for the first 2 days you're on it, but by the third day you'll feel fine. I would definitely bring that up to your doctor at your next appointment. Usually people who experience hallucinations or some kind of psychosis along with DP/DR who take an atypical antipsychotic (like Risperdal) find that it not only helps their psychosis but also improves their DP/DR a lot too. There was one guy on here who sounds like he has exactly what you do and took Risperdal, and it really helped him (I can't remember his screen name). Hope this helps!!

Heather


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## Sketch2000

Thanks Heather.
My Pdoc and I are trying to prevent having to take an antipsychotic. If you've read my story (of how this began), it all started with an antipsychotic so I'm not not only to fond of them but don't want to add more fuel to the fire.

Chris


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## Sketch2000

*I just wrote this to my Pdoc (via email) - *

_Just got back from CVS (to pick up Lamictal).
I have a huge increase in anxiety, dissociation, and derealization. I feel really wierd (not good). Its almost as if the Naltrexone is trying to make me more "aware" but I'm becoming "too aware" (depersonalized). Not sure if i should stick with the 100mg or decrease tomorrow.

If you get the chance let me know your thoughts.

Chris

----- Forwarded Message ----
From: Christopher Barrett 
To: 
Sent: Sat, January 2, 2010 4:57:51 PM
Subject: From Chris - brief

Dr.

I began Naltrexone at 25mg on Saturday December 12th.
Increased to 50mg on Sunday December 20th, and increased to 100mg Sunday December 27th.

Its hard to (continually) keep track of how you are feeling. But since going to 100mg, I have had 2 quite long dissociation spells. One of which was during a clear sunny day (which is usually when i feel the most comfortable) and the other on New Years Eve (at night, lasted hours, but this happens frequently). Its normal for me to be depersonalized for some time, and then it to wear off (despite the fact i suffer tremendously during the time I'm DP'd). Anyway, given that these episodes occurred during the first week of going to 100mg, is it okay if i go back to 50mg? Or do you think i should stick with the 100mg a little longer?

Its hard to tell if its the medication or not, or just my chronic depersonalization. I always have a level of DPD, and did have some "bad spells" (from looking at my diary) on 50mg of Naltrexone, but the one that troubles me was during the day on 100mg. Perhaps I should just give it more time. I don't know? In addition, it is quite sedating, so I am sleeping longer.

Chris_

** Today I am feeling REALLY WIERD - ANXIOUS, HYPER AWARE, ETC.

** I'm not going to lie to you, I've had A LOT OF FULL DP FREE DAYS! EVEN BEFORE I BEGAN THE NALTREXONE. THE PROBLEM WAS, WHEN I HAD DP SPELLS, THE SEVERITY NEVER CHANGES, THEY ARE ALWAYS REALLY REALLY BAD. SO I FIGURED F- IT, I'M GOING TO TRY THE NALTREXONE AND SEE IF IT PUTS THIS THING TO REST FOR GOOD.

** AT 25 AND 50MG I CITED ONLY ONE BAD DP SPELL (BUT AGAIN, HOW DO U KNOW IF ITS THE MEDS, ETC...OR JUST THE DP PLAYING UP). NEWAY, I DID FEEL "FINE" HOWEVER, I DIDN'T FEEL WIERD LIKE I AM NOW.

** NOW, AT 100MG, I'VE HAD ONE REALLY OUT OF THE ORDINARY DP SPELL, IT LASTED HOURS DURING THE DAY (WHICH IS REALLY UNUSUAL, IT WAS REMINISANT OF WHEN I WAS ONLY ON LUVOX - NO LAMICTAL OR KLONOPIN. REALLY BAD, I WAS "SOUL-LESS" AS COULD BE, AND I KNEW IT...EVENTUALLY "I" CAME BACK. THE OTHER TIME WAS NEW YEARS EVE, GOING TO A NIGHT CLUB WITH MY BRO...FOR THE FIRST 3-4 HOURS OF THE NIGHT I WAS PRETTY DP'D BUT IT WAS MANAGEABLE. AFTER THAT I WAS FINE.

** I'M WAITING ON A RESPONSE FROM HIM BUT DOUBT I'LL GET ONE UNTIL MONDAY. HE MAY WANT ME TO JUST CONTINUE ON 100MG UNTIL MY BODY GETS USED TO IT. BUT WITH THE WAY IM FEELING TODAY I MAY JUST GO DOWN TO 50MG TOMORROW.

** I'M REALLY AT A POINT, DESPITE ALL THE PROGRESS I'VE MADE (AND TRUST ME GUYZ, IV'E MADE HEAPS OF PROGRESS) THAT I DONT WANT TO KEEP ADDING MEDS AND MEDS TO THIS PROBLEM. ADDING THE NALTREXONE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE THE "HIDDEN TOUCH" THAT COULD ALLEVIATE THOSE DP SPELLS THAT COME AND GO AND KEEP YOU STABLE.

** BUT IF IT CAN'T DO THAT, THEN IM BETTER OFF WITH THE UK COMBO IVE BEEN USING - LUVOX, KLONOPIN, AND LAMICTAL, AND MAYBE JUST INCREASE THE LAMICTAL AND ATLEAST IM ONLY USING 3 MEDS AS OPPOSED TO 4.

** REALLY HARD TO TELL IF I'VE HAD ANY IMPROVEMENT IF ANY. BECAUSE EVEN BEFORE THE NALTREXONE I WAS PRETTY GOOD WITH RELAPSES, ETC. I HAVE GOOD AND BAD DAYS AND THEN DAYS WHERE IM OKAY AND IN BETWEEN. SO ITS REALLY, REALLY HARD TO KEEP TRACK OF IT ALL.

** BUT ONE THING IS FOR SURE, OVERALL, I FELT BETTER AT 25 OR 50MG OF NALTREXONE. I WAS NOT MORE ANXIOUS, DISSOCIATED, ETC...AND IT SEEMED LIKE USUAL.

ANY THOUGHTS ? IM FREAKING OUT TODAY. I DONT FEEL WELL AT ALL...ITS LIKE MY MIND IS TRYING TO SNAP OUT OF DP BUT MAKING ME TOO AWARE AT THE SAME TIME, AND IM LIKE HALF WAY THERE....

IM TIRED OF THIS SH-- I BOUGHT A GUN ESPECIALLY FOR THIS....6 MORE MONTHS...AND THATS ALL I'M GIVING IT.

CHRIS
MYZYPREXASTORY.COM


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## Sketch2000

Sorry about the last sentence their guyz. 
I'm just getting fed up already. Despite all of the progress I have made. I really had a lot of hope with the Naltrexone.

I didn't receive a response from my Pdoc. But given that the 100mg of Naltrexone was making me feel so weird. I decreased to 50mg today. I'll stick with that and see how I go.

Chris


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## Guest

Sketch2000 said:


> Sorry about the last sentence their guyz.
> I'm just getting fed up already. Despite all of the progress I have made. I really had a lot of hope with the Naltrexone.
> 
> I didn't receive a response from my Pdoc. But given that the 100mg of Naltrexone was making me feel so weird. I decreased to 50mg today. I'll stick with that and see how I go.
> 
> Chris


I just logged on again as I was troubled by that last post. I understand the frustration and the fear, I do. I've thought of having a gun on hand ... but I don't. I always forget the good times when I feel like Hell.

Please hang in. Perhaps this drug isn't the one for you.
Do what YOU need to do. 
Thanks for all the updates!
Take Care,
L,
D


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## Sketch2000

Dreamer* said:


> I just logged on again as I was troubled by that last post. I understand the frustration and the fear, I do. I've thought of having a gun on hand ... but I don't. I always forget the good times when I feel like Hell.
> 
> Please hang in. Perhaps this drug isn't the one for you.
> Do what YOU need to do.
> Thanks for all the updates!
> Take Care,
> L,
> D


Thank you Dreamer. And I am truly sorry for that last sentence....just impulsive, thats all. 
I've been on this board for some time, and it seems that each time i visit everyone has a new theory on this condition, and others have left.

Anyway, I went down to 50mg and am feeling SIGNIFICANTLY better!
In addition to the London combo, the naltrexone, and all the "brain food" I have taken over the last year (and am still taking), I think it really has made a difference.

I think this may be my year!

How r u doing?

Chris


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## Sketch2000

Sketch2000 said:


> Thank you Dreamer. And I am truly sorry for that last sentence....just impulsive, thats all.
> I've been on this board for some time, and it seems that each time i visit everyone has a new theory on this condition, and others have left.
> 
> Anyway, I went down to 50mg and am feeling SIGNIFICANTLY better!
> In addition to the London combo, the naltrexone, and all the "brain food" I have taken over the last year (and am still taking), I think it really has made a difference.
> 
> I think this may be my year!
> 
> How r u doing?
> 
> Chris


Dreamer / All,

Just when you think your through it all you get another DP spell (today, lasted 2 hours - horrible) and your back in the pits. However, i think to myself how much progress I have made (personally, for those of you who know how bad i was in the beginning, and how this IS wearing off).

It hurts me to think of all you guys that are stuck in DPD 24/7 as I was. Its torture, I know.

Here is a post i just made re: the recovery post that seems to be one of the best as i replied to one of the persons questions about vitamins. It may help anyone, whether you take meds or not (which i advocate, read my post to see why) so i definitely suggest you give it a try. Dreamer, you have asked about this before too (the multivitamins i take...so i hope this helps).

_And i just started Omega 3 or whatever its called, it has 200MG of it.
When should i take that?

_

When I read Dr. Hymans book he suggests taking fish oil supplements BEFORE eating as opposed to after (so they are deep within the intestines by the time you eat). Usually you take fish oil supplements with food (as with most vitamins and minerals, etc.).

BTW - I JUST PLACED ANOTHER ORDER TO "RE-UP" ON MY BRAIN FOOD SUPPLEMENTS -

Here is the rundown from Vitacost -

Jarrow Formulas B-Right -- 100 Capsules
Item No. 790011010067
Ships within 24 hours

Jarrow Formulas N-A-C -- 500 mg - 100 Capsules
Item No. 790011070023
Ships within 24 hours

Nature's Way Ginkgold® Max -- 120 mg - 60 Tablets
Item No. 033674152515
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Nature's Way Korean Ginseng Standardized Extract -- 550 mg - 60 Vegetarian Capsules
Item No. 033674617007
Ships within 24 hours

Carlson Vitamin D3 -- 2000 IU - 120 Softgels
Item No. 088395014611
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Jarrow Formulas Jarro-Dophilus + FOS -- 3.4 Billion - 100 Capsules
Item No. 790011030010
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Garden Greens Essential Veggies -- 1500 mg - 120 Vegetarian Capsules
Item No. 035046061548
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Life Extension Super Omega-3 -- 120 Softgels
Item No. 737870982128
Item will be shipped on or after Jan 19 2010

**** ALL OF IT COST JUST OVER $100 AND WILL LAST ME 2-3 MONTHS! AN INCREDIBLE BARGAIN (VITACOST HAS THE CHEAPEST PRICES, SO I STICK WITH THEM).

REMEMBER WHAT I SAID ABOVE -
- THE B-RITE FROM JARROW I HAVE BEEN USING FOR YEARS
- THE FISH OIL I BUY FROM LIFE EXTENSION IS VERY EXPENSIVE (AS YOU CAN SEE - ALMOST $25.00 A BOTTLE), BUT IT IS ONE OF THE MOST HIGHLY CONCENTRATED FISH OIL PRODUCTS ON THE MARKET!
- I use everything above daily EXCEPT THE JARROW FORMULAS PRO-BIOTICS AND THE GREEN FOOD. These are 2 new supplements I thought I would try. The pro-biotics are highly recommended in Dr. Hymans book, but I've always been weary of using them. But since everything gets processed in your gut, it seems like a good idea.

** The only other thing i did not order (since i have some since my liver cleanse) is "Pure essence" superior tonic multiple (multi vitamin). It has 6,000 mg of whole food. Its a whole food multi vitamin (I wouldn't take anything else now that I've tried it), full of greens, vitamins, etc. NOTHING SYNTHETIC.

** You guys should look into that too.

** My nutritionist recommends switching up your multi's every 3 months or so as your body will get used to it. But the supplements above I ordered yesterday are a MUST! (besides the pro-biotics and greens, I haven't tried those yet).

Anyway, remember i DO USE MEDS. I personally feel that if a persons anxiety, OCD, ruminations, etc. were so bad that they needed medication management in the FIRST PLACE (before DPD), then multivitamins and minerals are not going to be enough to treat that "severe" anxiety or depression, etc. ESPECIALLY GIVEN THAT IT HAS BEEN TREATED WITH MEDICATION BEFORE. However, even with that being said, ALL OF THESE FOODS (ESPECIALLY AFTER WHAT HAPPENED TO ME AND THE SEVERITY OF MY SYMPTOMS ASSOCIATED WITH DPD) ARE ASSOCIATED WITH MILD TRAUMATIC BRAIN INJURY RECOVERY, ANXIETY AND DEPRESSION SUPPORT, MORE BLOOD FLOW TO THE BRAIN, ETC.

PM ME WITH ANY QUESTIONS

CURRENT MEDICATION REGIMEN - Luvox 100mg twice daily, klonopin 2.5mg daily, Lamictal 150mg daily, and Naltrexone 50mg daily (recently started).

I can go most of the day without any DPD whatsoever with this combination. Sometimes even longer. I had the last week or so be pretty good (New Years eve was bad). Then today had a 2 hour stint of severe DP. Then it was back to usual. Still have anxiety associated with it. But I'm much better than last year. I'm looking forward to it becoming more and more less until it dissapates completely.

Morning after breakfast -
Multivitamin
B-complex
Fish Oil
NAC

an hour or so later -
Sublingual B-12

After lunch -
Ginkgold (#1 researched form of ginkgold, its actually a different compound than other brands; why its so damn expensive, Dr. Amen recommends in his books)
Ginseng
Phosphiline Choline (2 softgels) - THIS IS IMPERATIVE FOR LIVER AND BRAIN HEALTH

After dinner -
Fish oil
NAC
B complex
D-3
Calcium and Magnesium

Chris


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## Sketch2000

*Naltrexone isn't working for me....*

_*I just sent this to my Pdoc via email - *_

I am writing because the Naltrexone is making my Depersonalization worse.

From checking my diary, the month prior to beginning Naltrexone (11/12/09 - 12/12/09) I only recorded 3 severe Depersonalization spells (although they were likely more than this, as I was not recording them as much).

During the month of taking Naltrexone (12/12/09 - 01/16/10) I have recorded 14 Depersonalization spells, 5 of them being extremely severe and "out of the ordinary."

I don't think this medication is working for me Dr., and would like to stop it ASAP (its been a month, one week on 25mg, one week on 100mg, and 2 weeks on 50mg). I think its best that I stick with the "London mix" - recommended by the University of London DP Research Institute (SSRI - Luvox, Klonopin - 2.5mg daily, Lamictal - 150mg daily) until any other treatment is available.

(I know that its possible to increase the lamictal as we have not fully utilized that medication before trying anything else).

Please give me guidelines on stopping the Naltrexone ASAP (sorry to write so late). I'm not sure if i need to gradually stop or can just discontinue.

Thanks again.

Chris


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## Sketch2000

Sketch2000 said:


> *Naltrexone isn't working for me....*
> 
> _*I just sent this to my Pdoc via email - *_
> 
> I am writing because the Naltrexone is making my Depersonalization worse.
> 
> From checking my diary, the month prior to beginning Naltrexone (11/12/09 - 12/12/09) I only recorded 3 severe Depersonalization spells (although they were likely more than this, as I was not recording them as much).
> 
> During the month of taking Naltrexone (12/12/09 - 01/16/10) I have recorded 14 Depersonalization spells, 5 of them being extremely severe and "out of the ordinary."
> 
> I don't think this medication is working for me Dr., and would like to stop it ASAP (its been a month, one week on 25mg, one week on 100mg, and 2 weeks on 50mg). I think its best that I stick with the "London mix" - recommended by the University of London DP Research Institute (SSRI - Luvox, Klonopin - 2.5mg daily, Lamictal - 150mg daily) until any other treatment is available.
> 
> (I know that its possible to increase the lamictal as we have not fully utilized that medication before trying anything else).
> 
> Please give me guidelines on stopping the Naltrexone ASAP (sorry to write so late). I'm not sure if i need to gradually stop or can just discontinue.
> 
> Thanks again.
> 
> Chris


*MY PDOC JUST REPLIED. THEN I DID A LITTLE MORE THINKING INTO SOMETHING ELSE AND EMAILED HIM RIGHT BACK. IN HIS RESPONSE HE SAID TO DISCONTINUE THE NALTREXONE. 
BUT THEN I FOUND THIS OUT (WILL IT EVER END...THE POSSIBILITIES ARE ENDLESS) -*

*MY EMAIL - *

Thanks. One more thing please -

On 12/20/09 (which is when i went up to 100mg of Naltrexone) the pharmacy gave me a different type of Lamotrigine (different generic, its called tablet MYL / Instead of the tablet TEV) TEV being the one i had being taking.

I checked drugs.com to ensure that it was the correct drug. It is, just made by a different manufacturer.

I did some research, MANY people don't like the MYL form.

People reporting effects of the switch from TEV to MYL -
http://www.topix.com/forum/med/T5NPN13R4N1SOVCN7/p7

Can you call my pharmacy and have them switch me back to the tablet TEV that I was taking. It may prove to have a difference.

We may be able to try the Naltrexone down the line if in fact it was the switch in generics that caused the increase in DP spells the entire time (it was switched the same time i increased to 100mg of naltrexone and have been using this new form ever since).

I don't need to be switched to the BRAND Lamictal. Only to generic TABLET TEV.

Thanks again.

Chris

------------------------

_*Anyone had any problems like this (switch in generic / brand names of Lamictal) ????*_


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## Guest

Sketch2000 said:


> *MY PDOC JUST REPLIED. THEN I DID A LITTLE MORE THINKING INTO SOMETHING ELSE AND EMAILED HIM RIGHT BACK. IN HIS RESPONSE HE SAID TO DISCONTINUE THE NALTREXONE.
> BUT THEN I FOUND THIS OUT (WILL IT EVER END...THE POSSIBILITIES ARE ENDLESS) -*
> 
> *MY EMAIL - *
> 
> Thanks. One more thing please -
> 
> On 12/20/09 (which is when i went up to 100mg of Naltrexone) the pharmacy gave me a different type of Lamotrigine (different generic, its called tablet MYL / Instead of the tablet TEV) TEV being the one i had being taking.
> 
> I checked drugs.com to ensure that it was the correct drug. It is, just made by a different manufacturer.
> 
> I did some research, MANY people don't like the MYL form.
> 
> People reporting effects of the switch from TEV to MYL -
> http://www.topix.com/forum/med/T5NPN13R4N1SOVCN7/p7
> 
> Can you call my pharmacy and have them switch me back to the tablet TEV that I was taking. It may prove to have a difference.
> 
> We may be able to try the Naltrexone down the line if in fact it was the switch in generics that caused the increase in DP spells the entire time (it was switched the same time i increased to 100mg of naltrexone and have been using this new form ever since).
> 
> I don't need to be switched to the BRAND Lamictal. Only to generic TABLET TEV.
> 
> Thanks again.
> 
> Chris
> 
> ------------------------
> 
> _*Anyone had any problems like this (switch in generic / brand names of Lamictal) ????*_


Hmmm. Sorry you've been through so much misery Chris. And the Naltrexone seems to overall make you worse? Hmm. One thing. I am on all generics now. Citalopram, Clonazepam, and Lamotrigine. Changing to generic has never made a difference. Also, I get my meds through a mail-order MEDCO plan. Cheaper, and get a 3 month supply at once.

I have noticed that many times my pills do not look at ALL the same. I always double check they are the correct medication. I'll go to the pharmacy to be sure. For instance my Citalopram just changed color and shape. I can't see how this would make a difference. It's my understanding that this is common. Different companies make the same med but it make literally look different or have a different "letter/number" on it. And MEDCO I guess contracts with different companies and certainly is negotiating for the best price. I think these different companies are using the same "recipe"/"formula" but have their own individual look, etc. to identify the company -- point of origin.

The only weird thing is colors/dyes/binding agents can differ and give some people allergic reactions.

Curious.

Keep us posted. And thank you for the updates.

Interesting re: journal keeping also. I'm going through "the change of life"







and there is a CLEAR connection between increased depression and DP/DR PMS. Since I don't know when I get my period -- it's becoming more and more random, keeping a journal always stuns me. I'm also concerned as in recent research I found that peri-menopause and menopause make depression worse. If it ain't one thing it's another.

Take Care,
D


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## Sketch2000

Dreamer* said:


> Hmmm. Sorry you've been through so much misery Chris. And the Naltrexone seems to overall make you worse? Hmm. One thing. I am on all generics now. Citalopram, Clonazepam, and Lamotrigine. Changing to generic has never made a difference. Also, I get my meds through a mail-order MEDCO plan. Cheaper, and get a 3 month supply at once.
> 
> I have noticed that many times my pills do not look at ALL the same. I always double check they are the correct medication. I'll go to the pharmacy to be sure. For instance my Citalopram just changed color and shape. I can't see how this would make a difference. It's my understanding that this is common. Different companies make the same med but it make literally look different or have a different "letter/number" on it. And MEDCO I guess contracts with different companies and certainly is negotiating for the best price. I think these different companies are using the same "recipe"/"formula" but have their own individual look, etc. to identify the company -- point of origin.
> 
> The only weird thing is colors/dyes/binding agents can differ and give some people allergic reactions.
> 
> Curious.
> 
> Keep us posted. And thank you for the updates.
> 
> Interesting re: journal keeping also. I'm going through "the change of life"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and there is a CLEAR connection between increased depression and DP/DR PMS. Since I don't know when I get my period -- it's becoming more and more random, keeping a journal always stuns me. I'm also concerned as in recent research I found that peri-menopause and menopause make depression worse. If it ain't one thing it's another.
> 
> Take Care,
> D


Thanks D.
I just got a little worried reading all those horrible reactions people had with the "MYL" form of lamictal.
Therefore, yesterday I had my pharmacy change me back to the "TEV" form. You are right, they are just different manufacturers, but from what I read (I think i put a link above somewhere for my Dr. to see) they are plenty of people claiming that they are NOT the same. When i did further research, i found that the TEV form is the most recent to be approved to be "biochemically equivalent" to Lamictal (therefore, the most recent generic), the MYL being an older generic that was made back in 2006.

Who knows?
But yes, the naltrexone did make me worse. The problem is now that I'm not sure if it was the change in lamictal generics - but i seriously doubt it.

Chris


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## Lost_Lion17

Do you take the naltrexone orally? And doesnt it cause ahendonia?


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## TDX

As far as I know Naltrexone usually doesn't cause anhedonia.


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## luctor et emergo

It doesn't cause anhedonia. In my case it led to heightened anxiety and panic attacks. This was at the maximum recommended dose of 150mg/d.

In the last years low dose naltrexone is gaining popularity for regulation of the immune system. Anyone has experiences with LDN?


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## TDX

> Wouldn't be any use for DP, I'm afraid. The doses required for DP are at the upper end of sensible.


As I said, there may be exceptions:

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00115-014-4015-9


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## TDX

The reason might be the german full text. Interestingly they say that Naltrexone only worked for DP-symptoms, but not for other dissociative symptoms (like amnesia).

This study fits also well with a genetic study, which prediced that low-dose Naltrexone might be particulary effective in this group:

http://ijnp.oxfordjournals.org/content/11/2/149.full


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## luctor et emergo

Again, much obliged TDX!

Although limited in numbers and sometimes falsified,
it's great that there are researches being conducted.

As long as there is progression in this field there is hope.


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## TDX

> Don't be fooled by scaremongers (i.e. Zed). Intellectual dishonesty seems to be a very small problem in DP research.


I also think so. It's not like for example in tinnitus research, where much research is conducted, but 80% of it is garbage. Quality is not the problem of DP-research, but quantity.


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## didep

King Elliott said:


> The majority of research on DP (especially coming out of King's College and Mount Sinai) seems good. They're restricted by limited funding and small sample sizes but they do what they can.


You are optimistic they can understand the mechanism of dp / dr and find an effective treatment? I feel that many years will pass until this is achieved.


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