# Recovered since 2017



## cacophony (May 28, 2012)

Hey guys! 

I think this is gonna be a fairly long one but hear me out please.

I haven't posted on these forums since 2016. I've been free from DP/DR for about 5 years now, and I somehow felt I wanted to revisit these forums to tell my story and to provide any help I can for those still struggling with this.
I can wholeheartedly say that the discovery of these forums helped me tremendously with my slow and steady recovery, cause before I thought I was the only one experiencing it. Reading about other peoples experiences made me feel a sense if connectedness to others. I didnt know it even was a condition, I didnt know how to google my symptoms cause they were so vague, yet so intense. I felt completely left alone with it. Every single day for about 2 years I feared that I would go "crazy" and lose all my shit and become totally isolated in some psychiatric hostpital.

Sorry if my grammar is off, btw. English isnt my first language.

My DPDR came as a secondary condition to a weed/caffeine OD (apx 30 cups of coffee) -induced panic attack I had on the school bus in 2009. After the panic attack, I never felt like myself and the condition progressed into severe derealization. At the worst, my own thoughts didnt seem to be mine.
For years I was in a state of constant fear of going schizophrenic, and the whole thing progressed into servere OCD where I would get intrusive thoughts about spontaniously killing my family and my girlfriend etc. It crippled me to the point where I couldnt go to the grocery store because I was afraid I was going to punch some pregnant woman in the belly. I was basically obsessed with analyzing every single thought and intuitive emotion I had and my subcouncious would interpret it as "something a crazy person would feel/react", and it crippled me.

I dont think I have to remind you guys what this condition is and what it does to you.

When it comes to my recovery, it was as I said previously a slow and steady progression.

At one point i decided I had a choice. Either; completely turn my life around in all aspects, or continue letting my life fall bit by bit into ruins. I didnt want to lie in my bed being scared of my own mind anymore, and I didnt want to die, so that made the choice easy. This wasnt something that was gonna magically fix itself. This had to to with me changing my mindset. Changing the way i INSTINCTIVELY reacted to things. I focused on catching myself whenever I intuitively had a negative thought, observe my emotions and react the opposite. If my mind instinctively told me to run, I stayed. If it told me to stop, I continued. It was basically a constant argument with myself over whats relevant and not. 
Relevancy matters because its what you percieve as objective thats real. Real to you.
Deep inside, you KNOW those crazy thoughts and feelings arent the real you. You remember how you were pre-DPDR, right? If you can envision it, you have it in you to change. You have a choice on how you react to your thoughts. Over time by building habits, you will learn to trust your objectivity more than any irrelevant thought, that seem to appear only to harm you.
Each intrusive thought can get less and less imporant to you, because you've become accustomed to dismiss the negative feelings. Self trust is key. 

It came to the point where I decided to try smoking weed again in late 2017. One of the things I feared the most up until this point was getting a psychoactive substance in my system, cause my brain told me "IM SURELY GONNA GO INSANE" "THIS I WHAT TRIGGERED MY DPDR, ITS ONLY GOING TO MAKE IT WORSE!" I decided, "man, im gonna smoke weed, face it, and im gonna welcome each and every emotion that hits me". Im gonna delve into my own mind with open arms and truly observe what my ultimate fears are. 
That night I realised that I dont have any fears. My fears were what I was making them up to be. The sole obession over false fears is whats fueling the anxiety, and ultimately the DPDR. If I could smoke weed and be open and honest to myself while on it, I could fucking do everything. I just faced one of my biggest fears. 

Im not encouraging anyone, nor saying smoking weed or doing any drug fixes it, im saying its your own decisions that will ultimately fix it. If you decide to take control.
One year later in the middle of the summer, I tried LSD for the first time. This challenge was even scarier, because I had absolutely no clue how I would react to it. Me and my friends went to my family's cottage. The weather was insane for being in Northern Norway (Tromsø), it was like 34C at 2AM. I dropped the LSD, scared out of my fucking mind, but I stuck to my plan. I was gonna delve into it with all my heart. I was going to see what it had to show me. I can honestly say that I learnt more about myself in 8 hours than I've had my whole life. I finally understood everything. Everything appered clear as day. I FELT the irrelevance of my anxiety in my whole body. It felt truly irrelevant and just plain dumb to feel this way for no good reason. This was the only time I've tried LSD, but the values of life that emerged from that state of mind has truly stuck with me to this day. I havent felt an ounce of anxiety since then, cliche as it may sound.

It wasnt the LSD that fixed it. It was me. My own desicions and my willingness to learn to live again. I had faced the biggest fear I could ever think of, and THATS the key to this. Self trust. Control. Build self integrity.
Your individual fears might not be the same, but the mechanisms are the same.

The combination of my self built habits of thinking and willingness to dare to face myself was the key all along.
This good mental state stuck with me in everyday life, and do to this day. Treat yourself as your dearest friend, every day, all the time.

Go work out. It will make you connect to your body. Stick to it, whatever your irrelevant instincts tell you. It WILL reward you.

Spend time in nature. Do it often. Learn to immerse yourself in your human experience in this universe. For what you know, you'll only experience it once.

Eat as healthy as you can. Stick to it. Over time, you will feel as you've nurtured someone you love back to life. Good self moral is key.

I hope this makes somewhat sense, and that Im not coming off as some hippie that tried LSD once and had his life changed.

If anyone want to write me, please do. 



-H


----------



## Aridity (Jun 12, 2011)

Thanks, this is why I want to try psychedelics.. especially MDMA, I know it's not a real psychedelic like LSD but still. Heaps of positive things about it. I need to go within to heal this shit, and try the thing I am most afraid of. Letting go..


----------



## cacophony (May 28, 2012)

Aridity said:


> Thanks, this is why I want to try psychedelics.. especially MDMA, I know it's not a real psychedelic like LSD but still. Heaps of positive things about it. I need to go within to heal this shit, and try the thing I am most afraid of. Letting go..



I've tried MDMA a bunch of times with good friends. Its definitely a real psychedelic, but maybe not in a classic sense. It can be compared to LSD in many ways, but in my case it's better for interacting with others and expressing myself. It can be a great tool for accessing your emotions and feel comfortable expressing them! It has certainly helped me communicate in a honestly to my loved ones, not least myself. If used properly and with purpose, it can transform you, there's no doubt about it.


----------



## leminaseri (Jul 1, 2020)

cacophony said:


> I've tried MDMA a bunch of times with good friends. Its definitely a real psychedelic, but maybe not in a classic sense. It can be compared to LSD in many ways, but in my case it's better for interacting with others and expressing myself. It can be a great tool for accessing your emotions and feel comfortable expressing them! It has certainly helped me communicate in a honestly to my loved ones, not least myself. If used properly and with purpose, it can transform you, there's no doubt about it.


how big is the chance that i get psychotic due to mdma?


----------



## Aridity (Jun 12, 2011)

leminaseri said:


> how big is the chance that i get psychotic due to mdma?


That chance is actually very very low.. I don't know why people think MDMA cause psychosis. Of course it can trigger it in some people, but even caffeine can trigger it. Personally I don't know of anyone who got psychosis due to using MDMA and I know ALOT of people who've used it on a regular basis like a few times a week which is totally over kill. Of course always look at your own personal situation.


----------



## cacophony (May 28, 2012)

leminaseri said:


> how big is the chance that i get psychotic due to mdma?


Yeah, Im certainly not an expert in psychology or anything, but I would say the chance is very low. Ofc there will always be individual cases where you hear the opposite, but they will always be the the ones screaming loudest. 

If you decide to try it, make sure the set and setting is optimal. Light some candles, invite a friend you trust, make it cozy.
Don't do it in some shady concrete basement with shady people you don't know


----------



## leminaseri (Jul 1, 2020)

cacophony said:


> Yeah, Im certainly not an expert in psychology or anything, but I would say the chance is very low. Ofc there will always be individual cases where you hear the opposite, but they will always be the the ones screaming loudest.
> 
> If you decide to try it, make sure the set and setting is optimal. Light some candles, invite a friend you trust, make it cozy.
> Don't do it in some shady concrete basement with shady people you don't know


thx buddy


----------



## cacophony (May 28, 2012)

leminaseri said:


> thx buddy


No worries my friend. Make sure you do your own research beforehand, and make sure you feel ready for it, allthough when it comes to psychedelics, no one is ever truly "ready". It can be quite an emotional ride.


----------



## Peter (Jun 25, 2018)

> thx buddy


Are you seriously considering trying MDMA?


----------



## Trith (Dec 31, 2019)

cacophony said:


> Yeah, Im certainly not an expert in psychology or anything, but I would say the chance is very low. Ofc there will always be individual cases where you hear the opposite, but they will always be the the ones screaming loudest.
> 
> If you decide to try it, make sure the set and setting is optimal. Light some candles, invite a friend you trust, make it cozy.
> Don't do it in some shady concrete basement with shady people you don't know


You can certainly find a lot of research papers when you google "MDMA psychosis" although it's case reports indeed, even after a single use. But I think they should be taken into account. I have never met anyone in real life with problems caused by weed and let alone people who developed DPDR as a result, and yet I got it.
Also a good excuse people have is that psychedelics or weed only cause problems for sensitive people. And if my DPDR experience taught me anything it's that I should have considered myself a sensitive or unstable person earlier.
I did have an experience with LSA at a moderate dosage, which is very close to LSD. While the trip itself was good, I had some weird thought patterns and dreams for three days, like my brain was sending nonsense signals everywhere and I didn't like that enough to tell myself I wouldn't try again. And it didn't have any effect on my pre-existing DPDR. At that time I had also tried salvia a couple times, and I think I have some visual effect where I can't interpret correctly what I am seeing that happens to me sometimes. It's not bothering me very much but I think it started during that experience where I had that effect super strongly.
I've also read stories of people who started to see auras on everybody after taking LSD regularly, people who got visual snow (see HPPD), and one guy who triggered prosopagnosia, so he couldn't recognize people's faces at all anymore, even his own. And all these people had these effects even a long time after discontinuing, but they had used it very regularly if I remember correctly.
So maybe it does help people, I would be interested to know if it does, maybe I would try it myself in the future if I am convinced by some evidence, but I think it is important that people know about the risks so that they don't come back all surprised if something happens to them.


----------



## Aridity (Jun 12, 2011)

Trith said:


> You can certainly find a lot of research papers when you google "MDMA psychosis" although it's case reports indeed, even after a single use. But I think they should be taken into account. I have never met anyone in real life with problems caused by weed and let alone people who developed DPDR as a result, and yet I got it.
> Also a good excuse people have is that psychedelics or weed only cause problems for sensitive people. And if my DPDR experience taught me anything it's that I should have considered myself a sensitive or unstable person earlier.
> I did have an experience with LSA at a moderate dosage, which is very close to LSD. While the trip itself was good, I had some weird thought patterns and dreams for three days, like my brain was sending nonsense signals everywhere and I didn't like that enough to tell myself I wouldn't try again. And it didn't have any effect on my pre-existing DPDR. At that time I had also tried salvia a couple times, and I think I have some visual effect where I can't interpret correctly what I am seeing that happens to me sometimes. It's not bothering me very much but I think it started during that experience where I had that effect super strongly.
> I've also read stories of people who started to see auras on everybody after taking LSD regularly, people who got visual snow (see HPPD), and one guy who triggered prosopagnosia, so he couldn't recognize people's faces at all anymore, even his own. And all these people had these effects even a long time after discontinuing, but they had used it very regularly if I remember correctly.
> So maybe it does help people, I would be interested to know if it does, maybe I would try it myself in the future if I am convinced by some evidence, but I think it is important that people know about the risks so that they don't come back all surprised if something happens to them.


Aren't you aware of the current studies that is being done with MDMA? The evidence is overwhelming, and no not for dp/dr of course, but huge for trauma which is the core of dp/dr IMO.


----------



## Trith (Dec 31, 2019)

Aridity said:


> Aren't you aware of the current studies that is being done with MDMA? The evidence is overwhelming, and no not for dp/dr of course, but huge for trauma which is the core of dp/dr IMO.


I thought the studies were only about microdosing, and here we are talking about a regular trip. Are there many studies at regular dosage? I'm interested if there are.


----------



## Trith (Dec 31, 2019)

Well no, they do seem to give regular doses, you are right.
Here is one article in Nature saying they have promising results indeed, where MDMA assisted therapy gives better results than therapy alone: MDMA-assisted therapy for severe PTSD: a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled phase 3 study - Nature Medicine

_"Although recent research suggests that dissociative subtype PTSD is difficult to treat36, participants with the dissociative subtype who received MDMA-assisted therapy had significant symptom reduction that was at least similar to that of their counterparts with non-dissociative PTSD. Given that this covariate was significant, it warrants further study. Furthermore, given that other treatments for PTSD are not consistently effective for those with the dissociative subtype, these data, if replicated, would indicate an important novel therapeutic niche for MDMA-assisted therapy for typically hard-to-treat populations. "_

This study seems to be done on patients that have severe PTSD, so much that it is hard for them to re-visit the traumas. And they also attribute the effects of MDMA to the fact that enhancement of the social connection improves the patient-therapist relationship.


----------



## Aridity (Jun 12, 2011)

Peter said:


> Are you seriously considering trying MDMA?


Hi, TDX. It's obvious, I know you were highly against MDMA.


Trith said:


> I thought the studies were only about microdosing, and here we are talking about a regular trip. Are there many studies at regular dosage? I'm interested if there are.


You can't microdose MDMA.....


----------



## leminaseri (Jul 1, 2020)

Aridity said:


> Hi, TDX. It's obvious, I know you were highly against MDMA.


finally other people notice that as well


----------



## Peter (Jun 25, 2018)

> Hi, TDX. It's obvious, I know you were highly against MDMA.


I think most people with some remainder of sense are against careless use of MDMA. It can cause depersonalization disorder by itself and HPPD as well. Even if MDMA worked for trauma-based disorders this doesn't necessarily transfer to depersonalization disorder, since contrary to your claim there is a lack of evidence that trauma is the core of depersonalization.



> finally other people notice that as well




Apart from that, I remember that you claimed that medications and transcranial magnetic stimulation could cause irreversible brain damage. What about MDMA?


----------



## Aridity (Jun 12, 2011)

Peter said:


> I think most people with some remainder of sense are against careless use of MDMA. It can cause depersonalization disorder by itself and HPPD as well. Even if MDMA worked for trauma-based disorders this doesn't necessarily transfer to depersonalization disorder, since contrary to your claim there is a lack of evidence that trauma is the core of depersonalization.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Careless use yes, but high lab grade MDMA, with supervision and testing. In a clinical setting.. the risks are very low, I have read about many people and spoke to a handful myself.. who treated their dissociation/dp/dr with MDMA and some of them got cured.. I'd rather try MDMA then attack my body and brain with symptom masking medications, I don't believe that's a cure.. the DP/DR is something that much deeper than we think.


----------

