# I think, therefore I exist? (read this, its worth every word)



## Elendil (Mar 26, 2011)

I am new , I have a story to tell that is most unusual.Take your time, it is a unusual case.

I suffer from hard chronic DR (DP is milder) about 4 years.
Before it happened, like most uf you I was a happy person with great living circumstances. Catholic, great believer and someone who prayed everytime when going to sleep to thank for the day granted. 
I started to study fine arts, I was always in the middle of happenings. Always there to make people laugh and myself also. Just a person who enjoyed his life to the fullest, most people liked me because of my charisma. 
After one incident changed my whole life, it happened while I was going home after a party at late night. 
I was a bit drunk, and just wanted to go home...when suddenly a group of holligans blocked my path. They wanted money from me, I gave them some few coins. And they wanted more, I said that it is all I have. Ignoring my answer they just attacked me, the good thing is that I didnt felt anything because of the alcohol. After defending myself for a minute I realised I cant fight them I just run like never before in my life. They runned after me for a mile, but I didnt stop to run for 6 miles. I was terrified, felt like a black whole, like a wortheless materia. Suddenly rain started to fall, I was wet and full of scars and blood making my way to home. Next morning I fully realized what happened, shocked. Cant get out of my bed, from the pain. I was so angry, furious and in a rage. I felt that I have to find them all and revenge. Strange for a person who is a pacifist and someone who ignores troubled situations. Because I always liked myself, my life and was never self-destructive.

After my second semestar ended, I came home 2007 in summer.
I started to excersise like I did before, to build self esteem and make my body more resistant for such cases.
I closed myself for 2 months in a virtual world, 9 hours per day to forget the trauma. Happy and relieved I was with my friends, they made me forget all of this and made me recover fast. 
After these two months, at night at the ending of sommer it happened.Just when I was in front of my pc.
Derealization came suddenly to mi life, my vision suddenly changed. I thought this is just temporary, but then my heart made a short break and I was confused and run to my family to say them what happened. They didnt understand, but that night my life changed, I have changed. The next morning I had to get up, cause I felt that my hearts is beating more and more slowly. The next month was a hell, I had every day a near death expirience. Not a tipical anxiety feeling the fear of death. More the feeling that I am dying. I run, drived bycicle and trained, and hoped that I will be better. My DR was always with me, but in the background because the feeling of death was to much for me.I watched gladiator at night , and told my brother that i am passing away.I really felt that I am dying, my pulse was at the very end. I even had not the power to talk,I whispered to him and this scene was on tv 



 .I have to cry, cause nobody deserves that, the most ironic thing is that i almost look the same as Maximus (I cant take it anymore). My faith to God, In everything good vanished, my life is a fucking torture.The funny thing is that I am finishing my study as a fucking hollow ghost. Dont even realizing that I am ending my 5 years study. For me, it is the most worst expirience in the whole galaxy. You live, but you are dead. Why do I live I asked myself, because of my family I thought then.I changed my life for 360 degree. In that state I socialize more then I did ever before and even in that state I made all laugh but what means that to me when I am unhappy? The socializing just supresses the feeling, but hardly. But The endless emptyness is always in my head. No sentences, nothing. I gave and giving the most best a human can, I train even for Iron Man and made my whole diet different. (was always healthy person)
I run maraton on -20 degree, drive mountainbike on snow,heat and rain and swim. Dont tell me what is motivation... 
But the DR is still here, and it will not let go. How can happen this to someone hypersensitive and emotional, kind person who values his life like no one else?
Never touched drugs, cigaretes, alcohol maybe one time in 2 months. Beer mostly.

I checked all that there is in hospitals and everything was perfect, only not fully body MRT and CT. It is hard, cause I am from Croatia. And after my study ends I am planing to make a full check in Germany.Cant drink cofee or alcohol, it makes me feel that I am passing away. I will never believe for a thing like a secure mehanism of brain, or a standby mode. Cause I think there is a physical reason, or else it will not be permanent DR. We have to raise a foundation for DR/DP, and to stop beeing passive (it is hard in this state I know). I just see people (members here on forum) that have thousand views but no posts, that tells me much.
We cannot wait for a cure, we have to mobilize. I tried 4 years to tell myself that I have to live with it (even not fully knowing what it is), and it ended with a comment from my mom that made me cry like a child. She said: "I have two stars(sons), and I cannot live when I see that the other star is just losing its glow and slowly fading away." This made me colapse, I tried my best all these years and she can see that I am not even near the person I was.

We have to activate ourselfs, we cannot say that we learned to live with this shit. I just want to turn behind my past and say that I have acomplished something. And not to say that I died like some weird person, a zombie. Wake up, we have to give it a try. Daphne Simeon just opened the door for us, like the movie numb also. I say that there is always a a action and reaction. And a disease and a cure, maybe we will not get cured. But the next generations will have chance to get cured. We are lucky that we have people with anxiety and DR/DP attacks on this world. Such people should be used in advanced neurological tests, to find out what happens to the occipital-temporal part. I think that I myself have a dysfunction. But why cant I see any damage? It is a very complex thing that requires all of us to gather and start to look for the main reason.Wake up people. Excuse me for my bad english.

At least, this video means a lot to me. It describes methaporically who am I know, and what I have been going trough (watch from 4:33 to the end):


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## Fly (Feb 8, 2011)

i have read what you put with deep passion myself have been going through this for 14 years and still fight it now and when i go to the medical places etc they diagnose loads of rubbish, i have mentioned this DP/Dd they say its just a reaction to depression/ anxiety etc and give me some pills and away i go and they say "try lead a normal like as possible" yeah right
it seems to be that they dont even believe in this horrendous feeling because it is a feeling not a madness were not mentally ill just feel strange or do we its like the world is going on and im not participating in it as if im watching from a far so yeah i agree we need to take action as this illness is getting worse and will become as big as depression etc

Keep fighting you are real just dont feel real but does anyone we are all false made up of our material things these days would be nice just to have my soul back and be me


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## soulallnighter (Jan 14, 2011)

I don't know exactly what to say to this post but i feel like I have to say something

Firstly, Elendil, I have to say I smiled when I saw that Balrock video because i've often thought of that exact scene as a suitable analogy, but I take the scene to its conclusion and am convinced that like a phoenix from the ashes we can emerge from this DP as Gandalf the white. By which i mean the same as we were before but stronger and wiser. But the battle with the balrock is indeed horrific and as someone who feels very much on the road to recovery after only months I feel terrible for people who have been battling this for years.

Next I would say that I think people with DP in general tend to convince themselves of the uniques of there particular case and cause, often to an irrational extent. I can relate to so much of your story, in particular the constant, unbearable emptiness and the feeling of dying. Whenever i had to plan for anything I would go about it normally all the while thinking "whats the point, i'm not going to be here anyway". You might think this is not anxiety but I believe it really is, many people describe a morbid obsession with death as a DP/anxiety symptom and I think the feeling of dying is just a strange manifestation of this obsession.

But it has gradually faded for me, i wouldn't say i can forget about it entirely but i can forget about DP for most of the day now usually and more importantly I am hopeful for the future. I know you probably don't want to hear this, and I can understand why you would think otherwise but Personally I feel like DP and DR are intimately connected to Anxiety and that for the vast majority recovery is truly accessible given enough patience.

I don't want to harp on about what needs to be done, which is outlined in so many other posts, but things like being aware of your thoughts, meditation, CBT etc really do have a scientific grounding these days if you look into neuroplasticity (ie "the brain that changes itself"). In the end I can only know my own experience and I don't want to judge people who have been suffering for so long and tell them its really so easy, i can imagine this could feel quite insulting and i got sick of people telling me to be positive after only a few months. But I do think you need to adjust your attitude to DP. Truly Accepting that you have DP and being determined to recover can seem like a complete contradiction but it is possible. Its important to not fight it 24/7 and instead just observe it and try to be ok with it, to break the cycle.

I was amazed at how much of the thoughts I was so convinced of actually seemed like irrational anxiety when I calmed down a bit. The most important thing is that you really can't think your way out of this, which pretty much every one tries to do. I agree that more should be done to study and understand this and I actually thinks its quite fascinating on some level, but being determined to find your own miracle cure is exactly what doesn't help people recover.


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## babybowrain (Aug 24, 2010)

Hi I'm really sorry that happened to you. I used to have that feeling like I was passing away too, too weak to speak or move or eat and a feeling like I was fading away or my spirit was leaving my body. I too went to art school in a not so safe area. Lots of beggers and stuff, and some punks walking around with giant pocket knives in their belts right under the school  I remember they taught us stuff in case someone attacks you in school...but it's really hard to remember when you're being attacked. You did the right thing, fight and run. They told us once that if you get attacked and you're indoors, you should pull the fire alarm to get everyone's attention or yell "fire! fire!"...anyway I hope this doesn't come to this again, I hope you can go to a school in a safer area.


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## EverDream (Dec 15, 2006)

Your story touched my heard. Thanks for posting it. I feel in many ways the same way you do. I suffer from DP, depression, anxiety for 5 and a half years. You sound like an amazing person, very smart and brave. I'm sure you'll get better. Oh, and welcome!


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## Guest (Mar 27, 2011)

Welcome to the forum. And thanks for your inspiration to get the ball rolling for DP Research. Your story is very interesting as well, again, welcome


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## Guest (Mar 27, 2011)

Oh and BTW you have incredible taste in movies







The Lord of the Rings is one my all time favorites as is Gladiator too. I also relate my life to movies. It gives a good background to map out your life.


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## Elendil (Mar 26, 2011)

@Fly

Thank you for your comforting words, we are the people that none can hear. Buried alive some would say.
We are going trough the best we can, and we will never get suspicious cause we learned to be great live actors.
I just understand your expirience with doctors, they also laughed at me when I told them about my condition and gave me some AD for what I knew that doesnt make sense because its a physical reaction. The AD had 0 effect on me, as I foretold. Wish you all the best, never getting tired fighting our way trough endless darkness.

@soulallnighter

These scene is for me the best example of how the circumstances changed the person that I/we was.
The Balrog depicts the derealization and the near death expiriences and much more unbearable physical symptoms with that I was confronted when it started, this event crushed my life utterly and changed my very person. I was just like Gandalf on this mountain, innerly dead and outer no signs of life. I am a very rational person. I dont believe in some higher force (like I did before), nor do I believe in some unaccountably happenings. This story is not overdone, I am a very earthbound person. I gave my DR 4 years time, even not fully knowing what I have. The result is, it didnt helped. I had thousands of activities, jobs, poeples around me and nothing helped. I was just an actor all these years. Feeling exhausted, tired, disoriented, forgetfull, empty, ocassionaly with near death expiriences (when drinking coffe or some beer). Thats the point where I see that anxiety is just a background symptom of a major problem. I was relaxed all these years with nearly none stress, managed to stay cool. Panic? What is this? Never had such an attack, so I really dont know what am I fighting here. But thank you for your time and great understanding, maybe I am wrong but anxiety cant make me feel that I am really leaving this world (dying) this moment.

@babybowrain

Thank you for your comment, this is the last year I am staying here.I have to graduate this year and then my safe harbor awates me finally. I cant believe that you also felt like you are passing away (dying), how did it started for you? For me when it started I didnt also eat, and I would not sleep for 2 months.

@EverDream

Thank you very much, as I described it in full detail (needed 2 hours to write it down). I am, (was) a hypersensitive person and a very little fragment survived my derealization. Its a mad world, and we didnt had a chance to choose what life we want to live. I am living only for my family, they are the most important thing in my life. I say to them everyday how much they mean to me, for when my time ends here or when this is all over. I just want to let them know that even in that state I gave them the feeling that I value them over all. Cause they have gone with me trough this hell, and it also affected their life in some part these last two months. Before that (4 years) I was just an actor, that tried to hide behind a very transparent facade.

@Native

Thank you my friend, glad that you like my taste. Cause I love and will always love LOTR.
Also Gladiator has a special place in my heart, as I had that unusual expirience when I was watching it.
I cried dozen of times when writing this down, remembering what has happened to this beautiful life.
And the scene with Balrog vs. Gandalf depicted me fighting with derealization and hundread of other unbearable physcial symtopms. Cause I also had a beard, and long hair when I was beaten up by hooligans. After that I shaved my hair and beard, and became a polished man with a sense of perfectionism tolerating no lapse on my look. Exactly like Gandalf changed in his character and appereance, so did I. Hardly remembering who he was, knowing just that he is here for his task. Like my task is to live for my family, nothing else doesnt seem to count.

I think that we all should press forward, emerge from this dream state. Cause no one else will do this for us, a foundation should be raised and neurochirugy expert should be better informed about this state. It is hard to show from what we suffer, cause it is not like cancer that it can bee seen from the outside or inside. It is like a healthy and highly moral person has to be burried alive. Stop being passive people, spectators of your own and others life. If we dont try, then we can die today or tomorrow...cause it doesnt make a difference. Financials should be collected for scientists/psychologists like Daphne Simeon and many more out there like the Dr. Mihal in Mainz (Germany) that care for us. But it looks like we dont care?! Neurochirurgy is the most important thing here. When few poeple suffer from something that doesnt affect the most, then its not so important (like the sad story of the living human tree) that needed much time when something really happened to help him. But when such a great number like us suffer, then many poeple should feel conected to this problem. We cannot speed up the technology in medicine, but we can make some pressing or else we and other generations will wait for eons that something happens. We have only one life.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

Hey thanks for sharing your story. I am sorry about what has happened to you, though you sound like the kind of person who will make something positive come from suffering. There are a lot of great people suffering immensely as you well know and I like the idea of coming together to fight for our lives. Sadly it is something that is hard to do with this condition however you are right, we must fight or die trying. If you can think of any immediate projects to start on please let myself and everyone here know. Welcome to dpselfhelp.com.


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## babybowrain (Aug 24, 2010)

Yes, I wouldn't eat or sleep properly for probably years on and off...and then I started feeling like I was dying.


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## Elendil (Mar 26, 2011)

@*Spirit

Thank you for your support, looks like you are one of the less that are very aware of the situation.
I just counted that this forum has 20660 members, that is indeed a number. Of course there are temporary DP/DR people amongst us. But lets say that at least 15 000 have chronic problems just on this forum. And hundread thousands that are just observing this forum without being a member or didnt even knowing 100% that they suffer from this mental ilness like myself.That makes a number that should tremble the neurology. I know that people like the producer of Numb paid about 150 000 dolars to the many psychiatris, scientist, psychologists to check him. But I havent heard that somebody supports neurologists,and one person cant move anything. But a whole mass, should show how this situation is very serious and hard to handle. And it made me sad when I wrote "derealiaztion" or just "depersonalization" and one result came out?! And that was on the official website of the *World federation of Neurology * ! That should show us all how this ilness is underrated! I am in hurry now, but there is a list of meetings when we should approach as a critical mass: http://www.wfneurology.org/meetings.php

One, or few cant do nothing. But such a huge number like this should make all world neurology think about how this situation is dire! When approaching on a meeting when thousands of them are present, a few would surely think to take action about this mental ilness. Think about this , maybe you will not take me serious in your state cause it is hard when you are passive 24/7.


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