# For the MJ induced, do you think pot should be illegal??



## Guest (Mar 3, 2007)

I for one think it should be banned in the US, but everyone i tell this too says you're nuts because it's less harmful then alcohol, but people don't understand what it can do i guess. What are all your thoughts?


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## Guest (Mar 3, 2007)

> There?s also increasing evidence of a link between cannabis and mental health problems such as *schizophrenia.* If you?ve a history of mental health problems, depression or are experiencing paranoia, then taking this drug is not a good idea.


http://www.talktofrank.com/drugs.aspx?id=172


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

Absolutely not. Cannabis is statistically the safest of all psychoactive drugs (natural and synthetic) in the history of humanity. If you're going to start 'banning' medicines based on the negative side effects experienced by an infinitesimal number of it's users, you might as well forfeit the very concept of medicine. There is no drug on earth that has zero potential for negative side effects.

Realistically, you can't smoke this herb and actually believe that 'nothing bad could ever possibly come out of this.' At some level, everyone knew what they were singing up for when they got high. It's certainly the lesser of all evils in the psychoactive world, but there's still that tiny chance that something could go wrong. A few rotten apples doesn't ruin an orchard.


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## Guest (Mar 3, 2007)

The student nurses I meet would disagree with you there, the amount of people in the wards due to smoking the safest of all psychoactive drugs is higher then most would assume? but we all know how it is: ?Each to their own?.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

It depends on the person... really. But developing schizophrenia isn't fun i imagine


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## invisible.ink (Feb 2, 2007)

Either way, people are going to smoke it. There is no stopping them. So, it doesn't really matter.
What matters to me is that I will not smoke it or ever go near it again. Even though it isn't what triggered my DP/DR, I definitely do not want to exacerbate it (and I'm sure it would if I smoked again) so I'm staying clear of it.
However, I don't think legalizing it would be the best idea, either. I would be very put off if someone walked past me with a lit joint in public. There would be too many unwanted contact highs. Can you imagine going into a bar filled with weed smoke? Terrible.


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

I've smoked weed a few times since my DP really took hold and it doesn't really make it worse. I can differentiate the DP from the cannabis high so that it doesn't make me more depersonalized, it just makes me high and depersonalized.


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## invisible.ink (Feb 2, 2007)

Ludovico said:


> I've smoked weed a few times since my DP really took hold and it doesn't really make it worse. I can differentiate the DP from the cannabis high so that it doesn't make me more depersonalized, it just makes me high and depersonalized.


That has to be a strange feeling. I haven't smoked in almost 5 months so I have no idea how it feels to be both at once. I think I would have a nervous breakdown.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

Ludovico said:


> I've smoked weed a few times since my DP really took hold and it doesn't really make it worse. I can differentiate the DP from the cannabis high so that it doesn't make me more depersonalized, it just makes me high and depersonalized.


Well for someone else this could be a different story!

Drugs are what made me dp/dr after years of smoking marijuana, I had one last mushroom trip and that sent me into a bizarre an alien world that filled me with terror.

done with drugs


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

?real?ity? said:


> ... I had one last mushroom trip and that sent me into a bizarre an alien world that filled me with terror.


Yeah, sounds like a pretty standard mushroom trip.


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## CECIL (Oct 3, 2004)

No, instead of spending millions of dollars of tax payer's money each year policing drugs, I think they should ALL be legalised. People should have the right to decide what they put into their own bodies.

If we were to legalise drugs, we could instead spend a fraction of what we spend on policing it now and instead have unbiased education programs, safe places to use and more ways to get help if drugs become a problem.

Regulated supply of drugs to people is safer and it would overnight eliminate the black market for drugs, which as an industry accounts for a whole lot of pain, suffering and even death.

And to everyone who says drugs can have negative effects: Well yes, they can. But if a person has access to all the information reguarding a drug, has access to a safe place to use the drug and has access to people that can help them if the drug causes a problem, then they can make an informed choice. Then they are fully responsible for the consequences of taking a drug.

Aside from that, Marijuana is one of if not the most safe drug out there. It causes less harm to the body than the legal drugs Alcohol and Tobacca. It can have adverse effects on the mind but then so can Alcohol abuse, so can prescription medication.

In my mind there's absolutely no reason, emotional or logical to not make drugs legal. The only possible reason is fear...


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

I don't think so. You could legalize weed grown naturally and not have to many problems but if you legalized skunk it would be hell.

Skunk has a very high content of active ingredient in skunk compared with more benign weed. Called tetrahydrocannabidinol or THC, it is the main psychoactive ingredient in cannabis, the bit that makes us high. Skunk tends to be grown hydroponically (without soil), indoors and without natural sunlight, and whereas 30 years ago an average joint contained about 10mg of THC, a joint of skunk today might contain as much as 300mg. Websites selling cannabis seeds emphasise their potency in a language that is the antithesis of hippy peace and love: "a true resin bomb"; "will have you on your knees begging for more"; "a killer skunk strain". One celebrated breed is called AK47, others bear names such as Guerrilla's Gusto, White Widow, Durban Poison, Paralyser (sic) and The Afflicted. For the dealers - and these online ads are pitched towards "professional cash croppers" - profits depend on being able to supply ever more mind-blowing stuff.

I think there needs to be more education alerting people to how different skunk is to normal weed. Normal weed is the equivilant to beer. Skunk is more like whiskey. It's unfair selling skunk to kids that want to experience the experience of smoking normal weed.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

^^^ The THC content of weed doesent really matter people just smoke less of the good stuff. There is nothing worse then having to smoke a shitload of crap weed in order to get high. Weed with higher THC content also mean's that you inhale less smoke due to smoking less of it and that is a good thing.

Ive had white widow and the best BC skunk weed around and id rather smoke that any day then poorly grown weed with a low THC content. Inhaling too much smoke is nasty on the throat and the stronger stuff feel's like a cleaner high for some reason.

Also the test's done on those older batches of weed back in the 60's was mostly done with weed that had been sitting in police station's for awile i think. THC degrades over time so the weed of today may not be that much stronger then it was years ago. Not that it makes abit of difference anyway.

I smoked weed when i had really bad dp/dr and it never had any negative effect on me. In fact it usually made it better and it made my mood's alot more stable as well. But my dp/dr seem's to be totally anxiety based so smoking weed took away my anxiety which in turn killed off the dp/dr.

For the record i think all drug's should be legal not just weed.


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## university girl (Aug 11, 2004)

If it were to be legalized, a massive research campaign should be untaken first. The medical community is divided on the issue of marijuana CAUSING mental illness and this is something that needs to be determined once and for all. Only then should legalizing marijuana even be looked at. Also, whether research is conclusive or not, if marijuana was to be legalized the government(s) should also develop and implement an education-based program about marijuana and it's potential ill-effects.


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## Jack30 (Apr 27, 2006)

Miss Ink, I couldn't agree with you more...with the 'nervous breakdown' remark.

This is why it astounds me that some people on this board - and we are all connected by DR/DP - take drugs. It boggles my mind. I have been spending more than 10 years staying clean and trying to keep my feet on the ground. If I got high today? I'd be set back a century or two.


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## Jack30 (Apr 27, 2006)

But anyway...all drugs should be legal. I am tired of my tax dollars paying for an effort in futility (aka, 'The War on Drugs')

Want to make something illegal in its place? Let's start with Oprah.


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## Coming?Back2Life (Oct 20, 2006)

> Drugs are what made me dp/dr after years of smoking marijuana, I had one last mushroom trip and that sent me into a bizarre an alien world that filled me with terror.


I know exactly how that feels i badly tripped out on them and i became so anxious and panicky like i was going insane and looking at myself from the outside it was terrifying i was also hearing things and hallucinating it was so fucking real lol thankfully that never happened again :| and i never had that b4 or since on any drugs no matter how much i`ve taken altho lsd/mushrooms i won`t go near ever again.

Drugs are bad they change the chemicals in your brain and the human brain is by far the most powerful brain and most complex and probably the most delicate and itis sitting in a nice equilibrium if u upset it by plying it with chemicals you are playing with fire and everyone i know who has taken lots of drugs has been burned badly at some points and some it has ruined their lives completely.


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2007)

haha oprah, guarantee she smokes pot haha


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

Ludovico said:


> ?real?ity? said:
> 
> 
> > ... I had one last mushroom trip and that sent me into a bizarre an alien world that filled me with terror.
> ...


yep, but the thing is, i was already dp/dr'd when i took the trip hahahaha, i didn't know what dp/dr was then though, so yeah, i'm not that stupid

drugs might have made my dp/dr worse, but i had dp/dr before i even started getting into mind altering substances


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## CECIL (Oct 3, 2004)

closetome said:


> Skunk has a very high content of active ingredient in skunk compared with more benign weed. Called tetrahydrocannabidinol or THC, it is the main psychoactive ingredient in cannabis, the bit that makes us high. Skunk tends to be grown hydroponically (without soil), indoors and without natural sunlight, and whereas 30 years ago an average joint contained about 10mg of THC, a joint of skunk today might contain as much as 300mg. Websites selling cannabis seeds emphasise their potency in a language that is the antithesis of hippy peace and love: "a true resin bomb"; "will have you on your knees begging for more"; "a killer skunk strain". One celebrated breed is called AK47, others bear names such as Guerrilla's Gusto, White Widow, Durban Poison, Paralyser (sic) and The Afflicted. For the dealers - and these online ads are pitched towards "professional cash croppers" - profits depend on being able to supply ever more mind-blowing stuff.


This is exactly my point. Instead of spending BILLIONS of Dollars every year to police drugs, the government grows it and REGULATES it. Now we not only have a standard dose available to everyone (equivalent to a standard drink), we have drugs that we know what's in it (for other stuff like E for example) AND we are making money off the thousands of other uses for pot plants (clothes, paper etc).



> But anyway...all drugs should be legal. I am tired of my tax dollars paying for an effort in futility (aka, 'The War on Drugs')


QFT.

"It's not a war on drugs. It's a war on personal freedoms, ok. Keep that in mind at all times. Thank you." - Bill Hicks.


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

Jack30 said:


> Miss Ink, I couldn't agree with you more...with the 'nervous breakdown' remark.
> 
> This is why it astounds me that some people on this board - and we are all connected by DR/DP - take drugs. It boggles my mind. I have been spending more than 10 years staying clean and trying to keep my feet on the ground. If I got high today? I'd be set back a century or two.


I agree. When I was smoking I would work hard on my self and making things good and then it's almost like weed just set me straight back to zero. 
I've given up for life too. I don't want my whole life to be governed by weed. It can show you the way spiritually but the real change has to come from within.


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## invisible.ink (Feb 2, 2007)

Jack30 said:


> Miss Ink, I couldn't agree with you more...with the 'nervous breakdown' remark.
> 
> This is why it astounds me that some people on this board - and we are all connected by DR/DP - take drugs. It boggles my mind. I have been spending more than 10 years staying clean and trying to keep my feet on the ground. If I got high today? I'd be set back a century or two.


Exactly. I can't imagine getting stoned in my current frame of mind. It would be like looking at yourself in a mirror, looking at yourself in a mirror...etc. KWIM?
Although, I don't think it was weed that provoked the onset of my DP/DR alone I believe a certain incident, with smoking and drinking at the same time, I had set off the chain of events that triggered my depression and then my DP/DR.


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## Jack30 (Apr 27, 2006)

Miss Ink...My DR/DP is not drug-induced either. It's all a product of anxiety, panic, and excessive rumination.

What it comes down to is why in the hell someone who has experienced derealization out of no cause of his/her own (and experienced the fear that accompanies it) *choose* to alter reality?


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## invisible.ink (Feb 2, 2007)

Jack30 said:


> Miss Ink...My DR/DP is not drug-induced either. It's all a product of anxiety, panic, and excessive rumination.
> 
> What it comes down to is why in the hell someone who has experienced derealization out of no cause of his/her own (and experienced the fear that accompanies it) *choose* to alter reality?


I agree. It makes no sense to me. When I tried to explain this condition to my brother (who is a frequent smoker) I used the analogy of feeling high all the time. His reply was, "That must be nice." Right......He didn't get it.


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2007)

UGH! thats how i explain it to people and whenever they say, that must be nice, i wanna smack em upside the head.


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## invisible.ink (Feb 2, 2007)

Jgard10 said:


> UGH! thats how i explain it to people and whenever they say, that must be nice, i wanna smack em upside the head.


Yes! When I used to smoke, of course it was nice to step outside reality for a few hours. But I knew I could fall asleep and it would eventually wear off! Now, we are stuck NEVER knowing when it will go away or even IF it will. That uncertainty is hell and people don't get that.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

dp can be nice, in it's ways (personal opinion anyway) 

i've smoked pot when i've been full blown dp/drd already. i've also eaten mushrooms while already dp'd.

yeah, i now it's like playing with fire... but i've learned alot and have also dug myself quite a bit of a rabbit hole :wink: ...


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

Jack30 said:


> What it comes down to is why in the hell someone who has experienced derealization out of no cause of his/her own (and experienced the fear that accompanies it) *choose* to alter reality?


 I just like to alter reality mainly because i find everyday reality as boring as hell. But altering your reality through drug's is not like derealization. It's actually pleasant thats the difference and there is usually no fear.

Granted i dont take psychedelic's very often anymore mainly because i have noone to do them with really. Now it's just opiates which dont really alter reality at all they just make all the bullshit seem less important.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

comfortably numb said:


> Jack30 said:
> 
> 
> > What it comes down to is why in the hell someone who has experienced derealization out of no cause of his/her own (and experienced the fear that accompanies it) *choose* to alter reality?
> ...


for someone who have derealization already, i can asure you, a mushroom trip would be a rollercoaster ride through hell

edit: that's if you fear derealization anyway... because that's what mushrooms are


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## Guest (Mar 7, 2007)

remind me to never try shrooms, DR is the scariest feeling everrrrrrr


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

i agree. Mushrooms=confusion=scary


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## Jack30 (Apr 27, 2006)

I don't know. I have eaten, smoked, snorted and injected every substance imaginable. And sure... the loss of reality and self associated with something like salvia divinorum is unparalleled. But that's not the point. It's the *fear* associated with clinical DR/DP that sets it apart from the effect any drug delivers.

I know what reality is. When I was younger, I *chose* to tweak it. Sometimes very, very badly. But no matter how other-worldly the high was, that element of fear was absent, or at least simply acute. That's the difference.

Anyone who says being in a state of DR is cool or fun or "a trip" has never experienced that fear. The fear that reality is gone. That madness is nigh.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

Jack30 said:


> I don't know. I have eaten, smoked, snorted and injected every substance imaginable. And sure... the loss of reality and self associated with something like salvia divinorum is unparalleled. But that's not the point. It's the *fear* associated with clinical DR/DP that sets it apart from the effect any drug delivers.
> 
> I know what reality is. When I was younger, I *chose* to tweak it. Sometimes very, very badly. But no matter how other-worldly the high was, that element of fear was absent, or at least simply acute. That's the difference.
> 
> Anyone who says being in a state of DR is cool or fun or "a trip" has never experienced that fear. The fear that reality is gone. That madness is nigh.


I've experienced that fear... that's the worst part of dp/dr. But the thing is I don't always experience that fear, it can come in waves and bouts. When i'm dr'd without fear it's actually an interesting experience which allows me to think about and ponder reality deeper than any clear sober state of mind i could have, because my ideas of what "reality" is has vanished


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

A high dose of mushrooms is an amazing experience. It's normal to feel completely overwhelmed by them, but if you can handle the alteration of reality it can be a very beneficial experience. Shrooms made me a better person, and I know a lot of people that would agree.


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## Guest (Mar 7, 2007)

if i cant handle something as "mild" as pot without developing a psychological condition, i think a psychadelic is completely outta the question haha


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## Mischa (Aug 23, 2004)

The idea mentioned in some posts that drugs are legalized and people decide what they put in their body is really funny.

I am really terrified at the idea that pot in my country is legalized and you can buy it everywhere ( like in Netherlands ...) . There is an exemplary story on this board by Dark ( a guy whose DP started after one joint on a trip to Amsterdam). 
Definitely there is a strong group of people who feel that pot is benefitial for them and who like to emphasize its medical benefits (my little doubts...) , I do not see any problem if pot is made more accesible for such people and for medical use, but under careful control and regulation. Total legalization - bad idea to me - would increase number of unwanted contacts as someone wrote .


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

?real?ity? said:


> for someone who have derealization already, i can asure you, a mushroom trip would be a rollercoaster ride through hell
> 
> edit: that's if you fear derealization anyway... because that's what mushrooms are


 I have taken mushroom's many times often in very high doses and i never found it to be much like dr. Ive taken mushroom's while i had dr and i actually felt better after taking them.

With mushroom's i sometimes because confused and sure in high doses the world looked very strange but it looked strange in a pleasant way. That's the difference dr is unpleasant while mushroom's are very pleasant. I always loved the way the world looked on shroom's and i loved the emotional aspect of it as well. I always get very lovey dovey on shroom's.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

Mischa said:


> The idea mentioned in some posts that drugs are legalized and people decide what they put in their body is really funny.
> 
> I am really terrified at the idea that pot in my country is legalized and you can buy it everywhere ( like in Netherlands ...) . There is an exemplary story on this board by Dark ( a guy whose DP started after one joint on a trip to Amsterdam).
> Definitely there is a strong group of people who feel that pot is benefitial for them and who like to emphasize its medical benefits (my little doubts...) , I do not see any problem if pot is made more accesible for such people and for medical use, but under careful control and regulation. Total legalization - bad idea to me - would increase number of unwanted contacts as someone wrote .


 What do you mean by unwanted contact's? Walking by someone smoking pot on the street or what? It's no worse then breathing in second hand ciggarette smoke.

Whats next we ban people from smoking on the street just because you dont like it.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

comfortably numb said:


> ?real?ity? said:
> 
> 
> > for someone who have derealization already, i can asure you, a mushroom trip would be a rollercoaster ride through hell
> ...


wow bro, don't see how thats happening for you. how much did you eat. mushrooms brake down reality, so if you already have dr.. it's going to be amplified.. and so will your emotions.. so if you fear dr, you will fear the mushroom dr.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

> wow bro, don't see how thats happening for you. how much did you eat. mushrooms brake down reality, so if you already have dr.. it's going to be amplified.. and so will your emotions.. so if you fear dr, you will fear the mushroom dr.


 Ive eaten over 200 of the little bastards in one go and yes reality does tend to disintegrate at that dose. Things get really weird but good weird not like dr. I used to just go with the flow so to speak and i usually had no anxiety. The world looked beautiful on shroom's unlike dr where the world looked ugly and mean.

So for me atleast mushroom's are not like dr at all. They are miles apart. I didnt have any fear on shroom's i always knew thing's where going to be alright. I guess it's that sense of connection to the universe that you get with them.


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## Mischa (Aug 23, 2004)

I think by unwanted contact I meant looking at someone smoking pot in the street ....hehehe... sorry just trying to push the debate into even higher levels....


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## CECIL (Oct 3, 2004)

If it were legalised there'd also be legal places to smoke. You aren't allowed to drink alcohol on the street, for example. If you walk into a pot bar and get high well, that's your responsibility.

As for Mushrooms, for they they exacerbate my anxiety a million fold. Everything is just chaotic and confusing which often put me in some really bad states. I think at much higher doses it would be different because you would experience "ego death". I have a real problem going with the flow though.

Conversely Mescaline was a very pleasant experience for me (even the vomiting, lol). The trip's character is like being guided through the whole experience by a supportive, helping prescence.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

CECIL said:


> If it were legalised there'd also be legal places to smoke. You aren't allowed to drink alcohol on the street, for example. If you walk into a pot bar and get high well, that's your responsibility.
> 
> As for Mushrooms, for they they exacerbate my anxiety a million fold. Everything is just chaotic and confusing which often put me in some really bad states. I think at much higher doses it would be different because you would experience "ego death". I have a real problem going with the flow though.
> 
> Conversely Mescaline was a very pleasant experience for me (even the vomiting, lol). The trip's character is like being guided through the whole experience by a supportive, helping prescence.


 Ya that's when people run into trouble on psychedelic's. They get scared and try to fight it which in turn causes the bad trip. The trick is not to fight it and just go with the flow so to speak. Granted that can be goddamn hard when the wallpaper start's melting into the floor.

I have experienced ego death on high doses and it's a very weird experience and i cant really describe what it feel's like. I took a unknown dose of shroom's one night when my idiot friend messed up the dose on some dried mushroom's and i experienced total ego loss. I have no idea how many shroom's there where in that batch but im guessing close to 250 or so. The record here is about 400 taken in tea.

Mescaline i would love to try. It's supposed to be a very gentle psychedelic and almost noone has a bad trip on it. It's a phenethylamine like MDMA and those drug's are generally easier to handle then the tryptamines like LSD and psilocybin (shroom's).

If you look up the trip report's on http://www.erowid.org for mescaline there is hardly any bad trip's there. Bad trip's are much more common on LSD or magic mushroom's.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

i have experienced ego loss too... anyone with dp or dr, for the most part has experience an "ego loss"

but 400 mushrooms?! WTF

dude that's over kill... are you sure you're eatting the right mushrooms. i think you're average joe would lose their marbles completely LOL

how big are they? are they dried or fresh?


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

?real?ity? said:


> i have experienced ego loss too... anyone with dp or dr, for the most part has experience an "ego loss"
> 
> but 400 mushrooms?! WTF
> 
> ...


 Yup im serious 400 of them. I would not have believed it if i had not seen it. The guy was completly gone but he was not freaking out. I asked him how he was feeling and he mumbled something about his hands. He was on another plain of existence at that point i think.

They are average sized mushroom's that grow here and there pretty goddamn potent as well. You can catch a buzz on 15 or so. I usually eat them dried or i make tea out of the fresh ones. It's not very often i can get up the courage to eat the raw whole shroom's. That's just nasty on the stomach unless you chase it with maloxx.

Here you can just pick your own cause they grow everywhere basically so nobody bother's weighing them.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

but how do you know they're the right mushrooms? are you sure they're psilocybin or is it a placebo


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

?real?ity? said:


> but how do you know they're the right mushrooms? are you sure they're psilocybin or is it a placebo


 I know because ive been picking them since i was 14. There liberty cap mushroom's by what ive seen on the net and they sure as hell contain psilocybin. Everyone around here pick's the same kind and they get bombed on them.

Also there is no goddamn way that that much of a high is placebo. It's not only the psychedelic visual effect's that make the trip but it's also the emotional aspect of it such as the feeling of being connected to the universe and everyone around you. You also get that lovey dovey feeling. Not to mention the extreme pupil dilation that i get and also the weird effect's that psilocybin has on time such as minutes feeling like hour's. There have been times when i was sure 4 or 5 hour's had passed but in fact only an hour or so had passed. Ive also experienced the tasting color's thing which is truely strange.

The only other type of psychedelic mushroom's that are around here are the amanita muscaria (fly agaric) ones and they do not contain any psilocybin. They contain muscimol and ibotenic acid instead and have entirely different effect's then psilocybin from what ive heard. There supposed to have a kinda deliriant effect. They can also be dangerous, can be extremely unpleasant, cause a hell of alot of vomiting and unlike psilocybin containing shroom's they can be lethal.

I only know one person that has taken them and he said it was a very unpleasant experience. But some people do like them and actually find them to be rather mild. I might try them some day but not now. Also some species of amanitas are the deadliest mushroom's on earth so you better be goddamn sure you get the right ones. These are best left to the very experienced user's.


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## ?real?ity? (Feb 18, 2007)

i would not mess with amanitas sound it out A MAN EATER!  deleriants aren't fun

i actually would recommend not messing with mushrooms in the first place


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