# Logic sense that no one can get into heaven.



## TheStarter (Oct 19, 2010)

What a smart guy.

Opinions please


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## gill (Jul 1, 2010)

.


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## NewBrainPleeze (Aug 31, 2010)

What a smart guy I think you said? The guy just interperated the bible the way a 4 year old would see it if they read it. Its like saying I have a frog in my throat when your losing your voice. This guy would truly believe you had a frog in your throat. When asked how to get a tough stain out of something I would say put a little elbow grease into. This guy would hear this and say I do not know what I am talking about because there is no such thing as elbow grease. You can make the bible say anthing you want it to say to fit your agenda. Dont be fooled by this joker!


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## TheStarter (Oct 19, 2010)

Oh i love the way how a atheists like me always stay calm and get bashed on by religious people for simply saying what i think (thats called opinion)

And i have to agree with your username









So badbrains, tell me..
What did this guy do wrong ?


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## Tommygunz (Sep 7, 2009)

what he overlooked when coming up with this list, is that the answers that jesus gave to those men, we're specifically catered to them. he wasn't laying out rules for all mankind. he was talking directly to another person. the fact that the apostles wrote down what he said doesn't make it a law that applies to everyone. for example, maybe the man jesus told to sell everything was extremely selfish and and put more value on his possessions that god himself. what would jesus have him do, get rid of those possessions to test the man and help him grow in his relationship with god.

it's so easy for people to tear apart the scripture and use it to their advantage. all parties are guilty of it. but wether you believe or not, the point of the bible is very simple. and the instructions on what to do to live a happy life and receive eternal life are as plain as day. treat people well, treat yourself well, try not to sin, believe jesus is who he says he is and accept him as your savior. if you can do that then your pretty much taken care of.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

Eh people who are religious are religious for a reason. Maybe they were raised that way, or maybe it brings them comfort. Just like people who aren't religious aren't for a reason. No one is really right or wrong. Religion and Atheism are just two sides of the same coin. We are all people, we all have different ways of dealing with life and viewing life. We are all connected, just not everyone sees that. The label of your belief isn't what's important what's important is acknowledging that we are all people journeying through this thing called life. In my opinion labeling yourself something just brings about division and as a whole division is the last thing we need. If you are an atheist practice loving a christian. If you are a christian practice loving an atheist. Love is all that really matters, it's what keeps us connected.


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## TheStarter (Oct 19, 2010)

Tommygunz said:


> *what he overlooked when coming up with this list, is that the answers that jesus gave to those men, we're specifically catered to them. he wasn't laying out rules for all mankind.* he was talking directly to another person. the fact that the apostles wrote down what he said doesn't make it a law that applies to everyone. for example, maybe the man jesus told to sell everything was extremely selfish and and put more value on his possessions that god himself. what would jesus have him do, get rid of those possessions to test the man and help him grow in his relationship with god.
> 
> it's so easy for people to tear apart the scripture and use it to their advantage. all parties are guilty of it. but wether you believe or not, the point of the bible is very simple. and the instructions on what to do to live a happy life and receive eternal life are as plain as day. treat people well, treat yourself well, try not to sin, believe jesus is who he says he is and accept him as your savior. if you can do that then your pretty much taken care of.


That still doesn't seem reasonable/logic for the men he gave this 'list' to does it ?


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## Pablo (Sep 1, 2005)

Tommygunz said:


> what he overlooked when coming up with this list, is that the answers that jesus gave to those men, we're specifically catered to them. he wasn't laying out rules for all mankind. he was talking directly to another person. the fact that the apostles wrote down what he said doesn't make it a law that applies to everyone. for example, maybe the man jesus told to sell everything was extremely selfish and and put more value on his possessions that god himself. what would jesus have him do, get rid of those possessions to test the man and help him grow in his relationship with god.


Yeah I totally agree, you need to take into account who these things were said to and why and in what context and in what era they were said.

Religious metaphor is a way to communicate with the right brain of human beings which doesn't deal with literal thinking so much, but many people try to interpret it with their literal logical left brain which is a mistake in my opinion

Personally I think when Jesus talks about only poor people get into heaven he is talking metaphorically about value and attachment people put on things and the importance of letting go of that, not literally about being poor, the Buddha says the same thing the problem isn't actually being rich it's about the value you put on your wealth and your attachment to it. If you place great internal value on your wealth and possessions it creates a great fear as in reality you could lose them at any moment or someone could take them away plus you cant take them with you when you die, therefore giving up the value you put in material things and becoming "poor" gives you peace of mind as you wont stress or want to kill anyone if you loose them. If you are prepared to let everything you have go just as easily as you let go of your breath then you will be happy and without fear, which I would call living in the kingdom of heaven while you are still alive.


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## Tommygunz (Sep 7, 2009)

TheStarter said:


> That still doesn't seem reasonable/logic for the men he gave this 'list' to does it ?


I think given the time period it was a reasonable expectation. Ya gotta remember that in that era if you stole it was appropriate for the person you stole from to cut off your hand. It was a time period of radical extremism. If Jesus were here today under modern circumstances I imagine he might have had different advice to fit the standards of the day. While still maintaining a divine approach to achieving eternal life.


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## TheStarter (Oct 19, 2010)

Well, im glad you are the people that come with a good detailed opinion of your own, cause 99% of the times i post something like this i get 3289402374092874 negative rep and get flamed from every side.


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## TheStarter (Oct 19, 2010)

Tommygunz said:


> I think given the time period it was a reasonable expectation. Ya gotta remember that in that era if you stole it was appropriate for the person you stole from to cut off your hand. It was a time period of radical extremism. If Jesus were here today under modern circumstances I imagine he might have had different advice to fit the standards of the day. While still maintaining a divine approach to achieving eternal life.


Then i still think its weird he doesnt come back or let 'someone' rewrite 'the bible'. Instead of fooling current mankind with a 2010 year old book when the circumstances were different.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

Pablo said:


> If you are prepared to let everything you have go just as easily as you let go of your breath then you will be happy and without fear, which I would call living in the kingdom of heaven while you are still alive.


I tend to think the same thing. I use to think that eternal life was something that happens when we die. If that were the case though then that would mean rejecting the present moment and looking forward to death. Doing so creates misery. To me hell is a state of mind, or rejection of the present moment. The opposite of that "heaven" is inner peace through accepting what is.


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## Guest (Dec 26, 2010)

Earth is the Garden of Eden or a Concrete Jungle. Earth is the middle ground where we can either make Heaven or Hell. It's up to us to choose responsibly what to do with Paradise.


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## Pablo (Sep 1, 2005)

surfingisfun001 said:


> I tend to think the same thing. I use to think that eternal life was something that happens when we die. If that were the case though then that would mean rejecting the present moment and looking forward to death. Doing so creates misery. To me hell is a state of mind, or rejection of the present moment. The opposite of that "heaven" is inner peace through accepting what is.


Yeah I totally agree with you, when your mind is in the past it causes worry and guilt and when it is in the future there is fear and stress, whereas in a complete acceptance of the present moment there is a constant rebirth of life which could be what they mean by eternal life.

When it comes down to it most of these masters are saying the same thing, Jesus says "take up your cross" and "The foxes have holes and the birds of the air have nests but the son of man has nowhere to lay his head." which is the basically the same message as the Buddha when he says "life is suffering". What they are saying in my opinion is that most normal regular people do whatever they can to avoid suffering and control our lives which is a natural response to wanting to be happy, but all the spiritually wise masters from all areas of the globe and from different religions and eras in time say you have to reverse this trend of your ego and fully embrace your suffering, stop trying to run away control and avoid your suffering and embrace it, look at and feel the intensity of your fear, anxiety and pain whenever it comes up. Which is also more or less what they say in modern psychology and CBT. Only then will you be able to live in the present moment.

So in a way there is a bit of a joke or a flip to it in that to get into heaven while you are on earth you have to embrace and accept the hellish parts of your life more fully rather than try to escape from them which is the natural response.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

Pablo said:


> So in a way there is a bit of a joke or a flip to it in that to get into heaven while you are on earth you have to embrace and accept the hellish parts of your life more fully rather than try to escape from them which is the natural response.


Agreed.


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## FoXS (Nov 4, 2009)

that's so boring, again somebody is just turning around words which are written down in the bible. for example, the speaker in the video seems so shocked about that jesus said "eat my flesh and drink my blood". but really everybody knows that this was meant metaphorical. that its a method to feel connected to jesus when you consume bread and wine. and the speaker sais "oh my goood, we have to eat his fleeesh!!" thats lame.


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## DiscoStick (Dec 13, 2009)

You can make thousands of 'logical' arguments about the afterlife, depending on how you read scripture.


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