# Quran book burning 4 hrs away from me



## Minerva8979 (Jan 30, 2010)

In gainesville,fl and I want to drive down there and protest so bad! haha. It probably wont' happen anyway.


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## ValleyGirl (Nov 10, 2017)

As you know, I'm a Christian and would just like to say that these people do NOT know God if they think it's ok to act this way. It infuriates me.


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## voidvoid (Sep 5, 2008)

I suggest you go there and hand out this flyer.


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

Minerva8979 said:


> In gainesville,fl and I want to drive down there and protest so bad! haha. It probably wont' happen anyway.


Let's hope it doesn't happen!


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## DiscoStick (Dec 13, 2009)

You bet they've never even read the Qur'an.

I'd like to say, as someone who has read both the Bible and the Qur'an front to back, that they are far more similar than these people would ever admit to. And both equally misunderstood by both those who oppose the book and those who can't read it beyond face value.

The sheer stupidity and intolerance of people is both shocking and saddening.


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

i support the burning 100 percent. who the fuck cares... theyre not hurting anybody. lets burn the bible as well! the world needs less religous idiots and more rational thinking people.


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## sonnl (Apr 15, 2009)

,


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## voidvoid (Sep 5, 2008)

The stupidest thing is that 9/11 had very little if anything to do with the Quran. See above.


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## Pablo (Sep 1, 2005)

The stupidest thing about all this is that ten of thousands of supposedly "sane" people could declare a holy war leading to thousands of peoples deaths just because some poor angry bloke wants a bit if attention by burning a simple book. The world is insane


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## S O L A R I S (Dec 24, 2009)

What they are doing is totally ridiculous and I am trying to understand the logic behind it but i dont think theres any behind it. How can you burn a holy book, and at the same time claim that you dont have anything against its followers? I cant understand that.

Its even more offensive because the burning of the holy book will coincide with the first day of Eid Al-Fitr, a religious muslim holiday marking the end of Ramadan - the holy month of fasting.

Even if they go ahead with it, I hope the media does not cover it on TV and just let it fizzle away. They want attention, that's what it is.


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)




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## sonnl (Apr 15, 2009)

.


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## S O L A R I S (Dec 24, 2009)

Its been CANCELED!

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/US/09/09/florida.quran.burning/index.html?hpt=T1#fbid=JnwYNkHlK9N&wom=false


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

sonnl said:


> this shits so stupid, i honestly hope theirs a serious reaction from the terrorists on this one


This is the fear. I have no doubt there will be some degree of retaliation for this as there was when in Denmark a cartoon of Allah? was published ... I have to look that up again, my eyes are bleeding from reading the news. I have to look that up again.

This is sadly "freedom of speech" but so darned idiotic I can't believe it.

Also, just read the NYTimes and a few other papers. There's a lot of misinformation right now, but I have no doubt there will be a backlash.

This is sheer stupidity, and this pastor has a history of criminal behavior in his church. His congregation is appalled by this. I doubt this will happen. But this will also force the issue on building the Muslim Center near the new WTC.

This also in a degree reflects the momentum behind the "Tea Party movement."

Inzom, Saddam Hussein was a target of many countries -- assasination, etc. for decades. He violated UN protocal over and over. Though bin Laden is the "leader" (who knows where the Hell he is now) of Al Qu'aeda and is Saudi Arabian, the WTC attack was a stupid knee-jerk reaction to attmept to finish off Saddam. Well, he was caught. However this did not justify our going into IRAQ. There is a different between idiotic foreign policy which occurs all the time and a conspiracy, YET AGAIN! Read the facts. And most Americans are disgusted by the Iraq and Afghanistan wars. Saddam however was endlessly threatening an invasion of neighboring countries.

He also staged the genocide of a huge number of Kurds ... one of three different sects of Islam (Shiite and Sunni making the other two.)

Conspiracy theorists look at things on the surface, the simplest answers without examining the COMPLEX interaction of countries and leaders.

My GOD, I wish my memory didn't stink. What happened in Denmark after that cartoon was published. It was foolish to do, as Muslims do not have an image of Allah. All Mosques merely show mosaics, no images. How do I know, I've been to Istanbul and other Muslim countries and been in Mosques abroad.


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

S O L A R I S said:


> Its been CANCELED!
> 
> http://edition.cnn.com/2010/US/09/09/florida.quran.burning/index.html?hpt=T1#fbid=JnwYNkHlK9N&wom=false


Thank you! The news has been all over the place on this. Some little town idiot can sure cause a big mess. IDIOT, IDIOT, IDIOT. And no he does NOT represent all Christians. He is again a zealot, an extremist, a publicity seeker.


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

sonnl said:


> a thousand bucks says the preacher in charge of all this gets caught with a male prostitute of middle eastern background sometime next year.


I don't even doubt you. This guy has been dipping into the church till last I heard. Need more details. Rumors are flying around like in a tornado over this.


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

Pablo said:


> The stupidest thing about all this is that ten of thousands of supposedly "sane" people could declare a holy war leading to thousands of peoples deaths just because some poor angry bloke wants a bit if attention by burning a simple book. The world is insane


The Jihad or Holy War has already been declared. The concern has been random terrorist acts, conceivably in all Western countries, and to soldiers in the Middle East. Nothing new, but my guess is all airports in this country have been at Red Alert since this started. ONE STONE FOOL IDIOT can cause all of this mess. Well, he's famous now. Perhaps that's what he wanted. IDIOT! My GOD!


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

INZOM, this is what I mean by misstatement of facts. This is from Wikipedia. The FBI.gov site lists bin Laden as a fugitive terrorist. He is not specifically being sought out for 9/11, but HE HIMSELF HAS CELEBRATED IT AND CLAIMED RESPONSIBILITY IN THE PLANNING OF SAID ATTACKS. You can show all the quotations in the world, but if taken out of context, they are meaningless.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI_Ten_Most_Wanted_Fugitives
There are different individuals, categorized as IMMEDIATE threats ... look at the current list. Some individuals have not been found for years. I doubt bin Laden will ever be found, or found alive. He pops up now and again on videos looking sickly. His henchmen take care of him, and his dirty work. That doesn't mean he still isn't wanted. He REPRESENTS a dangerous organization.

Osama bin Laden[a] is the leader of al-Qaeda and *is wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998, bombings of the United States embassies*, Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. These attacks killed over 200 people. Bin Laden and al-Qaeda is *alleged to be responsible for the October 12, 2000, attack on the USS Cole* off the coast of Yemen, which killed 17. Although bin Laden later appeared on the first publicly released FBI Most Wanted Terrorists list on October 10, 2001, he was listed there for his alleged role in the 1998 embassy attack, and not for his alleged role in the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks that killed nearly 3,000 people, because the most wanted lists name fugitives charged with a crime by a prosecutor or under indictment by a grand jury. *Bin Laden was named as an "unindicted co-conspirator" in, for instance, the federal indictment against convicted terrorist Zacarias Moussaoui, but has not been formally indicted for alleged his role in the September 11, 2001, attacks.*

Osama bin Laden is the subject of a $50 million[14] reward through the State Department's Rewards for Justice program targeting international fugitives, especially alleged terrorists, plus $2 million through a program developed and funded by the Air Line Pilots Association and the Air Transport Association.[a][15][16]


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

Dreamer* said:


> I have no doubt there will be some degree of retaliation for this as there was when in Denmark a cartoon of Allah?


It was for drawing Mohammed. That is forbidden in their world view/religion...Islam. I honestly don't know very much about Islam.


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

ThoughtOnFire said:


> It was for drawing Mohammed. That is forbidden in their world view/religion...Islam. I honestly don't know very much about Islam.


YES, I just had to look it up. Ironically the cartoonist was given an award! Muhammad was the founder of Islam, centuries ago. Believed to be a prophet, in the Qu'uran, Jesus and Moses are noted as prophets who foresaw the coming of Muhammad.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11236158

From the BBC: 9/8/10 ... yesterday!

"German Chancellor Angela Merkel has defended Danish cartoonist Kurt Westergaard, whose cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad caused anger in 2006.

*A depiction of Muhammad's turban as a fused bomb sparked global outrage when it was published in Denmark.*

.....

*Dozens of people died in violence that broke out in early 2006, months after Jyllands-Posten published the cartoons showing Muhammad in a variety of humorous or satirical situations. Muslims regard the depiction of the prophet as blasphemy.*

The M100 media prize committee praised Kurt Westergaard for what it said was his "courage" to defend democratic values despite threats of violence and death.

Security was tight at Sanssouci palace in Potsdam where the cartoonist told reporters: "Maybe they will try to kill me and maybe they will have success, but they cannot kill the cartoon."

The irony. This celebrates freedom of speech ... which I agree with 100% ... but look at the consequences. We can't be afraid to speak our minds. But this is also like Rushdie's "Satanic Verses" about the Qu'ran SP!? ... his life has been in danger for years.

THIS HAPPENS ALL OVER THE WORLD. I WORRY ABOUT PEACE AS WE ARE SO DIVERSE AND WE FIGHT FOR DIFFERENT PRINCIPLES. GAH!


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

Yes, in the Muslim religion, you must not depict the image of any God or prophet. All mosques have NO images. Unlike in a Church where you see Christ, Saints, etc. It is believed (I think) that these individuals are so Holy they cannot be properly depicted in any way. I don't know enough, but a mosque is usually a large building decorated with mosaics, no images, and carpets on the floor ... no place to sit. I was stunned at the beauty and silence in the Blue Mosque. Unbelievable. Like going to the Vatican! There is such beauty, and such hatred. So sad.


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## Minerva8979 (Jan 30, 2010)

Either way, apparently the forum for discussion needed to be catalyzed. Look what it's allowing everyone to confront! I doubt the burning will continue since the local legislative forces have condemned it.

And NO I dont hope it happens, whoever said that isn't considering the practical backlash from it, regardless of who commits it. Protests are already being held worldwide because of this, some not contained and peaceful.


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## BlueTank (Jun 2, 2010)

People want others to be like them.... Naturally that means some level of following them... that is a responsibility and an inherently_ leadership_ - The only real leaders lead by example. A leader that does not lead by example is crap.

I don't know what example these people were intending to set. So its crap. Its frustration, fear, and confusion being acted and exhumed/expelled like a man beating his wife after losing his job. They may as well Clone Stamp flames around in photoshop over the top of a digital copy of the book..... or just spam out emails saying "I hate... Yur not me. Burn... Git R' Dunnnn.."


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## voidvoid (Sep 5, 2008)

Dreamer: How can you say that people in the truth-movement "look at things on the surface, the simplest answers without examining the COMPLEX interaction of countries and leaders." when examining the complex interaction of countries and leaders is in fact exactly what they do. Perhaps sometimes even too much. You really do underestimate independent journalists/reporters.

You can say what you want, there are a multitude of *facts* like the ones above. And your only criticism is that they are "out of context"? Facts are facts and they paint a clear picture. And please explain to me how they are out of context here because I really do not understand. You cannot disprove them and therefore use this nonsensical argument.

You dont think I know about Afghanistan and Iraq, Al-Qaida (spelling?) who by the way were trained by and aided by the CIA initially, and much of the other stuff that went on in the 80's and 90's and before that? I'm not saying that I'm an expert by any means, you probably know alot more about world politics in general than I. But you are sadly misinformed as are many about 9/11. You once wrote that a conspiracy like that would take hundreds of thousands of people. That is absurd. Again, look at Project Northwoods for example. Hell look at "regular" Black Ops.

Also keep in mind that to me this is not an America VS Europe debate, far from it, it is simply about 9/11 and the new world order.


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## S O L A R I S (Dec 24, 2009)

The origin of the mosque typology came from the traditional courtyard house. In essence, Muslims stand in rows following and imam - who recites words from the quran as part of prayer, during the times of Mohammed, Muslims would pray in the direction of Jerusalem- dome of the rock. At a later stage, Mohammed was sent with a revelation to unite believers towards the direction of Mecca, the kabaa- which is believed to be built by the prophet Abraham.

Imagery is not prohibited in Islam mainly because that is seen an idolatry. People in the Arabian peninsula followed Christianity, Judaism, and paganism. Part of muhammed's revelation was to abolish paganism. So prohibiting imagery is related to this. On the upside, this brought about some beautiful works of calligraphy and geometric patterning seen in mosques. Typical mosques are very modest with very little embellishments if any, just simple plastered walls, windows, a minaret, and the mihrab. State or civic mosques are usually the ones that are very detailed and filled with mosaics...etc

Following the courtyard house typology, and the conversion of the Byzantine empire to Islam. Most of the identity of the current mosque, especially the domed ceilings, were derived from Byzantine churches and Byzantine architecture I.e. Aya Sophia in Istanbul and the dome of the rock both of which were transformed into mosques. So in essence, a mosque is a mixture of the traditional courtyard home from the arabian penninsula and Byzantine architecture from Istanbul - or Constantinople as it used to be known

I'm an architect! Hence, the rundown through history of architecture above









I recall the Danish cartoon issue a while back, newspapers in the Arab world did condemn that act for sensitivity issues. And even if the quran burning did go through, I want to believe that a violent backlash would mainly be centered about few extremist groups in certain portions of the Islamic world. I would not think that it would be and all on protest. Jihad as well is a very loosely and freely used word, jihad translates to ' the struggle' that everyone endures in a daily life, these extremist groups have reinvented it into into something which it's not. Even the term Holy War that they use, is merely their own justification of their act using religion as an escape goat. There is nothing religious in what they are doing, its just a disguise.


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2010)

*SOLARIS,* you are a freakin' genius. And awesome you are an architect. Yes, no idols, no "paganism" ... makes sense to me. And in essence Christianity exemplifies the exact opposite. (Many "graven images" so to speak).

And I agree ... again these Fundamentalists use politics, and a desire to acquire territory in the guise of a religious belief. Thing is it would seem ... and I am so poor with details! ... damn DP ... that Mosque and State are more clearly integrated in the Middle East than Church and State are in the West or in the US. However, I am worried about the influence of the Church in the US, again being used as a guise in political movements.

Really gets my goat, lol.









*Inzom,* this is just useless, OK, I agree, I'm an idiot and anyone who thinks the way I do is an idiot. You didn't even read what I posted about the FBI list. Your "truth list" merely misstates and is misleading re: the actual facts.

*Oh, excuse me, I'm an idiot. I agree with you. What was I thinking? I'm so sorry and you are correct about everything.
Nite! So, now we have nothing to disagree about. I feel better.*


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2010)

And *Minerva*, hang onto your hat! Take pictures if possible (you could sell them to the National Enquier, lol).







But don't get yourself beaten senseless in some protest! Part of this is media spin gone haywire. Take Care!

This is indeed a "Mad world, sad world."


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## voidvoid (Sep 5, 2008)

I did read what you wrote about the FBI list. Hell I was even on the FBI site moments before reading it all just to be sure that I was not posting bullshit. This is pointless, when someone as intelligent as you wont even believe proven documented facts I cannot continue. And those facts neither misstates or are misleading. They are well documented hence not misstating and have a clear purpose hence not misleading.

You make it sound like I have stated that you and others are idiots, I have not. That is not cool to debate in that way.

Perhaps the saddest thing about all this is that if it werent for this debate, you and me would get along just fine and I think we have a lot in common.


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## Anakronak (Jun 16, 2010)

It got postponed.


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## S O L A R I S (Dec 24, 2009)

I am not an expert in politics, but my understanding is that the only countries in the middle east that fuse church and state completely is Saudi arabia and Iran only. So islamic sharia law is implemented explicitly.

The rest of the middle east have fused French/international legal system with certain elements of Islamic law. For example, people have the option of choosing regular banking system, or opt to go for an Islamic banking system. This covers also for example investments, inheritance...etc, you can choose which to go for.

I live in Dubai, so maybe it is a special case in the middle east, since 80 prrcent of the population are from foreign countries, it doesn't really make sense to impose islamic law on everybody in an explicit manner. It is optional to send children to Islamic schools, or you can send them to a French, american or British curriculum school. Religion is treated as an optional item in those places. You can also find alcohol, pork products in supermarkets which you can't find in many countries, with the exception of maybe Lebanon. There are decency rules such as no public display of affection in public, but Alot of Asian countries such as India and Singapore follow the same approach.

Criminal laws are the ones which follow both religious and secular laws. It's a mixed approach. All in all, I would say that Dubai, and Beirut are one of the most liberal cities in the middle east. Religion is a non issue, mainly because due to large population of foreigners, people have gotten used to this mixture and have worked in being considerate to each other. Malls are decked out during Christmas season, the same goes when the Diwali festival or Chinese new year.

I think Asian countries are undergoing a massive transformation, so it is interesting to see how the past is being merged with the future.


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2010)

> Criminal laws are the ones which follow both religious and secular laws. It's a mixed approach. All in all, I would say that Dubai, and Beirut are one of the most liberal cities in the middle east. Religion is a non issue, mainly because due to large population of foreigners, people have gotten used to this mixture and have worked in being considerate to each other. Malls are decked out during Christmas season, the same goes when the Diwali festival or Chinese new year.


*SOLARIS* you are a font of information! And you live in Dubai. What I have seen of Dubai seems very "Westernized." Here is the miracle of the internet that you are posting here from DUBAI! *I'm curious what the reaction there is to all of this insanity over here? Is it discussed at length? Or is it a non-issue? Also, may I ask ... do you practice a religion, and what is it? You don't have to respond, but I am curious. I'm mainly curious what you feel about all of this.* I know in certain Middle Eastern countries there are riots that have cropped up here and there.

I am VERY curious what happens tomorrow 9/11 here.

I have traveled and read, but I still feel so ignorant about so many things. The world is SO big, SO full of information, I am overwhelmed. Thank you for your posts.

Take Care,
D


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## S O L A R I S (Dec 24, 2009)

Hey Dreamer,

I think its wonderful! i learn from everyone here all the time.

Honestly, I want to say that this is a non-issue here in dubai, its almost as if whether it happens or not. so what? sure its wrong to do, but people here have better things to do than worry about some event happening miles away. Its Eid, so people are celebrating the holidays. No Drama. I have better things to do infact. I have so much stuff to do I dont have the time in the day. I need a vacation! lol,

If it happens, i dont even want to switch to any news media channel because the media frenzy world-wide would be insane. Ill just wait for it to fizzle away. I dont recall riots ever happening in dubai, but I think in Pakistan some people took to the streets. As great as the media may be, its so exhausting to switch on the tv and see headlines read "extremist" "terrorist" "jihad" ....etc. It even scares myself! Then again I live in Dubai, so i might be living in my own bubble.

Im sure parts of the middle east would be more offended by the issue, not that people in Dubai are jaded, its just that its kinda pointless to focus on this. There are floods happening, earthquakes...etc so the local media was more focused on relief efforts for those and airing charity telethons.

My only concern if this goes through, is that it would add to the existing 'Fatique' of lack of communication between north america and the middle east, which is a shame, because in a way the middle east has a closer relationship with europe, the UK especially. Due to historical ties, proximity of distances, and feasible transportation, you get people traveling constantly back and forth. so ties are naturally more closely bonded. I really think that geography has a play in this as well, theres a tendancy to think of others are being 'Over there', and we are all guilty of this. Even for myself, when turmoil happens in a certain part of the middle east, i tend to think of it as being 'over there' simply because the region is huge

I was raised Muslim and chose the american curriculum schooling. I practice the ritualistic sides of it as much as possible - im not perfect in that terms. But my POV is that its more important to be good from within. Ive always been curious, so ive read about other ideologies, been to sermon at the Vatican....etc. I cant speak about everyone in Dubai, but how i see it is that religion is only one aspect, life can be so many other things. It is only when corruption and poverty strike, that turmoil occurs and people become susceptible.


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## Guest (Sep 12, 2010)

Thank you. Want to learn so much more. Sad, yes, this has just fueled the fire of misery in the US as we have a lot of other problems -- unemployment, economy a mess, etc., etc. It seems during such times we focus on something like this. And yes to the detriment of foreign relations.

What I am always envious of is that yes, we here in the US, don't "get" what goes on "over there." I love in Europe that if you go 500 miles in one direction, instead of ending up in another State you can end up in another country. On one hand that can lead to so many more cultures interacting. We are sort of "isolated" here in the US and yet here we are the "melting" pot of immigrants. It's just strange.

The intent was diversity and unity.

Love to hear what's up with you. I want to come out to Dubai ... aren't there those amazing hotels on islands or something? Please tell me I have the correct country, lol. But I'd guess they'd be a tad pricey, LOL. Let's see if I win the lottery .....

Sorry for my brief reply. You sound ... well-rounded ... sorry you have this miserable DP. Wouldn't wish it on anyone.


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