# Feel like I've sunk into despair.



## roadt2recovery (Aug 27, 2013)

I've finally told my family about feelings of going crazy and all this, i've had dp for 2 years since september 2011, but up until now I felt like I could manage it, and live life, i've ever forgot about it for months while I had it, but still knew it was there to an extent, that feeling of being scared of dp being there in the background somehow made me feel alive, like there was this otherside, where i knew life, life was just flowing for me, i didnt question much at all, but at the same time, i questioned those classic dp thoughts about existence, however, during these past 2 years, i could easily just get distracted,i knew my family, their faces, life was just flowing, i had friends, i wasn't going into despair.

Fast forward to about a month ago, i just felt like i gave up, life was just going shit for me, i felt depression sinking in everyday, fighting to keep that reality i had about myself and my life, everyday, and losing hope just made me feel depressed, i finally broke down and told my family. Hoping this would ease me up and finally get it out, was the worst thing I could have ever done, my family treats me in such a different way now, and i feel sick to my stomach, i feel like everything has changed, and that i have to live life faking it every fucking day. Every morning I wake up feeling like I'm going to discover something new about derealization by tonight, I feel lost and confused, time is distorted, and today, I think my mind totally went numb to derealization, it's sort of like at first derealization was blocking me from traumatic life experiences, such as family problems, social problems etc. Now I feel like I've gone far beyond repair, where derealization is protecting me from traumatic experiences ABOUT derealization, and I just feel numb to anything, nothing like how it use to be, I feel so "uncomfortably comfortable" with derealization if you know what I mean, my dreams are becoming more intense, I can stare at anything and look at anything now but it still feels like its not real, but I am not getting any anxiety about it if you know what i mean.

I'm at a stage where I've got SEVERE DEREALIZATION, without any anxiety. I still don't feel right, I think my mind has just gone completely numb. I think I need to process the trauma I've been going through the past month, trauma from how my family sees me in this crazy light, they tell me they dont think i'm crazy, but deep down I know they see me in this different light now, they see my personality change, before last month, they would just ask me normally, are you okay? As in natural human conversation, but now i'm being asked are you okay? as in how are you feeling about the craziness, and it's just driving me to despair, I had such severe depression when I broke down and told them about the dp and dr, then it turned into hope kind of, trying to grasp that reality I've been experiencing for the last two years, and with defeats, I feel like my mind just gave up totally, i feel like im in a reality where i know I'm severely depersonalized, but my brain dissociated from the anxiety about derealization, and i'm just left with derealization sensation all the while not being scared about it, I just feel fucked up being repair, and I don;t know how to get out of this and get back.

Fearless, if you're reading this, is this just a matter of processing the trauma i've been going through for the past month, not processing trauma about family problems, because those are just fucking gone at the moment, at least i felt normal when i had those family problems, now i just feel void, like life has just been sucked out of me. Do I face up to the fact the life has been sucked out of me to gain some stability and a bit of the reality i was feeling before?


----------



## roadt2recovery (Aug 27, 2013)

Also I feel like I've lost my ego, I don't feel like I used to, at least during the two years I had dp, I had my ego, but since I told my family, especially my mum, i just feel like nobody could understand me, dp just got uncomfortably comfortable, if you can relate, i'm even starting to forget what it felt like to be at least normal, and recognising my home, and outside, and places i go, my university, it's becoming a big blur now, i just felt like my mind gave up, and everyday i feel like im just sinking and sinking and sinking. Somebody help please.


----------



## KevB (Jul 11, 2007)

Hey! Your family doesn't think you are crazy. They love you and care. The only reason why you have this perspective about them is because of how you view yourself and that is one thing about anxiety which this illness is apart of. You start excusing people for the sane thing you believe and I am sorry but I don't think this is right. It will only make you more sick and start to break down so please do me a favor and practice positive thinking. Your family doe not want to see you hurting. If you were sick physically body wise and they kept asking you if you were alright I am sure it wouldn't be that big of a deal and you probably wouldn't worry about it the way you are about this disorder. Why? Because of the pos and neg way you are viewing it. Think about it. Does that make sense? Try to practice positive reinforced thinking. I'm telling you now because if you continue to think this way about your family you are only going to make things worse. Trust me. 13 year sufferer here. I hope what I told you helps and please do not let a did disorder try to control you. Its easier said than done but you can do it! Just practice thinking more positive. There are so many resources online that teaches us with anxiety about this and how to get rid of unwanted negative thinking. All it starts with is getting a good journal, writing down your feelings, jotting down the negative views and feelings you have and write a list of all of it as a "things do later" list. If you take my advice and google up anxiety self help, most resources tell you about this. I am sorry you have to go through this hell too and it almost makes me cry to realize others suffer this much pain but you will be okay. Okay?


----------



## KevB (Jul 11, 2007)

Oh yeah. One weird thing I read about anxiety the other night when I had the panic attack from hell is how having nothing to worry about especially situations like family issues, oddly causes some of us with this depersonalization bullshit to panic even more and causes us to feel even more detached and unreal. This disorder is really crazy shit but hearing things like that from other people do help sometimes. Sometimes It gets to the point that just reading about this sometimes don't help because you start to wonder if you are really going through this or something worse. It wants you to believe this bullshit so don't feed into it. You will still feel it even if you do something to try avoiding it but just keep doing whatever it is you do to keep you preoccupied. Yes you will feel like okay what does keeping myself busy do to help me but don't listen to this. You have to keep being busy and just acknowledge the fact it's there. Tell yourself and let yourself know that you will focus more on something important. Don't become too busy though as it will stress you and feed this illness more. Focus hard on what it is you do best at life, something you love abd think about it often. No matter how lifeless, depressing, or dull it may seem which this stupid illness makes us feel. Instead of obsessing over how unreal, fake, and scary things and yourself seem, think of a time when things never felt this way and ponder on how life felt to you during these times. Remember how much you miss this old life and way of thinking/living and how bad you want it back. Trust me, this will help you fight back.


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

It's generally not just about processing trauma from only the last month. Prior to 1 month ago, you say you felt like shit and giving up- that's worth addressing and trying to handle/resolve, isn't it? As is the question of how you started getting DP/DR in the first place...

It can feel like going down a rabbit hole, but there's a light at the end of it if you decide to take that journey.

I also want to add to Lomns's post about your family. They hopefully really do love you and care. However, I think part of your stress is that their response was not what you anticipated (which is not necessarily their fault or yours). When someone who has no firsthand experience with DP/DR it's old about it, it is hard to relate to. They may be trying their best, and trying to be extra attentive, but I can see how it can make you feel uncomfortable. It doesn't mean you're weird or they are being difficult, it's just a difficult situation to be in. I guess all I am saying is that I really sympathize with your recent difficulties in the last month.

It may help if you tell them, that you understand that part of DP/DR is that your brain is sort of playing tricks on you, that you understand you are not actually losing your soul or whatever specific symptoms you are feeling. (You do understand that, right?) For example, people with claustrophobia could be said to be in a similar situation- they are not actually in danger when they enter an elevator, but their minds are telling them they are. I don't know, just a thought...


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

So how do u explain extremely low energy every day and in dp you actually are disconnected from ur personality and emotions SO it is true ...got nothing to do with doubting urself...I didn't doubt myself that much at all before dp but now I do bcoz of dp it's like ur brain is cut in half and it's hard to function properly


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Fearless I actually started crying a bit whilst reading that reply...but yes my father was exactly the same as urs EXACTLY...I know what I'm doing to myself but I feel like I'm beyond repair now...like u I felt so fuking proud when I conquered dp the first time but now I feel not like how when I first got it but a lot worse...like back then when I had anxiety and panic that was ok I still felt something but now is like I'm on a totally different level like not even feeling human anymore...I rlly do not see a light at the end of the tunnel for me...I don't want others to feel sorry for me at all that is not wat I'm trying to achieve but I don't feel that recovery is possible for me anymore


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Fearless said:


> 1.) your FEELINGS does not indicate ANYTHING. It does. not. mean. that. you. are. crazy. or. beyond. repair. period. Feelings are FEELINGS. They are NOT indications of any facts. You get me? NOT INDICATIONS OF ANY FACTS. PERIOD. ANY scary thought you scare yourself to death while feeling these feelings are EMOTIONAL REASONING. You kicking yourself in the ass for feeling them, because you have been suggested (not told, SUGGESTED) to blame yourself everytime you feel confusion.
> 
> 2.) if you feel terribly utterly depersonalized, that DOES NOT MEAN that you did not make any progress. get it? DOES NOT MEAN IT. It is all emotional reasoning. It is a MISTAKE on your side, but DOES NOT MEAN anything more. NOTHING. You can resolve 90% of the problems that created your DP, but if the 10% is there, it can make you feel EXACTLY HOW you felt when it all started. but it does not mean that the 90% resolve is lost. PERIOD.
> 
> ...


Yeah it is a huge thing I'm famous for is judging these shitty feelings of dp...I just can't help it because it feels super weird especially without anxiety anymore like I've forgotten wat the feeling is of being human


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Fearless said:


> PS: Key thing to think about: Living with a narcissist makes you to NOT TRUST what you see ----> DEREALIZATION and makes you think that what you feel is not valid ----> DEPERSONALIZATION.
> 
> Because the reactions and words of the narcissist is NOT NORMAL. I'm not saying it's not good, or bad, or stupid. NO. I mean it is ABNORMAL. When my mother thought it is enough, and told my father that she wants to divorce, my father's reaction was : 3.....2.....1...... "Do we have dumpled plums in the refrigerant?" YOU GET IT? The woman of his dreams, the mother of his son wants to divorce, and he is talking about dumpled plums? How would a normal, healthy child (or any person) would react to this? Don't you think that the one and only normal reaction is feeling like WHAT THE FLYING FUCK IS HAPPENING? I believe that DP is the end result of that.
> 
> Do you think that THAT confusion is the indication that the victim of this situation is crazy?


Wait what are u saying equals derealization?

Yeah I remember those responses from my dad being absolutely ridiculous and absurd but I always thought there was something wrong with him like he wasn't normal

My psychiatrist has told me that he knows about dp and is ware of it, but he is putting me in the catagory of CPTSD especially after some of the things I told him went down in my house hold


----------



## peanut butter (Nov 9, 2012)

missjess said:


> Wait what are u saying equals derealization?
> 
> Yeah I remember those responses from my dad being absolutely ridiculous and absurd but I always thought there was something wrong with him like he wasn't normal
> 
> My psychiatrist has told me that he knows about dp and is ware of it, but he is putting me in the catagory of CPTSD especially after some of the things I told him went down in my house hold


Harrington said that dp can be also seen as CPTSD.


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Yes I know I read that too....I'd never thought I'd say this but I have found my psychiatrist to be a lot more helpful and knowledgable then any psychologist I have met. He's also not trying to shove medication down my throat.


----------



## broken3309 (Oct 23, 2012)

Fearless I agree with everything in your blog and all you've said, but I do not believe the abuse is ALWAYS intentional, and even if it is, it's a result of your parents' fucked up upbringing(s), which is definitely not an excuse, but a reason? I guess.

That's where I am in recovery. I recognize all these things, even had a legitimate cry two days ago where I felt like I was five and totally helpless, and afterwards my body was so weak. My issue now lies in the fact that I am back living with my dad, who has undergone a few years of therapy and I asked him for the book "codependent no more", cause he read it when he was in therapy, and he gave me it and "boundaries"...his notes were in them and he had checked next to abandonment, abuse etc, and checked next to being controlling, abusive toward kids, etc...and he told me before giving them to me that he didn't want to cause of the notes but did anyway. So first I went through the books and read all his notes (couldn't help it) and saw something I had always known, that he was abused, and now I oscillate between being angry at him and feeling sorry for him. I'm having a hard time feeling sorry for myself the right way (not in the sense of "omg i have dp and am crazy) because I keep feeling guilty because I know he's a product of his environment. I'm just really confused and would love your input on this.


----------



## heartless (Apr 29, 2013)

Fearless said:


> ....because some part of you still thinks that she has good intentions, in some twisted way. Why would you be attached to her anyway?
> 
> " I need to start to see her objectively, as I would look at a stranger. "
> 
> ...


True when it comes to my father (my self centered parent). I've lost count of the times I discussed this with my sister- 
how come he has NO hobbies, like, at all??? No passion for music, sports, NOTHING


----------



## broken3309 (Oct 23, 2012)

Also forgot to add that he has apologized for his behavior and he has actually starting saying a few things such as "things were okay in the house until i came home." and "if i died my siblings probably wouldn't come to the funeral because we don't have a close bond" he even kissed me on the forehead the other day which he never did even when i was little. I understand i was abused and should be angry, but when he's done so much to try to be better in the here and now it makes me feel bad.


----------



## broken3309 (Oct 23, 2012)

I almost wish he was still an asshole cause it would make it a lot easier, stupid cause I should be happy he is being who he should have been. Oh he also said that he understands that I pretty much need to be raised again and taken care of and he has no problem doing that. it's like he feels guilty, admitted to being controlling too. gahhh i just don't know.


----------



## dana1 (Nov 16, 2013)

My experience is that it seems like there are at least two types of people with Depersonalization Disorders. Some people can use psychology or DBT methods to get themselves out of the state of depersonalization.Others like myself are in a chronic state of depersonalization where all the therapy in the world does'nt seem to help at all and we are the ones who suffer for the most part. It is just that our lives are so different that we don't really feel human. It's very rough and it is very demoralizing. I am just thankful for this website community because it makes me feel not so alone. I hope the person who brought up this topic is part of the people who can heal via therapeutic treatment modalities and maybe medication. i wish you the best of luck.


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Fuk I hate narcissists I wish I never grew up with someone so fkn sick...same as my mum tho they r both fuked I will NEVER have children if I am in this state forever fuk that


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Bad wolf that sounds like my mum


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Do the narcissistic test. Apologize to her, fall to your knees. Any person with a heart would step back, settle down and became sensitive and open. But a narcissist becomes a LION who just smelled blood. There is no other explanation for that than INTENTIONAL ABUSE.

Lol that made me laugh a narc. Becomes a lion who smells blood hahaha


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

broken3309 said:


> Fearless I agree with everything in your blog and all you've said, but I do not believe the abuse is ALWAYS intentional, and even if it is, it's a result of your parents' fucked up upbringing(s), which is definitely not an excuse, but a reason? I guess.
> 
> That's where I am in recovery. I recognize all these things, even had a legitimate cry two days ago where I felt like I was five and totally helpless, and afterwards my body was so weak. My issue now lies in the fact that I am back living with my dad, who has undergone a few years of therapy and I asked him for the book "codependent no more", cause he read it when he was in therapy, and he gave me it and "boundaries"...his notes were in them and he had checked next to abandonment, abuse etc, and checked next to being controlling, abusive toward kids, etc...and he told me before giving them to me that he didn't want to cause of the notes but did anyway. So first I went through the books and read all his notes (couldn't help it) and saw something I had always known, that he was abused, and now I oscillate between being angry at him and feeling sorry for him. I'm having a hard time feeling sorry for myself the right way (not in the sense of "omg i have dp and am crazy) because I keep feeling guilty because I know he's a product of his environment. I'm just really confused and would love your input on this.


There are 2 totally different issues here:

1. What your parents' intentions are.
2. What really happened/what you actually experienced.

You want to separate the 2, because then you can deal with each in their own time. More importantly, you are free to focus on #2.

When you separate the 2, you are free to be 'brutally' honest about #2, without feeling guilt about #1. Personally, I no longer hate my parents, but I certainly hate what they did to me. I don't live with them, so perhaps it's easier for me to work on #2, without worrying about #1 at all. So forget about what your parent's intentions are (which mean nothing in the real world)- what did they actually put you through (in the real world)?

It's good that your father shared the book with you, for both aspects. At some point, you may make peace with yourself or him because you have a deeper understanding of him and his childhood. The point is not to carry hate with you all of your life, the point is to free yourself of pain! At the same time, him admitting to himself the things that he did to you, is a further indication of #2, that you struggles are very real and validated (not that they needed his validation at all anyway!!!!)


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

I have one other comment about whether narcissistic parents INTENTIONALLY abuse their children.

It could be said that they didn't truly 'intend' for everything to happen to you the way it did.

BUT...their manipulative acts, threats, accusations, coercions...inflicting pain (guilt, fear, other emotional distress) is EXACTLY how these acts work. So in a very real sense, I do believe the abuse they inflict is intentional. They may not be able to admit it out of cowardice, shame, fear, but that's what they did.

You would not nearly give yourself the latitude that you give your narcissistic parents. Could you imagine doing this to your own child, regardless of your current struggles? The very thought abhors me, as I'm sure it does to everyone else here.

But what I said about separating intention vs. reality still holds true. Debating about what was really intentional or not, splitting hairs in this way can make for interesting conversation but does not help you at all. *If you went through a living hell as a young child and are still suffering from it now, who the f- cares whether it was intentional or not???*


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

Because I feel you run the risk of endlessly debating, "well, my mother really didn't mean to emotionally scar me, she had problems too..." Here is an example:

One of the significant aspects of my depersonalization was that I was a fairly adventurous toddler, always wanting to go out and explore the world. My mother was afraid I would go out and disappear, get lost. So she would try to rein me in, hold on to me. At one point I went through an episode where I was fighting for my life (from my perspective), but when I realized I would never win, they would never stop, my brain sort of shut off (my experience was that my soul fell out of my body, and I became vacated.) And from then on, I stopped fighting. This was all from me working to recover my memories, later I verified most of these things talking to my mother.

What did she intend? Did she intend to destroy my psyche? Did she just try to protect me? Did she intend to strike some level of fear in me so I wouldn't stray too far?

I have finally begun integrating this into my psyche. But for me personally, what she 'intended' has not been relevant as far this particular memory goes (there are many other bad memories in which I would say she intended to manipulate me and cause me emotional pain.) If someone says, "Don't be stupid, she loved you and was trying to protect you," I could care less EVEN IF IT WAS TRUE, it's besides the point. My focus has been on what my experience of my life and what I went through, regardless of what others intended.

I think on an actual practical/pragmatic level we are not in that much disagreement (or maybe we are!) I definitely agree that you do need to gain greater understanding and awareness into your entire life experience which obviously includes interaction with certain people. Actions speak louder than intentions, in that sense we all intend everything we do. I just don't think it's constructive to get into elaborate discussions about whether some emotionally broken person really intended to break their children's psyche or not, it can plant the seeds of guilt and doubt in the victim's mind.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Of course, the road to hell is also paved with bad intentions. You can judge a person by their intentions, you can also judge them by their actions.


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

LOL, here's the far easier question that I would ask you (to better understand your perspective.)

A guy drinks too much at a bar, gets into his car, veers off course and kills a family of 6 in a minivan.

Did the drunk driver intentionally kill the family? I say no, but I also say it doesn't matter what his 'intentions' were.


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

Of course I understand the difference between the 2, that's why I brought it up. What did I say was wrong? I basically said what you said- he didn't intend it, but is obviously responsible for the death and pain he has caused.

I think some emotionally damaged parents hurt their children in the same way- they may or may not have intended it (or intended as much pain as they actually caused), either way they are selfish, irresponsible and too blinded in their own inner drama to care to see what they are doing to others. But it doesn't matter what they intended, the main issue is the hurt they caused. I understand if you think otherwise.

I also think it doesn't really matter what the parents necessarily intended or not, it doesn't diminish the pain they cause- the DP/DR sufferer still has much to resolve and to do for him/herself. But I also understand you disagree here too.


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

Perhaps I am re-considering here...

Whatever words and actions a narcissistic or otherwise defective parent takes upon you, they intended to do exactly that. If they call you stupid, berate you, unleash anger and guilt and shame upon you that is totally undeserved, they intended to do exactly that, because that's exactly what they said or did!!

A parent may come to you after (years after...) and say, well I love you and would never mean you harm, etc. But they said what they said and did what they did. In that sense they did truly INTEND EVERYTHING, it's not like they can claim that an alien took over their body and spoke or acted for them!

I think this is important, and if this is along the lines of what Fearless is saying then I agree with him. If you blunt what happened too much, try to smooth it over, you will miss realizing the true emotional impact it had one you. At the time these things happened to you, you didn't nearly have the maturity and wise perspective to be able to say, "Well, they're only saying I'm worthless because they have low self-esteem and are bitter about their own lives and fears, I'll have none of that." Of course not, who does at that age- that's why you were so overwhelmed by it all, and basically had to freeze in order to not explode. So that's what you're having to go back to now, in order to process and resolve it.


----------



## Linguos (Jan 12, 2012)

It's worth considering that intention is a bad word here, because narcissistic people usually are not conscious of their intentions, and it is correct that narcissists were once victims themselves, and it is the nature of their disorder to be so wrapped up in inner drama and conflict that they fail to empathize with others or to meet others' needs--even if their own children.

I think in this case it's more important to focus on remorse. For a person to be capable of remorse presupposes certain personality traits that manifest themselves as things like remorse and empathy, and in this way it's unlikely for a child to be emotionally alienated by a guardian capable of remorse.

In my experience, without exception, my mother never took interest in anything I did or cared about, not a modicum, not in the slightest. When I confronted her with the reality of my DP, not even her involvement of it, but simply the reality and its relationship to anxiety she shut down and refused to listen. I confronted her about her history of disinvalidating my every personal interest or emotion and my occasionally audacious efforts to share with her which she refused to even consider taking a fraction of responsibility for, she acted as if I were delusional, worse yet was that I only confront her once every half decade or so, and being that I'm in mid-twenties it may never happen again. It's hopeless. I could give a fuck less about her intentions, it's all about the effort she puts in, an effort that is validated by her remorse or empathy.

However, that being said, remorse is an intention.


----------



## broken3309 (Oct 23, 2012)

Fearless could you please give me advice on how to fix myself while still living at home with the person who caused everything?

It's hard for me to separate who we was and who he is now.


----------



## peanut butter (Nov 9, 2012)

Fearless said:


> If the abuse and the misleading wasn't intentional, you would not have the unexplainable feelings. You are not a bad person, and would not be hurt or very angry at someone who did not intentionally abuse you, only made mistakes*. We are not mad at people who do a mistake and then apologize, or show regret, even if they not express it in a direct way.* Abusers don't show regret, because they don't FEEL regret. They are abusing you intentionally AND CONVINCING YOU ABOUT THE OPPOSITE, making you deny your own feelings.
> 
> That is the only way these feelings can emerge.


Wow, this got me thinking.

It's pretty fucked up since one of my parent always apologizes after a fight and tells me how much he loves me, but it doesn't feel like it at all and annoys the shit out of me. But words are just words, I'm guessing it's very possible and likely that he still has narcissistic background. But how the hell are you supposed to know that as a child or an andolescent when someone wastes so much words with a meaning.


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

I would actually like to point out that narcissists are actually threatened by there kids...especially the kids with the biggest willpower...they don't feel safe and never will...people who need to control everyone around them do not feel safe and cannot express themselves directly. The narc will pick the kid who has the strongest willpower as the scapegoat to intentionally bring them down to make them feel like shit and be at there level. Narcs thing the only way to gain respect is by dominating and having power over which is also driven by fear....narcs are actually full of FEAR


----------



## AlexFromPT (Jun 26, 2011)

When I was 7 years old i said that my dream was to be a soccer player. My mom and grandfather soon were telling me how impossible it was and how much better conditioning i needed to have. Narc's biggest problem is when we express ourselves according to our true needs and wants. It angers them because they couldnt be free too.


----------



## themaxx10 (Nov 20, 2013)

Fearless said:


> I get what you are trying to say, and yes, in some way, children get hurt, and the end result is the same. I DO get you.
> 
> BUT, I think you don't really get me. The reason I say that intention is the most important, is that we are talking about depersonalization, and the ultimate recovery from depersonalization means VALIDATING YOUR FEELINGS. YOU FEEL DIFFERENT TOWARDS SOMEONE WHO IS JUST MAKING MISTAKES, OR TOWARDS SOMEONE WHO IS CRUEL, HEARTLESS AND INTENTIONAL. It is VERY VERY CRUCIAL to understand the person's intentions because the actual realization of the persons real intentions (which means WHO (S)HE IS), which will tell you that your feelings ARE VALID, and the have VERY GOOD REASON, and that means there are NO ALIEN, UNEXPLAINABLE FEELINGS IN YOU ---> nothing is wrong with your feelings ---> no more fog ----> no more floating feelings to misinterpret ---> no panic, no DP.
> 
> ...


Hi Fearless, I think I got you now. I posted a reply afterwards (#52), where I realized that basically, if it comes down to validating YOUR feelings vs. THEIR behavior, well- how did we get into this mess in the first place?

You have to let it go, let it rip, when you are working on yourself. To not let it rip, is exactly what we have been doing our whole life. So I can see in your posts that you are fighting for the sufferer, because it's about f-ing time someone did.

It's not uncommon, I think, for a narcissist to try to win your sympathy by telling you they are sorry, so let's let bygones be bygones, etc. But again, it's not about you, it's still about them.

None of us are here because one day our dad accidentally put us down for something we did, and we got DP despite having grown up in a safe and secure home with positive attachment.


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Fearless said:


> haven't thought about this possibility, but sounds like something that makes sense.
> 
> ps.: I have read it a few times and it fking makes sense. I actually remember feeling like that back then, that my free nature and willpower scared my father. Maybe I reminded him to how weak and coward he is? When I got into street fights, he scolded me. I thought he maybe trying to parent me, but now I know that I reminded him to the fact that he was never man enough to protect himself.


Yes it is true...they are completely driven by fear and shame...all there motives even tho they are heartless they are also fear based and driven by fear...they cannot life from there hearts it is also terrifying for them but not to mention they have lost connection to there own heart because if how they were parented. They only see in rigid styles of thinking, emotions threaten the fuk out of them that's why they can't handle a child's emotions especially negative ones, they are perfectionist because they are full of shame and they absolutely despise critisim


----------



## missjess (Jun 1, 2012)

Fearless said:


> just a note. my father is only perfectionist towards others. He is not that strict when it comes to judge himself haha. Typical narcissistic trait.


Hmmm well my father whenever he cleaned something or rearranged things in the kitchen pantry he always put them in a perfect order even like putting the same colours together just everything he did was black and white to the extremes. My dad is a complete perfectionist always wanted our family to look perfect for everyone he is just awkward to watch and be around

It's lie my dad is completely left brain dominated and has no right brain intelligence at all


----------



## AlexFromPT (Jun 26, 2011)

missjess said:


> Hmmm well my father whenever he cleaned something or rearranged things in the kitchen pantry he always put them in a perfect order even like putting the same colours together just everything he did was black and white to the extremes. My dad is a complete perfectionist always wanted our family to look perfect for everyone he is just awkward to watch and be around
> 
> It's lie my dad is completely left brain dominated and has no right brain intelligence at all


Yes my grandma is the same. Completely obsessed with cleaning and constantly gasps and runs out of breath while cleaning our house - due to physical effort - she exaggerates the sounds, for us to think she is tired and works hard I think.

She is always trying to give me things, and do me favors but when I'm sad she gets really upset too... She can't accept that our family is broken. She doesn't validate my feelings, never did. I was always wrong in her eyes and in my mom's eyes also. They always treated me like a little child without a valid opinion. Only now I can see this.

I have a bit of a problem because in my family I don't have a single narcissistic parent - All of them have narcissistic traits (grandparents and mom). Especially my mother - *which died*

*But now I understand that I have feelings of hatred for my mother, not due to DP, but due to my abused past. *That bitch. And yes she is dead. I love her and I hate her, adding to that, I also thought these mixed feelings were not normal. A constant subconscious shame.

I say subconscious because I would not even dare to force myself to think about this.


----------



## peanut butter (Nov 9, 2012)

man fearless you're on fire today !


----------

