# binaural beats



## flat (Jun 18, 2006)

Wikipedia.com has an interesting write up about binaural beats. Something about listening to two different frequencies (one in each ear using head phones) and your brain creates another frequency as a result of listening to those two frequencies. People use it for relaxing and meditation and there seems to be a lot of claims that it has helped people with depression and anxiety. I've listened to the two samples that wiki provides in that write up but without ear phones...just thru my computer speakers and wow these frequencies are pretty weird but I did feel more relaxed right after listening to them. Maybe I'll try it with ear phones but they warn you to make sure the volume is low before you put on the phones cuz it's quite loud right at the start. They also claim that these frequencies "synchronize" the left and right halves of our brains. I'm wondering if dp and dr is something to do with our brains being out of synch somehow. I just hope these frequencies doesn't make our condition worse. Wouldn't that be a bugger! But I can't see it being any worse than looking at spinning optical illusions for an extended period of time. If your curious give it a try but first listen to it without ear phones to see how it makes you feel...just in case it back fires.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

Hmmm....that sounds interesting. Maybe after breakfast I will listen to it.


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## York (Feb 26, 2008)

Check out centerpointe.com , you'll find everything you need on the subject there. I just purchased the first set of CD's from the HoloSync program. It sounds like rain and bells, and sends you down into theta-state, making you feel really slow and heavy.
The "problem" with these beats are that they are pushing your brain beyond it's capacity, thus making it grow new neural pathways, but also stirring up old stuff. Your anxiety and other dysfunctional feelings may actually increase for a while, which is why I've decided to wait until I'm better before I use it.


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## Guest (Jun 1, 2009)

Hmmm. I just took a look at this, and one thing is the set "on sale" is around $200.00 I also looked up binaural beats. The primary use is in hearing, parkinsons and what they call "mild anxiety." There is some implication that this technique brings negative emotions to the surface ... unless I'm misinerpreting it.

Problem is, this was discovered in 1838 or something. And that is a long time ago.

My sense is there is no better than doing yoga to music you enjoy (I do best with that), exercise, etc. The claims of relieving depression, anxiety, etc. are as I see it, to relieve daily stress that most people exeperience. It talks about how it helps Fortune 500 executives. :? There are such people who have serious emotional problems, and others who are extremely high functioning.

I also listened to those sounds on Wikpedia and they drove me nuts. I like quiet, or music, or dancing to music that isn't full of screaming, lol. I used to be a disco queen, love classical and pop really.

I can only say, if this stuff works for anyone, I'm all for it. It seems rather sus however, and this guy who is pushing it doesn't have any degree after his name.

I found some professional journal articles on pub-med, but again, it seems this is for "mild anxiety" ... and some other applications.

*THERE IS ALSO THE DANGER OF PRECIPITATING SEIZURES IN INDIVIDUALS WITH EPILEPSY -- AT LEAST THE VISUALS THAT YOU CAN USE AS WELL. (Such as a strobe light effect.) I don't like the sound of that.*

I get more DP when I see strobe effects in films -- overstimulation for me is not good. I also have very sensitive hearing. Fire engines are too loud and I wear earplugs if I go to a movie theatre. TOO FREAKIN' loud.

Well, to each his own. My two cents. Not telling anyone to not try this. I've said before, I'd take turpentine if it was known to be effective on my DP/DR. :shock:

Call me a skeptic. But I say no harm in trying. My only thought about these things is, they are variations on meditation, yoga, etc. as well as calming music and if they were really effective someone would be making a fortune .. even from me. :wink:

EDIT: Man oh man, am I old and jaded. Also, if things "negative feelings" to the surface, it would seem working on that in therapy (even group therapy) rather on your own would be more beneficial.


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## York (Feb 26, 2008)

It's doing exactly the same to your brain as meditation, only you don't have to learn how to do it properly, it happens automatically, which saves you a lot of time and frustration. And it wasn't invented in the 1800's it was invented in the eighties, at least the technology used by HoloSync.
The sound is placed beneath music or nature-sounds like rain, so it wouldn't drive you nuts... And what is money if it help cure you of anxiety etc? Of course it's only a tool. It's not a magic pill.


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## Guest (Jun 3, 2009)

york said:


> It's doing exactly the same to your brain as meditation, only you don't have to learn how to do it properly, it happens automatically, which saves you a lot of time and frustration. And it wasn't invented in the 1800's it was invented in the eighties, at least the technology used by HoloSync.
> The sound is placed beneath music or nature-sounds like rain, so it wouldn't drive you nuts... And what is money if it help cure you of anxiety etc? Of course it's only a tool. It's not a magic pill.


ERRRRRRRR, I just wrote a post and deleted it by accident.

I'm honestly not trying to be totally negative with this, just a tad sus.
Binaural beats were discovered in 1839 (I'm awful with dates) ....

From Wikipedia:


> *Binaural beats or binaural tones are auditory processing artifacts, or apparent sounds, the perception of which arises in the brain independent of physical stimuli. This effect was discovered in 1839 by Heinrich Wilhelm Dove.*
> 
> The brain produces a phenomenon resulting in low-frequency pulsations in the loudness of a perceived sound when two tones at slightly different frequencies are presented separately, one to each of a subject's ears, using stereo headphones. A beating tone will be perceived, as if the two tones mixed naturally, out of the brain. The frequency of the tones must be below about 1,000 to 1,500 hertz for the beating to be heard. The difference between the two frequencies must be small (below about 30 Hz) for the effect to occur; otherwise, the two tones will be heard separately and no beat will be perceived.
> 
> *Binaural beats are of interest to neurophysiologists investigating the sense of hearing. Second (and more controversially), binaural beats reportedly influence the brain in more subtle ways through the entrainment of brainwaves[1][2] and can be used to produce relaxation and other health benefits such as pain relief.[3]*


I have also seen some Medical research -- did a PubMed search -- and found some applications for this, but I guess I see what is advertised is sort of "too easy a shortcut", though I may be completely incorrect.

I have found some success with my own version of meditation which are yoga poses to calm music or when I count out my breaths. Other stuff is too distracting, or causes me to further dissociate, etc. I learned some excellent techniques in group Dialectical Behavioral Therapy which is considered viable therapy and was covered by my medical insurance.

I just get concerned that some will spend $200 on something that really isn't that "new" or seems "too good to be true."

I say however, do what you think will work for you! Believe me.

I can't rewrote what I said. ERRRRRRRRRR I hate thinking I posted when I didn't.
Cheers,
D


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## Jay (Mar 27, 2008)

Hmmm I have tried these binaural beats. I find them similar to meditation tapes and to be honest, these kinds of things exacerbate my DP quite a bit. I am relaxed after but so far removed from the moment it's not funny. I can imagine these kinds of things helping if your DP is anxiety related. I'm not saying I believe in this stuff, but if your interested, there is a free binaural program at this site - uazu.net/sbagen/ - I found it rather techy, but if computers are you thing, go for it. I also read somewhere (could be on the site) that an mp3 file cannot capture the full spectrum of sound needed for the supposed 'healing' so this site creates the noise using a program. Also if scintillating sine waves aren't your thing _stay away_  
~ Jay


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## Guest (Jun 4, 2009)

Jay1 said:


> Hmmm I have tried these binaural beats. I find them similar to meditation tapes and to be honest, these kinds of things exacerbate my DP quite a bit. I am relaxed after but so far removed from the moment it's not funny. I can imagine these kinds of things helping if your DP is anxiety related. I'm not saying I believe in this stuff, but if your interested, there is a free binaural program at this site - uazu.net/sbagen/ - I found it rather techy, but if computers are you thing, go for it. I also read somewhere (could be on the site) that an mp3 file cannot capture the full spectrum of sound needed for the supposed 'healing' so this site creates the noise using a program. Also if scintillating sine waves aren't your thing _stay away_
> ~ Jay


*Jay,* yeah, listening to a few of these things makes my teeth burn, lol. And agreed, I have found (and I'm not alone with this -- discussed this in group therapy/DBT) that meditation is NOT always helpful for everyone. There used to be a site some years back called Trancenet???? that was to help people who GOT dissociated (bad dissociation, DP/DR) from meditation. Poking with the brain, is indeed poking with the brain.

I digress for a mo here: I'm wondering if this should go into alternative remedies.

But just to look into this a tad further, the claim on the centerpointe site, IMHO, is "too good to be true" and honestly, not ... really honest.



> To get [results listed], you have to meditate four or five hours a day, often for decades, and few people are willing to do this. And, meditation, especially at first, isn't much fun. The initial experience is somewhere between boring and frustrating. Finally, it takes quite a long time to notice any significant results, much less to experience the benefits I just mentioned.
> 
> But what if I told you that you could meditate as deeply as a Zen monk, literally at the touch of a button, and do it the very first time, and every time and also make all those happy brain chemicals the first time and every time? :shock:
> 
> Not only that, within a very short period of time?days or weeks instead of years or decades?you could begin receiving all the benefits I just mentioned?the physical health benefits, the mental health benefits, the clarity-of-mind benefits, the relationship benefits, and the overall sense of well-being benefits.


I think that's what caught my eye. Firstly, again, IMHO, NO ONE on this planet is ever going to achieve what a Zen monk achieves. I mean none of us is out to become the Dalai Lama sp? It is a goal we move towards in small ways, but .... five hours a day of meditation? but all of that work can be bypassed by listening to these CDs?

:?

Also, what is very intereting about Bill Harris ... he SOUNDS like an interesting guy, I'd like to meet him -- who is head of Centerpoite sp? I'm sorry, I am tired AND wired and have something else I have to finish but can't think to finish .... he has studied all sorts of things, including music. He is really a musician and good at public speaking for personal improvement.



> A graduate of Portland State University, Bill also has three years of graduate study in music, studying with world-renowned Czech composer Tomas Svoboda and Spanish composer Salvador Brotons. He is a Certified Trainer of Neuro Linguistic Programming and is trained in Ericksonian Hypnosis ...


Well, this has prompted me to do more research on the topic certainly. And we certainly know MUSIC is therapeutic. Great book I'm still poking through by a neurologist on the power of music and music gone awry in the brain, "Musicophilia" by Oliver Sacks, M.D.

*York* I appreciate what you're saying. But this is ... IMHO ... "too good to be true." For ANYONE just for the average person who wants to feel less stressed out. I am however inspired at the mo to actually do some yoga, LOL. But I count to myself when I hold positions. Leaving my mind "blank" or "letting thoughts pass through" or meditating as I've been instructed to do in varous methods does make MY DP worse. I'm just concerned about this method. I'd gather it DOES something. I don't know, something about it bothers me.

BUT EVER ONE HAS THEIR OWN WAY OF GETTING BETTER, HEALTHIER, AND WHATEVER WORKS FOR ANYONE IS EXCELLENT.

Forgive.
D
And disclaimer ... I may be full of crap, LOL. :mrgreen:


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## Jay (Mar 27, 2008)

oooo don't get me started on Oliver Sacks. I own all his books and have read all of them cover to cover. Musicophilia was fantastic to say the least
~ Jay


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## Guest (Jun 4, 2009)

Jay1 said:


> oooo don't get me started on Oliver Sacks. I own all his books and have read all of them cover to cover. Musicophilia was fantastic to say the least
> ~ Jay


JAY! You're the man! Are you a dude! Whatever, go Sacks! I actually saw him lecture in Los Angeles (years back). Also, have you read, "A Brief Tour of Human Consciousness" by V.S. Ramachandran, M.D., Ph.D. He is also a hero of mine. AND have you seen the film "Awakenings" with Robin Williams and Robert De Niro, based on Sacks' book by the same name. Beautiful and touching. And Robin Williams captured Sacks 100%. The shy, absent minded professor!

Cheers.


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## Jay (Mar 27, 2008)

That film is one of my favorites - I have been trying to get my hands on the actual awakenings documentary (not the Hollywood film) which actually has his commentary and footage of the real awakening patients. and yes I am a male


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## Klown (May 20, 2009)

Haha it's funny you mention this....I tried this before I had my full blown DP, when I just had moments of it and it put me in a DP state for a couple of hours...I would only recommend this to people who are desperate.


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## Deja_vu_256 (Apr 27, 2009)

tried this awhile back too... their are generators you can download for free, you set the frequencies over time and it will make the sounds for you... i tried this just for a short while, never noticed much


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## fsteeze (Jun 24, 2009)

To tell you the truth, this is what i think triggered my DR. I was listening to binaural beats that alter your state of mind to whereas you feel "out of body" and i guess i stayed in the state of mind. I'm not sure if the ones your talking about are to cure/treat DR or DP but i wouldn't recommend them.


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## S O L A R I S (Dec 24, 2009)

I am resurrecting this thread,

I just been searching on youtube for binaural beats. Been listening to them via my big headphones at night. I have to say that I like them alot, theyre more relaxing/trancy. I dont get bored listening to them.

I dont know if its related or not, but the second time i listened to it I recalled this very pleasant memory from childhood. very randomly, I wasnt even thinking that far back. I didnt even know that memory existed/had no hints either as to how to access it.

It was basically me at like 9 years old, we used to go to this variety store that sold games/puzzles..etc in a mall. I would go there with my sister, brother and father alot. I remembered walking within the aisles checking out the masks. I remember they used to sell this poster puzzle of aladdin, that my dad later bought for my birthday. I still have it.

Im happy i remembered such a fun memory, most of my childhood memories arent as pleasant. i feel good


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## Dom (May 28, 2010)

i tried the chakra balance one and hour later had dp flare up


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## Not A Doctor (Jun 14, 2010)

There isn't sufficient research on binaural beats to justify spending money on it.


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## Cesar (Aug 23, 2010)

Hello I've suffered from dp for 12 years and have used holosync for 1 year. It has lowered my stress levels and overall reaction to stressful triggers. I will continue to use it as it has helped me greatly.
It is different than other binaural programs as it lowers the carrier frequency and that is what creates a more powerful experience with each successive level. I think it could possibly end my dp.

The downside to holosync besides the price is you have to face your shadow material as it is brought to conscious awareness. It depends on your personal history, how much you have suppressed probably will determine how much upheaval you will have. But it goes away and if it goes on for too long taking a break will really help.
You can make your own holosync levels with the neuroprogrammer. Perfectmeditation.com is a good alternative.

Hope this helps


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