# Poor me, I'm a victim, too afraid to face the world



## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

So I just had a session with my therapist and I asked him:

"Why do I tend (I don't always do it, most of the time I'm strong and shut up) in my relationship with myself to play the victim, and the I can't change?"

It was an interesting conversation. Basically he told me that I was afraid to face the world and that I "use" DP/DR to not have to really face it.

What was still more interesting is that afterwards I talked to my mother about my issues with how I was raised etc. and while she admitted a lot of things, she also denied others. She told me I was being a victim.

And, to be honest, I think she was right. I actually take responsibility for my life, I am a law student, have decent grades, etc. I don't stay at home all day saying oooh poor me I have DP what to do what to do. I passed that point years ago. I actually live life, I am educated about DP and trying to get over my issues, BUT (and it is a HUGE BUT) I still have that sense of being inadequate. I still feel bad, helpless, hopeless even if I know that I'm not. I'm strong, I take care of myself in a lot of stuff but when it comes to the important issues I run away and feel like a victim.

And now to my point: What would you do? Do you think digging in the past is the right thing to do? Or do I have to face my fears like Fearless says? I am a bit confused though because whenever I face my fears, I face them with DP/DR to protect myself. And actually I think that my biggest issue has to do with self love and self worth, and lot of sadness and repressed anger, but how to fix that? I understand about learning about the past etc, I think I've done it, but I just can't let go. Am I just fooling myself and further dissociating from my problems? Any help appreciated Thanks

edit: I actually have a hard time of dealing with my past in a constructive way


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## Guest (Sep 19, 2013)

http://www.socialanxietysupport.com/forum/f26/the-toxic-shame-thread-the-cause-of-sa-for-most-98335/

I think you already saw it, but here is that post about toxic shame from the anxiety forum; it has a lot to do with lacking self-love and worth. The most you can accomplish by looking at your past is integrating it on an emotional level, and understanding how it effects you in present. I'd recommend you focus on what bothers you now and work your way backwards, that way you'll be more productive and still come up with some insight on your past.

Finding the root of your problem is important, but it's buried so you need to identify the rest of the issue, that will lead you to the root of it.


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Selig said:


> I personally believe coming to terms with these issues will lessen the risk of relapse down the road. Some members may say it is not needed, and to focus on the present. But for some of us, our DP/DR stems from continuing to focus on the present with unresolved issues from the past.
> 
> It's not your mothers place to call you a victim, if she admits to mistakes, that is not your fault nor do you deserve to be dismissed on it.





Antimony said:


> http://www.socialanxietysupport.com/forum/f26/the-toxic-shame-thread-the-cause-of-sa-for-most-98335/
> 
> I think you already saw it, but here is that post about toxic shame from the anxiety forum; it has a lot to do with lacking self-love and worth. The most you can accomplish by looking at your past is integrating it on an emotional level, and understanding how it effects you in present. I'd recommend you focus on what bothers you now and work your way backwards, that way you'll be more productive and still come up with some insight on your past.
> 
> Finding the root of your problem is important, but it's buried so you need to identify the rest of the issue, that will lead you to the root of it.


thanks both


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## NEEDMOREBLAZE (Apr 8, 2013)

Fearless said:


> The bolded sentence is a LIE. A L-I-E. Self-deception, self-fooling. It means you DON'T face them. You still dissociate. That is the wall you need to climb through, only to find out that all of the fears are really phantom fears, except one, the root one.
> 
> *The problem is a twisted twist*: FEAR itself is FEARFUL for you, because it reminds you to what happened when you faced overwhelming fear. So you don't let yourself feel the fear.
> 
> ...


FEARLESS do you believe that "disassociation" is apathetic in nature?? One does not place enough value in ones self, so instead of motivation and enthusiasm to overcome our challenges, there are excuses made and no action taken to eliminate the causes of stress and fear.


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Fearless said:


> As long as you don't know what you feel and why, you can only repress your feelings, but not control them. You are still using dissociaton as the go-to thing to do during stress. You need to catch dissociation as it happens, and totally seperate the experience from every angle.


This totally makes sense and from day 1 I agree with you. BUT HOW DO YOU KNOW WHAT YOU FEEL AND WHY? Maybe it's again self fooling but I put a lot of effort in my recovery. WHY CAN'T I KNOW WHAT I FEEL AND WHY? please respond.

And the fear of fear part is also true. But what does it men it reminds me what happened when i was faced with overwhelming fear? Nothing happened I just dissociated and little by little I got DP. COuld you explain more pls?

Thanks

I KNOW YOU ARE RIGHT. EVERY ONE OF YOUR POST RINGS TRUE TO ME. BUT I AM NOT ABLE TO GRASP THE TRUTH ABOUT MYSELF. WHY?


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

When you call people cowards, I don't get angry because I know it is true. I know I am a coward, but things don't click. You say that I should do everything that scares me and that I would like to do to higher my self esteem?


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

#double post#


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## Eru (Jul 25, 2013)

Yeah. I think the victim mentality is one of the biggest factors in maintaining dissociation, as the implied belief is 'It doesn't matter how I think/act, I'm always gonna be shot down. I'm always gonna end up facing difficult emotions.' You disown your feelings, and consequently your ability to change them, so as not to face this perceived truth. But of course it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. The more you disown your feelings, the less able you are to understand them, integrate them into your personal narrative, and move beyond them. They pollute your nervous system, cause you to feel like crap all the time, and then you think 'There's the proof. Nothing will change.'


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

nice, tottally true



Eru said:


> Yeah. I think the victim mentality is one of the biggest factors in maintaining dissociation, as the implied belief is 'It doesn't matter how I think/act, I'm always gonna be shot down. I'm always gonna end up facing difficult emotions.' You disown your feelings, and consequently your ability to change them, so as not to face this perceived truth. But of course it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. The more you disown your feelings, the less able you are to understand them, integrate them into your personal narrative, and move beyond them. They pollute your nervous system, cause you to feel like crap all the time, and then you think 'There's the proof. Nothing will change.'


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## Eru (Jul 25, 2013)

NEEDMOREBLAZE said:


> FEARLESS do you believe that "disassociation" is apathetic in nature?? One does not place enough value in ones self, so instead of motivation and enthusiasm to overcome our challenges, there are excuses made and no action taken to eliminate the causes of stress and fear.


I know this question was to FEARLESS, and I'm sure he can provide a much better answer than myself, but I'd like to add my 2 cents on this.

As I understand it, dissociation is anything but apathetic. We don't think 'I can't be bothered facing my life, so I'm gonna switch off.' Rather, it's a defense against overwhelming fear that seems necessary at the time. We dissociate because healthier ways of regulating our fear fail, usually because we have underdeveloped capacities to deal with emotions. Unconsciously, we think 'there's no way I'm gonna get through this, so I have to cut off from it.'

The end result may be a kind of apathy. 'I should feel bad about this break-up [or whatever], but I just feel numb.' But the mechanism itself is triggered by overwhelming fear.


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Fearless is right.

DP comes when, because of your DA you are unable to express your emotion, be the person that you want to be, do the things that you want and take risks,

SO maybe you see a beautiful girl and you want to go flirt with her, but you feel strong emotions that you do not know how to control beacause of your DA so you repress your desire of going to talk to the girl and you dissociate from yourself.

And this is what I do until now. Even the researching your past has become an excuse not to take action. It's true. DP is rooted in the past. But now I know enough to take action. But I still don't want to. I still look in the past to find some magic memory that will "cure my DP" because I don't really want to start doing the things that scare me but that would make me soo happy...

I'm out

Good night


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## seafoamwaves (Sep 20, 2013)

I think DP caused more problems for me lol.


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Fearless said:


> Phil, you need to understand that even if you feel like you are TOTALLY HONEST with yourself about your feelings, you can still fool THE SHIT OUT OFyourself. I believe that you are honestly trying to face your feelings, but please keep working hard, because dissociation is a very stubborn mechanism. Keep kicking that wall. You are battling against decades of denial. Admit that you are in pain. Admit it. If it's not effective, try again. It's hard, and it's supposed to be hard. If it's hard and you find overwhelming obstacles, you are on the right way. It IS fucking hard.


thanks


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Fearless said:


> The bolded sentence is a LIE. A L-I-E. Self-deception, self-fooling. It means you DON'T face them. You still dissociate. That is the wall you need to climb through, only to find out that all of the fears are really phantom fears, *except one, the root one.*


I know that all my fears are phantom fears, because at the end of the day I am a capable person, even though I feel that I will never make it. So which one is the root one fearless? Are you saying that the root one is Fear in itself because I don't know how to handle it?

PLease explain I feel like there is a lot of truth in your sentence.


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Susto said:


> Phil, this quote might give you some ideas..
> 
> "Go into yourself. Find out the reason that commands you to write; see whether it has spread its roots into the very depths of your heart; confess to yourself whether you would have to die if you were forbidden to write.
> 
> ...


Thanks to you to Susto


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Could the core issue be: " I hate myself and I don't deserve anything?" And so then I dissociate from this feeling but it leaves me with constant anger, tension hurt and fear?

I also self sabotage a lot


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## philandrjack (Feb 20, 2013)

Fearless said:


> I have built a perfectionist self-worth on top it, and when I realized that the perfectionist goals can not be achieved, the perfectionist identity collapsed, I was faced with that terrible feeling of worthlessness, and I dissociated.


The exact same thing happened to me, just before I got dp


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## seafoamwaves (Sep 20, 2013)

Hey, Fearless, out of my 8 yrs w dp/dr why have only these last two been emotionally numb (can't get nostalgic)?


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## Guest (Sep 20, 2013)

seafoamwaves said:


> Hey, Fearless, out of my 8 yrs w dp/dr why have only these last two been emotionally numb (can't get nostalgic)?


That emotional numbness might have more to do with depression than DP. People often lump every symptom they have under DP when in reality many come from things like depression, anxiety and stress. You can handle the symptoms better if you can identify them for what they are instead of calling them all DP.


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## NEEDMOREBLAZE (Apr 8, 2013)

Fearless said:


> ---------------
> 
> self sabotage can be the result of the constant fight between the two sides. I want to live, I love things, I want to enjoy who I am, I want to express myself, let's do it! ------> But, doesn't matter what I do, I will never achieve "me", I'll still be worthless, so why bother. Let's fuck everything up. At least rebel.
> 
> ...


This is the best description of the war that waged in my head prior to depersonalization - it literally exhausted my mind.


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## seafoamwaves (Sep 20, 2013)

Fearless said:


> If you could tell me even less info about yourself, you could make it even harder for me to answer.


Sorry about that, I did some soul searching and it's mostly because I'm unhappy at my current job.



Antimony said:


> That emotional numbness might have more to do with depression than DP. People often lump every symptom they have under DP when in reality many come from things like depression, anxiety and stress. You can handle the symptoms better if you can identify them for what they are instead of calling them all DP.


Yeah, I think I'm depressed, but overall I've had some happy times with DP.


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