# Abstaining



## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

Hello all! Sop, it's been 4 months since my psychosis struck and the depersonalization has got incredibly, steadily slowly better and I now longer treat my condition as something which I can think my way out off........that was just incredibly unhelpful

The real reason why I'm posting here is because I'm finding it incredibly helpful gathering information and help on never smoking weed again. Is this helpful for others too?

Please just post some ideas about not smoking...
Thankyou.


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2007)

> Please just post some ideas about not smoking...


Don?t buy ****?


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2007)

Just think about some of the consequences of smoking weed
For example:










G.


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## FeelingFake123 (Feb 5, 2007)

He meant stop smoking weed.

Personally weed triggered all this shit, but didnt cause it. When I smoke it now it makes me feel CRAZY so I don't touch it, I havent for almost 2 months and half. I'm pretty sure it helped. It couldn't have hurt right?


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2007)

FeelingFake123 said:


> He meant stop smoking weed


=O ? really?!... I would never have guess!!!... ?=S?

Can?t be doing much rollin with out tobacco! = Don?t buy ****?



> ?But then he could still get stoned with his mates?


Yeah yeah? well? ?get new mates?? blah?


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## 17545 (Feb 14, 2007)

5


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2007)

Yeah you?re totally right, and I know because I passively smoke weed once a week when I see my mates? I?ve accepted they enjoy smoking it and they are funny as FOOK while stone any how? and they accept I do not wish to smoke it or snort coke? lol; when I first said no to coke they looked at me as if they were saying ?WFT?? It was like I was the first to say no to them? lol, But I have tired both drugs, and they aren?t for me. Your friends are to accept you for you, and if they don?t respect your wishes? they aren?t friends.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

^^^ The same thing happened to me with alcohol. When i was trying to quit and everyone was drinking away i would get shat for not having a drink. They would say one little drink wont hurt you. Well it wont to a normal person but if your an alcoholic it will.

A real friend will respect your wishes and not try to shove drink's or drug's down your throat if your trying to quit.


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

Mental illness

Cannabis causes far more mental illness than drugs like heroin.

An experiment in decriminalisation in Alaska was terminated in a referendum in 1991 after over 2000 people in the previous 2 years had to hospitalised and treated for cannabis psychosis, a complete mental breakdown, at enormous cost to the taxpayer.

Schizophrenia is triggered or worsened by its use.

Apathy and dropping-out are common.

Even on one or two joints a month, a cannabis personality emerges. Users become inflexible, can't plan their days properly, can't take criticism and feel misunderstood. School grades take a nosedive, and at the same time they feel lonely and miserable. They find it difficult to sustain a dialogue. Trying to talk sense to them becomes a futile exercise.


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

Thanks for the advice guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm pretty solid on my not smoking cannibus again but I could feel myself drifting back into thinking it might not be so bad for me but I'm gona kick this psychological addiction's ass!!!!!

The truth, I know, is that I shoudln't do it again!!!!!!!!!!

it's meant to be ten times stronger than in the 60's and I've done it for four years anyway....
keep it coming !!!!
8)


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

In the sixties, the average THC content was just 0.5%.
Today at 5% it is 10 times stronger.
Drugs take control of your mind. No person can do that ? no parent, no teacher, and no friend. You can't make rational decisions.
And where's the Liberty in making yourself a slave to a toxic chemical for life"?

Psychological addiction (craving) is very strong 
causes more organic brain damage than any other drug of abuse except perhaps the very end stages of alcoholism".
This is a strong hallucinogenic drug
?	Relapse in a psychosis occurs more often among cannabis users than non-cannabis users. 
?	Cannabis has a negative effect on the course of the psychosis. 
?	Users of cannabis suffering from a psychosis become psychotic faster, more heavily and more sustained

People most at risk are those with a family history of psychotic illness or those who have already experienced a psychotic episode. So, people with a family or personal history of psychotic illness should avoid drugs like cannabis completely. 
Is it really worth the risk?


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## jft (Jan 10, 2005)

test


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## 17545 (Feb 14, 2007)

5


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2007)

*Shakes head*


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## 17545 (Feb 14, 2007)

5


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2007)

> People most at risk are those with a family history of psychotic illness or those who have already experienced a psychotic episode. So, people with a family or personal history of psychotic illness should avoid drugs like cannabis completely.
> Is it really worth the risk?


This is very solid advice.

Greg.


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

Tigersuit said:


> I know hundreds of pot smokers who are good, hardworking people, with very wholesome lives...Compare the number of people who smoke pot in the world to the amount of people who have DP/DR.


Well said. It's silly to try and demonize marijuana because a few people believe that it causes DP or DR or HPPD or any 'disorder'. Millions of people smoke weed every day in almost every country of the world and a very, very small fraction of them suffer any negative consequences aside from lethargy. If 15 people fall down the stairs and die in North America today, should we all stop using stairs? This is a drug that has been safely used for thousands of years in almost every region of the world, spanning cultural and spiritual boundries. Compare the amount of damage that marijuana causes to that of caffeine, alcohol, aspirin, codeine, oxycodone, valium, MAOI's... and you will find that it's got probably the cleanest record of any psychoactive in history. That being said, of course it has some negative effects and the potential for abuse is huge, mainly because it's 'no big deal' to get stoned.

Weed didn't cause my DP. Strong psychoactive experiences precipitated an existing mental condition to the surface, and I'll get through it.


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

If weed was as strongly linked to schizophrenia and mental illness as some people claim then my whole town would be full of psychos. It's fear mongering tactic's and those studies are shady at best.

Most of the studies linking schizophrenia to cannabis where done with people in the age bracket of around 18 to 30. Now that is when mental illnesses of all sort's are most likely to surface. I could figure out that those studies would be abit off even after smoking a big chunk of hash.

Also the THC content argument is also complete crap. Higher THC content means you have to smoke less weed which is actually a good thing.

And where the hell did you get that THC causes brain damage of any sort the evidence is conflicting at best. Alcohol causes brain damage for sure that much you got right. If you want to look at a drug that causes real brain damage look at methamphetamine. Id say that one would be at the top of the brain damage list.


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

I think it's all about susceptibility....which is one of the reasons I let it get so bad for me because I looked around at some of my mates and they were fine....

It's natural for someone trying to get away from it all to root out the negatives....

It's true that weed is getting stronger and stronger. The stuff in the 60's was the equivilant to beer and now the new stuff is more like whiskey...i.e super strength skunk weed....

I'm the perfect example of what weed can do to someone!! ONe of the reasons as well why it got so bad for me was because I'd drink, then smoke and then drink ridculously quickly to be able to function again and then carry on with that cycle...

Weed isn't phsyically addictive no but it's incredible pscyhologicaly addictive when it's played a very large part in your life and that's why I'm getting all this information.

It dosn't cause anything the first time you do it but over years and years of doing it it gets worse and worse...I've seen people who smoked weed for years who became moody, miserable, untalkative who then gave up and 3 months later they're happy, more social etc and that's what I want for me

peace

p.s mushrooms are just plain weird lol


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## Terri (Dec 19, 2006)

> If 15 people fall down the stairs and die in North America today, should we all stop using stairs?


Sorry, but I believe your logic is flawed!
People say things like that to create the illusion that drugs are safe.
You are just kidding yourself.

Jasmin


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## Pablo (Sep 1, 2005)

I went through a period like you closetome when all of my frineds would smoke weed almost every day, I would try to keep up smoking the same amount and thought that I should be able to handle it because my friends could easily smoke without any problems, but the fact was that I couldnt take it. I had to be my own person and stop caring what my mates thought about me saying no and to be honest my mates didnt really care, they probably gave me more respect for just doing my own thing. Cannabis isnt very addictive it is more of a habit but just a few months of discipline you wont even think about it much any more.

Often the reason why people smoke weed is because they want to live in a smoky haze and dont want to face up their emotional reality, when you give up it will be difficult as you will have to face up to emotions which the weed was preventing you from facing up to, this is the most difficult thing not the addiction. I smoked for about 2 years and when I gave up I felt very anxious and nervous for many weeks and had some very intense dreams and I had to stop myself from drinking to escape it, but if you can bear with the difficult emotions and not try to escape from them they will go away eventualy.


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

openminded said:


> Sorry, but I believe your logic is flawed!
> People say things like that to create the illusion that drugs are safe.
> You are just kidding yourself.
> 
> Jasmin


You make a fantastic argument. Well said.


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2007)

openminded said:


> > If 15 people fall down the stairs and die in North America today, should we all stop using stairs?
> 
> 
> Sorry, but I believe your logic is flawed!
> ...


Then we all live in an illusion; take a good look around you... how long till mother earth crumbles? ... *knocks on the LCD Screen* HElllo? "Global warming" I really can't wait till the chain reaction happens, I'm looking forward to the ice being totally melted away (To bring a new ice age)... war will come and I will "have" to take up arms to survive, I will then be able to die fighting for something meaningful? what is that you say? I will be fighting to ?*live*??

For the time being; I?m living to ?*die*?


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## jft (Jan 10, 2005)

I liken the "abandoning" of friends to an analogy regarding snowboarders. if ones life was snowboarding, if you were solid with a group of friends who did the same, and then one day you broke you neck, how would things change? Of course the friends would be there for you, but would eveything be the same? Would you go on trips with them to go boarding, would you sit around at get togethers and trade pipeline stories? Not to dismiss anything you had with those friends, but the main common bond you had was boarding, and you no longer can do it.

When one has to quit drugs due to something like dp/dr onset it is a bitch to think of the change that occurs within friendships. It is a practical change and is not at all a value judgement on anyone or anything. It is jsut reality. It no longer is the same to be around them when they are drugging, or they around you. The bond of drug use to me is not a good one to maintain life long friendships anyway because eventually something has to give. In my case it was I had dp/dr onset and had to quit, and chose to not be around my friends so much anymore but I did keep the friendships. One by one all wound up quitting or going to jail, some even died from overdose. I loved these people but the iffy nature of drug use was not a stable enough bond to keep me there. I had to choose between my own sanity and hanging with my buds. It actually was no choice. 
jft


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2007)

jft said:


> I liken the "abandoning" of friends to an analogy regarding snowboarders. if ones life was snowboarding, if you were solid with a group of friends who did the same, and then one day you broke you neck, how would things change? Of course the friends would be there for you, but would eveything be the same? Would you go on trips with them to go boarding, would you sit around at get togethers and trade pipeline stories? Not to dismiss anything you had with those friends, but the main common bond you had was boarding, and you no longer can do it.
> 
> jft


One liken the "abandoning" of friends to an analogy regaaarding snowboaaarders. if ones life was snowboaaarding, if you, one's old bean, were solid with ah group of friends whoh did the same, and then one deay you, one's old bean, broke you, one's old bean, neck, hoh would things change? of course the friends would be there for you, one's old bean,, but would eveything be the same? would you, one's old bean, jolly well goh ohn trips with them to jolly well goh boaaarding, would you, one's old bean, sit aaaround at mustah togethers and trade pipeline stories? not to dismiss anything you, one's old bean, had with those friends, but the main commohn bond you, one's old bean, had was boaaarding, and you, one's old bean, noh longah can doh it. Heavens above! How smashing! 

:lol:


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## Terri (Dec 19, 2006)

*Luuovico wrote:*
You make a fantastic argument. Well said

What is there to say, you have already convinced yourself that drugs are OK! contrary to all the evidence, so it seems it would be a futile argument, dont you think?

Jasmin


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## Terri (Dec 19, 2006)

*Emulated Puppet}er wrote:*
Then we all live in an illusion; take a good look around you... how long till mother earth crumbles?

Well, I think you may be a little off topic Darren :wink:

Jasmin.


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

openminded said:


> What is there to say, you have already convinced yourself that drugs are OK! contrary to all the evidence, so it seems it would be a futile argument, dont you think?
> 
> Jasmin


What evidence? Please elaborate, I'm curious. From here it seems like you are just dodging any legitimate debate because you have no knowledge to back up your claims.


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## Terri (Dec 19, 2006)

UMM.. 
Have you read half the posts on this site?

High doses of marijuana can induce psychosis (disturbed perceptions and thoughts), and marijuana use can worsen psychotic symptoms in people who have schizophrenia. There is also evidence of increased rates of depression, anxiety, and suicidal thinking in chronic marijuana users.

THC can cause DP/DR :roll:


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## Ludovico (Feb 9, 2007)

openminded said:


> UMM..
> Have you read half the posts on this site?
> THC caused DP/DR :roll:


That may be very true, I don't deny that many people believe that THC caused their DP/DR. Like I stated earlier in the topic, marijuana is a ridiculously safe drug statistically and historically. It's horrific that cannabinoids have caused anyone's DP/DR or any disorder of any kind, but you can't just ignore the fact that 99.99999% of recreational marijuana users experience very little negative side effects at all. The same principle can be applied to almost any family/branch of Pharmeceutical/Recreational/Entheogenic drugs in the history of mankind.

For example, quinolone antibiotics such as ciprofloxacin and levofloxacin are known to cause horrific side effects in an extremely small percentage of patients who are prescribed them (things like permanent paralysis and depression). However, these drugs save hundreds of thousands of lives from bacterial infections every year and are able to fight off bugs that in previous generations were considered fatal. Should doctors stop prescribing these medicines based on the infinitesimal chance that their patient may never walk again?

Yes, there are many sufferers of DP and DR that attribute their disorder to recreational marijuana use. Compare that number to the amount of people who have smoked pot _this week_ in North America and you will quickly get an idea of how safe this plant is.


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## Terri (Dec 19, 2006)

I appreciate your argument, its just, I have seen to many of my friends go downhill after using it that's all, it has a real stigma attached to it for me now.
So my evidence is seeing people I love throw away their life because of drugs.

Jasmin


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## monnolith (Feb 21, 2007)

Pot makes you dumm.

I'm not talking "dumb", but dumm. I have seen far too many good people in my life turn to shite because of their misguided attempts at self-medicating. People who have addictive predispositions are a write-off (expecially here in BC), and the other users who "claim" they could stop at any time, won't. And they will passionately defend their stance by saying that they see no need to stop, because they aren't "addicted". Hmm, kinda makes you wonder...

Bottom line is that pot is an unregulated drug that is used for self-medicating. If depression or DP were so easy to treat with pot, then why do so many people still have these dissorders, and psychologists still have jobs?

It's a rhetorical question.


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## closetome (Nov 16, 2006)

It's not what happens the first time after you've smoked weed it's what happens over long periods of time. There is a general ethical, moral deterioration and general degrading with continued substance abuse.


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2007)

openminded said:


> *Emulated Puppet}er wrote:*
> Then we all live in an illusion; take a good look around you... how long till mother earth crumbles?
> 
> Well, I think you may be a little off topic Darren :wink:
> ...


Not at all; mother earth is the board In which we play our games on, with out the board, there are to be no more ?fun? games. :wink: ? Bless ya.


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2007)

Blah... I made a mistake


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2007)

Ludovico said:


> but you can't just ignore the fact that 99.99999% of recreational marijuana users experience very little negative side effects at all.


What?s to say ?some? of them have had a change in their sense of reality only to assume it?s real/normal? wouldn?t that make them insane?


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## 17545 (Feb 14, 2007)

6


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2007)

Tigersuit said:


> monnolith said:
> 
> 
> > If depression or DP were so easy to treat with pot, then why do so many people still have these dissorders, and psychologists still have jobs?
> ...


Anti-depressants are for depression, as pot is for pot heads. I know where your coming from thought, The docs seem to think anti-depressants cure "everything"... most of the time the placebo affect only works if the person taken the sugar pill "truly" wants to get better... I don't 100% want to get better because it will be abnormal to be normal for me.


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## 17545 (Feb 14, 2007)

6


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## Pollyanna 3098 (Dec 12, 2006)

Darren you said



> I don't 100% want to get better because it will be abnormal to be normal for me.


That is quite a paradox, I have never thought of it that way.
You say you have had DP/DR for pretty much all of your life, so to recover would make you feel like a different person.
Is that the way you see it Darren?

3098


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2007)

I can not recall perceiving the world any differently then I always have, so I can only ?assume? I?ve had DR/DP all my life (This alone lowers my motivation to get better because I have always lacked the taste of reality, and so I don?t know what I?m really fighting for). I feel as if I?m a parasite to the body I am ?in?, and so in order to become ?better? I must end ?myself? so the ?original? being within me can be released.


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## Pollyanna 3098 (Dec 12, 2006)

> I can not recall perceiving the world any differently then I always have, so I can only ?assume? I?ve had DR/DP all my life (This alone lowers my motivation to get better because I have always lacked the taste of reality, and so I don?t know what I?m really fighting for). I feel as if I?m a parasite to the body I am ?in?, and so in order to become ?better? I must end ?myself? so the ?original? being within me can be released.


I cannot image what that would be like, not knowing whether or not you
what to change as it were.
Well, I guess if it were me I would certainly be curious to find out what life
would be like without DP
BUT, I can see your point as well

3098


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2007)

It?s a gamble; if I end DP? will I still exist? Let?s just get to the point, my life at the moment is not fulfilling, so upwards and onwards? let?s see what I?m made of.

Thanks for talking to me, just lately I?ve been feeling as if no one has been listening to my far cries. 



Pollyanna 3098 said:


> > I can not recall perceiving the world any differently then I always have, so I can only ?assume? I?ve had DR/DP all my life (This alone lowers my motivation to get better because I have always lacked the taste of reality, and so I don?t know what I?m really fighting for). I feel as if I?m a parasite to the body I am ?in?, and so in order to become ?better? I must end ?myself? so the ?original? being within me can be released.
> 
> 
> I cannot image what that would be like, not knowing whether or not you
> ...


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## comfortably numb (Mar 6, 2006)

I found pot to be a great anti-depressant and mood stabilizer. It pretty much always helped my depression and it worked better and much faster on my mania (especially the dysphoric kind) then any pharmacetical drug ive tried. It always slowed down my racing thought's and calmed me down.

I think the danger's of smoking pot are way overblown. I smoked the stuff for about 9 year's and never suffered any significant negative side effect's at all really. About the only side effect's i got from it where a bad cough when i smoked too much of it for awile and i put on a few extra pounds from eating abit too much when i had the munchies.

I have never seen anyone suffer any real problem's from smoking pot and i know a hell of alot of pot head's. I have however seen alot of people develop mental problem's due to alcohol use and have even know a few people that attemped suicide and even killed themselves while drunk.

Sure i have no doubt that some people come down with dp/dr after smoking pot for awile but those are very rare cases. In my opinion the average pot head has nothing to worry about.


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