# The lord has paid for us through the atonement



## yoyo (Aug 24, 2005)

Who is Jesus Christ and what has he done for us the humanity?

Jesus-Christ is litterally the son of God, our older brother and lord of this world. He came down to earth in order show the way to eternal life and make possible for us to repent from our sins. This is an eternal truth, no matter what we personaly believe. I now explain how Christ through out the atonement did pay for our sins. I will use an analogi in order to illustrate the power of the atonement.

Analogi:

Imagine that you and I are very good friends. Nothing in the world could destroy the trust that we have for each other. Our friendship is absolut. One day, you are having some financial problems. You have got a big telefon bill to pay, but you are in the impossibility to pay it. You then decide to ask me for some help with that. I want to help you, so I borrow you the money you need. We agree that you will pay back a month later. You promess me and, of course, I trust you completely. I do not doubt one second that you will pay back within that period of time. You do not really know how you will be able to pay back, but you do your very best, everything that is in your power in order to get the money on time. For exempel, you tried to find work in order to earn money, you asked anyone from your family and finally the goverment for help, but nothing worked successfully. It is now time to pay back your debt, so you come over to my place and tell that that you do not have the money. You explain that you did your very best in order to get the money on time, but you failed. I understand your situation and I really want to give you some sort of second chance. I would like to give you some more time, or even give the money as a present. With other words, I want to show some mercy, but if I do it, then justice is neglected, which is not acceptable. The commitment that you originally made is not being fullfilled. Justice can not be neglected. How can we solve the problem then?
How can justice and mercy exist and interact at the same time? We just found that if I show mercy, then justice is neglicted. That is not satisfactory.

When we both think about how we can solve the problem, the phone rings. It is one of our friends. He wonders how we are doing. We tell him that we are quite fine, except for the actual deal we are facing. We explain to him our situation. He then proposes to pay the debt. You accept it and thanks him for that wonderful act of charity. Now, we can note that both justice and mercy are being showed. But that implied and required a third person. Yes, that third person is Jesus- Christ. He paid the price for us, the humanity. Before we came down on earth, we also made a commitment to follow the law of the gospel, but because of our imperfection, we could not fullfill that commitment. God knew that from the very beginning. That is the reason why He, in His great plan, gave rise to a savior, in order to pay for our sins. If we reject the savior, then we reject His help. If we reject his help, then we still have a debt to pay.


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## Martinelv (Aug 10, 2004)

Which god? People believe in thousands of different versions / flavours / incarnations.


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## yoyo (Aug 24, 2005)

People believe in different Gods. You are right. But do not forget that the true God is the God that showed us the way back to Him. It is the God from the very beginning of everything. Prophets have testified about Him since the creation. I only know one God: our Heavenly Father, the God of this world, the Father of Jesus-Christ. I testify that He is our God, no matter what we believe or imagine how He is. Jesus-Christ showed us the way back.


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## yoyo (Aug 24, 2005)

People believe in different Gods. You are right. But do not forget that the true God is the God that showed us the way back to Him. It is the God from the very beginning of everything. Prophets have testified about Him since the creation. I only know one God: our Heavenly Father, the God of this world, the Father of Jesus-Christ. I testify that He is our God, no matter what we believe or imagine how He is. Jesus-Christ showed us the way back.


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## Martinelv (Aug 10, 2004)

> I only know one God: our Heavenly Father, the God of this world, the Father of Jesus-Christ.


Ah, thanks. You believe in the Jesus one. Thanks for clarifying that.



> But do not forget that the true God is the God that showed us the way back to Him


But, er, surely that's what all the other gods have done too. All those millions of different Hindu ones, Allah, the trillions of tribal gods......sigh. Who can hope to choose? It's all so confusing.


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## yoyo (Aug 24, 2005)

Right. There is so many Gods ( I mean people believe in so many different Gods). That does not mean that there is more than one God. No matter how we imagine God, He is still the same God. The question is rather: which representation of God is right? Is it Jesus-Christ, Mohammed, Allah or anything else? I only know one God which prophets testified about since the very beginning. That is Jesus-Christ. This is an evidence that Jesus-Christ is originally the source of Godness.


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## Martinelv (Aug 10, 2004)

> This is an evidence that Jesus-Christ is originally the source of Godness.


We've gone over this before, but there is very little contemporary evidence that this Jesus Christ ever existed. Just an occassional reference or two. A little strange considering the miracles he was supposed to have performed ? I think so. And even if he did exist, he was almost certainly schizophrenic. If he walked into your local pub now I think you'd agree.

It does make me snigger, behind my hand of course, that all these millions of people are grovelling at the feet of an image of a man who almost certainly didn't exist, and even if he did, was probably barking. Still, whatever floats your boat.


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## Phill (Sep 27, 2004)

Well, as it's been said, Jesus is either a lunatic, liar or Lord.
I choose Lord, others choose the other 2.


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## Sojourner (May 21, 2005)

http://www.ignatiusinsight.com/features ... _dec04.asp


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## Martinelv (Aug 10, 2004)

I don't choose any of them. 'God' is meaningless to me. He doesn't exist, so can't be a lunatic, liar or lord. Only those who follow 'him' make such distinctions.


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## Guest (Sep 26, 2005)

Right, whatever you say Martin. You know all.


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## Martinelv (Aug 10, 2004)

:lol:

Pay attention at the back!! I don't pretend to be sure of anything. It's the religious who have all the answers - ready made, packaged up, microwaveable, vegetarian friendly, "Warning - while every effort has been made to remove all the homosexuals from this product, some may remain."...etc.


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## Phill (Sep 27, 2004)

Whoever claims to have all the answers knows nothing.
The person who told me that said he doesn't know everything.


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