# Testosterone replacement therapy caused DP



## Jimbo9 (Apr 14, 2012)

Hi everyone,

This seems like a really close-knit community full of kind and helpful people so I am looking forward to chatting with you all. Without further ado, this is how 
I became depersonalised (the spelling there gives away my UK residency!)

Firstly, I should mention that I have posted this story in full detail on another forum. I am going to try to be a little more brief this time, as I have finally realised that a massive essay on my woes is hard to get through, but here is a link to a more comprehensive account, if you are interested:
http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=49750.msg672956#msg672956

Basically, medication caused my DP, more specifically testosterone replacement therapy (Feb 2011 - Apr 2011) triggered its arrival. After having found that I had very low testosterone levels (most tests would hover at around 300, already signalling deficiency, the last test before I was put on a transdermal cream showed a level of only 70).

I had struggled with mood issues on and off for a few years, as well as the obvious physical symptoms that a deficiency would bring. As you can imagine, I was extremely excited about embarking upon this medication, having been told that this would correct all my physical and mental shortcomings and that it would be "life changing" (an actual quote from my endocrinologist). He certainly got that last part right, just for all the wrong reasons.

The symptoms started after just a couple of days of applying the gel (once every morning). Here is a list of the changes that occurred during my time on TRT, which lasted five weeks before I realised that my doctor's suggestion that this was nothing more than a settling in period, despite him also saying that he'd never had one of his patients react to testosterone in this way, was completely untrue:

-	Severe 'brain fog', both in writing and in speech, e.g. forgetting simple words, feeling they were just out of reach all the time.
-	A physical inability to keep my eyes on something for more than a few seconds, which was strange. For some reason, I would have to turn away from my computer monitor, or the TV screen very regularly even if I told myself to keep looking at the object in question. I would have to read tiny blocks of texts over and over again in order to make any sense of what was written, and even then I couldn't grasp much of it.
-	Generalised derealisation (come to think of it, this has been more prominent than DP throughout this ordeal, though the latter has definitely been there).
-	Complete lack of emotion/autonomy, not being at all worried about what was going on despite knowing that something very bad was happening.
-	Vice like tension headaches every day for the five weeks I was on the medication.
-	Visual disturbances, not exactly blurred vision because I could still read, but a sense of being kind of cross-eyed, a strange feeling between the eyes. Felt like my eyes were bulging when attempting to focus.
-	Literal dulling of colour.
-	Extreme exacerbation of insomnia, which I already had, which often resulted in 2-3 nights in a row of pretty much no sleep, or waking up 7-8 times in the night when I did finally drift off. Huge increase in dream frequency, which probably just suggested that my sleep wasn't very deep.
-	Early on in treatment, tremors in the evening, mostly in my arms and hands. Particularly prominent when eating dinner. Disappeared over time but occasionally returned.
-	Non-existent concentration, poor memory recall.
-	Confusion.

*Since Coming Off TRT*

-	Lack of emotion/autonomy quite suddenly switched to absolute inability to control emotions, crying spells for no reason, overwhelming anxiety for no reason etc (despite DP/DR still existing.
-	DP/DR has very, very slowly lessened over the past year, and is maybe 20% better now, but only because I stick to an incredibly strict diet (more to come shortly!)
-	About a month after coming off of TRT, I started having major problems with food. I would get 'explosions' in my stomach whilst eating and a very tight knotted feeling. This increased over a few days and then turned into something a lot harsher, as I would get severe pain in my stomach and chest and found it difficult to breathe after eating.
-	I started to get terrible emotional responses to food, becoming absolutely hysterical after lots of my meals.
-	Eating most foods would also dial up DP/DR x10. After eating something that disagreed with me, it would take weeks before I was on a more even keel.
-	I eventually learnt that I had to change my diet.
-	I now eat only half a dozen foods. The trend is that I stick to these foods constantly, and most of my symptoms improve at an impossibly slow rate, until either they plateau and stop improving, or I try to re-introduce an old food, which almost always wreaks havoc, setting me back weeks until I finally claw my way back to equilibrium, as I mentioned earlier.
-	I get very dizzy/fatigued after eating if there are too many carbs in a meal, even if it is balanced with a lot more protein/fat. A blood sugar test came out fine, but it was after I changed my diet to predominantly protein/fat, and took place away from my most carb heavy meal. The conundrum is that I still have to eat a reasonable amount of carbs, despite contributing most to my symptoms because I am very underweight (digestive troubles caused big time weight loss).
-	Despite dizziness and fatigue being consistent with the GI of foods I was eating, I would also get the same thing from some non-carbs sources (e.g. major dizziness from eggs, DP/DR/tremendous anxiety from broccoli of all things, and DP/DR from steak).
- Protein shakes are particularly bad for my DP (perhaps due to stimulating amino acids?)
-	Any supplements now cause major anxiety/depression. A regular dose of vitamin B/C etc would make me incredibly upset, DP'ed etc an hour later and continue on for quite a while. I even need to be careful about how many digestive enzymes I take, as more than two at a meal can lead to the same outcome.
-	Muscle pain/stiffness after eating, feeling of blood pooling in limbs, particularly in legs which would become extremely heavy (this was before I overhauled my diet, I don't get this now).
-	Colours would literally fade into a cloudy mist if I tried to focus on someone for too long during a conversation.
-	Initially after coming off TRT, walking for more than say twenty minutes would cause feelings of impending doom and levels of anxiety far greater than anything I had ever experienced. My ability to exercise has improved over time but I still have to be very careful. Any kind of lifting with dumbbells still makes me very DPed and anxious.
-	*Most importantly, also around a month after coming off of TRT, I developed a horrible, scary startle reflex. By this I mean a highly exaggerated adrenaline rush to everyday things which I knew were of no threat (e.g. a car driving past whilst I was walking on a pavement caused a wave of adrenaline, as did something as simple as a bird tweeting outside the window while I was taking a nap. Again, I knew this was no threat, but it didn't make a blind bit of difference to my reaction.*

Now I have to use a really rigid diet in order to control my symptoms. They don't disappear, but they are more tolerable if I do so. Brain fog, startle reflex etc. all become majorly heightened if I divert away from what I am doing.

Thank you very much for reading what turned out to be a much longer post than I had intended. I would be enormously grateful if anyone with similar experiences could share them, or if you just have your own thoughts on what might have occurred. I am of the belief that it is a CNS problem at work here (overloaded by the hormonal changes) as this seems most consistent with the information I have gathered from my internet. Also, quite interestingly, people who have withdrawn from SSRI's or anti-anxiety medication seem to possess similar stories to be mine.

I would be particular keen to here from anyone who has been DP'ed by medication, and/or have problems with food (becoming much more DP'ed and facing physical symptoms after just a couple of bites) or are extremely sensitive to medication since being DP'ed.

•	One final thing - when I say dizziness on a few occasions in this post, a more accurate term would be a sea-sick type feeling. I feel like I'm rocking inwardly and are unsteady, the room doesn't actually spin or anything.

Sorry for making this so long. Please do reply if there is just one little thing you would like to comment on.

Many thanks,
Jimbo.


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## shogun (May 15, 2010)

My DP (when i have it) is always revolved around anxiety. In 2008 i got panic attacks which triggered DP/DR from following the anabolic diet (pretty much zero carb though out the week and carbs on the weekend) as induction though i decided to skip the carb up weekends.

Triggered massive anxiety and DP in me, got catecholamine testing done and it shows my coritsol levels were through the roof but the follow up test was supposedly fine (i think i threw the test out cause i got it in my head to drink massive amounts of water to clear the cortisol from my system and i'd feel better) and in that test i filled the tub all the way up to the top and couldn't fill it anymore in the 24 hour period.

Anyway thats what tipped me off about hormones effecting how we feel etc

The TRT thing isn't the first time i have heard of this, i've read of people having higher anxiety and panic on TRT. This thread on another forum may or may not give you an idea http://thinksteroids.com/forum/mens-health-forum/testosterone-replacement-therapy-anxiety-134258493.html

People reported that too much of the testosterone was being converted to estraidol which can cause anxiety (according to them) i don't know the action.

Were you ever tested for this??

Problem with Hormone therapies is the body has a mind of it's own and will convert hormones to different things, and as response to other hormones being introduced it will ramp up production of other hormones like estrogen so it's really hard to predict.

Have you had hormonal profiles or anything like that done recently?


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## Visual (Oct 13, 2010)

Jimbo,

Welcome to the forum.

Have you had a prolactin test? If so, what was the value? If not, get one.

Are you aware of difficulties with soy? Have you had soy sensitivity tests - skin and blood?

What were your symptoms before the testosterone creme? At what age did they start?

What are your home and work environment like? (city, factory, office, rural, farming, new contruction, ...)

[Sorry that there are so many questions but it is important in cases like what you report]

Points I am getting at, I have a mild soy sensitivity ... thought nothing about it since didn't eat much Chinese take-out. However the vast majority of vegetable oil used is soy. Also lecithin (Phosphatidyl Choline) is made from soy. While generally sensitivities are protein (and all tests are protein based), I am sensitive to fat. Even though PC is highly processed it bothers me.

The entire nervous system is made of fat - large amounts of cholesterol and PC (myelin sheathing insulates electrical impulses that travel through axons and oil is an insulator).

Testosterone creme is made from soy. It is possible that it wasn't just the messing around with hormones than changed things. If you have sensitivity to soy then you likely have a slightly malnourished CNS. Your hyperactivity to food (amino balance or whatever) is a possible clue that this is the case. Gut dysbiosis is another possibility. Also, sensitivities raise inflammation which increase metabolic loads (oxidative stress, etc.).

Much of the symptoms you describe involve the neurons that use dopamine and dopamine shortage. Low dopamine will cause low testosterone. 70 is very low.

These are just some thoughts to chew on and investigate. I find low doses of Sinemet 25/100 extremely beneficial. Perhaps you might as well, though it is impossible to really know how a person will respond until they try. And with your situation being tightly balanced, if you do try anything, start with low amounts. Best wishes...


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