# Chronic fatigue and the DP connection?



## nemesis (Aug 10, 2004)

I've been trawling the Internet and medical journals in search for illnesses that could possibly compliment DP. Now I know this was possibly an unwise thing to do after the recent discussion on how such activities can strengthen the grip of the ruminations that frequent DP, but in this case I feel I may have found an illness that shares a striking number of similarities with what I know to be my own DP symptoms.

In my case, the illness and then subsequent DP followed a very stressful 6 month period of my life where candles were being burnt at both ends so to speak.

The illness is called Chronic Fatigue and it?s generally identified by a lack of energy in combination with cognitive and memory problems without any apparent physical cause.

Has anyone else entertained the thought of CFS, if so, what were the outcomes? Please feel free to tell me that I'm barking up the wrong tree with this one.



> Chronic fatigue symptoms:
> 
> * Fatigue: People with CFS have long-term fatigue (lasting longer than 6 months to a year) that cannot be explained by other diseases. People with CFS may have had a previous infection. They are tired and ?run down? during the infection, and the fatigue continues after the person has recovered from the illness.
> 
> ...


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## nemesis (Aug 10, 2004)

I've been trawling the Internet and medical journals in search for illnesses that could possibly compliment DP. Now I know this was possibly an unwise thing to do after the recent discussion on how such activities can strengthen the grip of the ruminations that frequent DP, but in this case I feel I may have found an illness that shares a striking number of similarities with what I know to be my own DP symptoms.

In my case, the illness and then subsequent DP followed a very stressful 6 month period of my life where candles were being burnt at both ends so to speak.

The illness is called Chronic Fatigue and it?s generally identified by a lack of energy in combination with cognitive and memory problems without any apparent physical cause.

Has anyone else entertained the thought of CFS, if so, what were the outcomes? Please feel free to tell me that I'm barking up the wrong tree with this one.



> Chronic fatigue symptoms:
> 
> * Fatigue: People with CFS have long-term fatigue (lasting longer than 6 months to a year) that cannot be explained by other diseases. People with CFS may have had a previous infection. They are tired and ?run down? during the infection, and the fatigue continues after the person has recovered from the illness.
> 
> ...


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## g-funk (Aug 20, 2004)

Yep, been there done that! Another similar illness called Fibromyalgia also has similar symptoms. Sufferers report dissociative type memory problems and it has been labelled 'fibrofog'. The reason I came across it is because like you, I had nearly all the symptoms. Constant sore throat, period pains, a condition called TMJ (jaw disfunction), and most of all, something called Alpha EEG sleep anomaly which I started a thread on a while back, under 'night terrors'. The only thing I didnt have was the actual 'pain' symptom, similar to arthritis, which is the main 'criteria' for the illness. So I don't have it.

I, like you, want to explore any links. I believe we may find out more about the illness this way, like who is predisposed to it etc. A more 'chemical' approach in a sense. But I have to be careful when I find myself getting 'too' involved or obsessional about it. If I did have all the illnesses I have thought I have had at some point in my life, I would be a total wreck.

My guess is all these symptoms and likewise for CFS, are somehow related, not necessary to any particular condition. A symptom doesn't necessarily mean you have the illness. However, it is definitely worth eliminating if you think it really could be. I can tick practically every box on an ADD test , so I am going to chat to someone about that, because my boyfriend read the test and said 'yep. that's you'. So i didnt feel so much of a hypochondriac!

Chat to your doctor because it may well prove worthwhile!


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## g-funk (Aug 20, 2004)

Yep, been there done that! Another similar illness called Fibromyalgia also has similar symptoms. Sufferers report dissociative type memory problems and it has been labelled 'fibrofog'. The reason I came across it is because like you, I had nearly all the symptoms. Constant sore throat, period pains, a condition called TMJ (jaw disfunction), and most of all, something called Alpha EEG sleep anomaly which I started a thread on a while back, under 'night terrors'. The only thing I didnt have was the actual 'pain' symptom, similar to arthritis, which is the main 'criteria' for the illness. So I don't have it.

I, like you, want to explore any links. I believe we may find out more about the illness this way, like who is predisposed to it etc. A more 'chemical' approach in a sense. But I have to be careful when I find myself getting 'too' involved or obsessional about it. If I did have all the illnesses I have thought I have had at some point in my life, I would be a total wreck.

My guess is all these symptoms and likewise for CFS, are somehow related, not necessary to any particular condition. A symptom doesn't necessarily mean you have the illness. However, it is definitely worth eliminating if you think it really could be. I can tick practically every box on an ADD test , so I am going to chat to someone about that, because my boyfriend read the test and said 'yep. that's you'. So i didnt feel so much of a hypochondriac!

Chat to your doctor because it may well prove worthwhile!


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## Guest (Sep 28, 2004)

i dunno but im tired every fuckin day, no matter how much sleep i get.

depressing shit


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## Guest (Sep 28, 2004)

i dunno but im tired every fuckin day, no matter how much sleep i get.

depressing shit


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## g-funk (Aug 20, 2004)

Apart from the following being a bit jargony, it shows some linke maybe?
It says milder forms of dissociation can be caused by damage to NMDA receptors. Isn't this the same as epilepsy? I know there are similarities between the two conditions with symptoms overlapping and dp'ers are often prescribed anti convulsants, but just wondered if another link could be explored? I know for a fact that strobe lighting triggers my full-on dr feelings. There are so many links to other illnesses that I am going to have to turn my brain off from trying to find it all out. (Kind of hoping some of the guys at Kings College may be tuning in)

*Our research indicates that fibrofog is a subtype of fibromyalgia connected to dissociation, wherein problems with memory and mental confusion are prominent and superimposed on the primary symptoms of FMS. Individuals presenting with fibrofog exhibit a subtype of the Fibromyalgia Syndrome of a more severe form.

The public perception that dissociative symptoms arise solely from psychological causation is unfounded, particularly in the case of milder forms of dissociation. Causation in many of these cases may be tied to abnormalities in N-methyl-D-aspartate receptor activity. The symptomatic difficulties that unify the fibrofog syndrome are known to be produced by sleep deprivation and certain classes of drugs that affect N-methyl-D-aspartate receptor activity. By way of illustration, Ketamine is known to induce dissociative like states in psychologically healthy individuals characterized by sensations of time slowing, alterations in sensory processing, tunnel vision, feelings of being in a fog, loss of control of thought processes and poor memory. Since Ketamine is a drug known to be mediated by the blockage of N-methyl-D-aspartate receptor activity, it is conceivable that any medical disease process that interferes with NMDA activity might induce symptoms of fibrofog in otherwise psychologically healthy individuals. *

Hope I haven't opened a can of worms here...I know a lot of people may relate to the above....


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## g-funk (Aug 20, 2004)

Apart from the following being a bit jargony, it shows some linke maybe?
It says milder forms of dissociation can be caused by damage to NMDA receptors. Isn't this the same as epilepsy? I know there are similarities between the two conditions with symptoms overlapping and dp'ers are often prescribed anti convulsants, but just wondered if another link could be explored? I know for a fact that strobe lighting triggers my full-on dr feelings. There are so many links to other illnesses that I am going to have to turn my brain off from trying to find it all out. (Kind of hoping some of the guys at Kings College may be tuning in)

*Our research indicates that fibrofog is a subtype of fibromyalgia connected to dissociation, wherein problems with memory and mental confusion are prominent and superimposed on the primary symptoms of FMS. Individuals presenting with fibrofog exhibit a subtype of the Fibromyalgia Syndrome of a more severe form.

The public perception that dissociative symptoms arise solely from psychological causation is unfounded, particularly in the case of milder forms of dissociation. Causation in many of these cases may be tied to abnormalities in N-methyl-D-aspartate receptor activity. The symptomatic difficulties that unify the fibrofog syndrome are known to be produced by sleep deprivation and certain classes of drugs that affect N-methyl-D-aspartate receptor activity. By way of illustration, Ketamine is known to induce dissociative like states in psychologically healthy individuals characterized by sensations of time slowing, alterations in sensory processing, tunnel vision, feelings of being in a fog, loss of control of thought processes and poor memory. Since Ketamine is a drug known to be mediated by the blockage of N-methyl-D-aspartate receptor activity, it is conceivable that any medical disease process that interferes with NMDA activity might induce symptoms of fibrofog in otherwise psychologically healthy individuals. *

Hope I haven't opened a can of worms here...I know a lot of people may relate to the above....


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## Guest (Sep 28, 2004)

There is no connection with dp and CFS or fibromylagia.
Although it is possible to have both it's not common.
This is know because I have had CFS for over ten years.I belong to several internet support groups,have received countless newsletters and know a few people with CFS/fibro.

There are mild cases of every chronic condition but mostly if you have CFS you will know you are ill as in sick,aching all over etc.
It's quite easy for a person who has CFS to be able to distinguish it from a mental or psychological disorder,even though CFS/fibro sufferers may have depression and anxiety(natural enough....considering).

There is a criteria for both conditions.
Having one or two symptoms would not fit the criteria.
If you don't have a lot of severe pain(trigger points)you don't have fibro.

It's true that both CFS and Fibro people complain of short term memory problems and brain fog.CFS is considered a nueromuscular disorder and both disorders have sleep dysfunction as one of the main symtoms.

The only other physical condition that I have personally noticed people talking about dp is inner ear/vestibular disorders which has been discussed here many times.
I know for myself there is an absolute connection.I'm also lucky enough to have a vestibular disorder.Motion increases my dizziness which increases my dp.

Cheers all,Shelly


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## Guest (Sep 28, 2004)

There is no connection with dp and CFS or fibromylagia.
Although it is possible to have both it's not common.
This is know because I have had CFS for over ten years.I belong to several internet support groups,have received countless newsletters and know a few people with CFS/fibro.

There are mild cases of every chronic condition but mostly if you have CFS you will know you are ill as in sick,aching all over etc.
It's quite easy for a person who has CFS to be able to distinguish it from a mental or psychological disorder,even though CFS/fibro sufferers may have depression and anxiety(natural enough....considering).

There is a criteria for both conditions.
Having one or two symptoms would not fit the criteria.
If you don't have a lot of severe pain(trigger points)you don't have fibro.

It's true that both CFS and Fibro people complain of short term memory problems and brain fog.CFS is considered a nueromuscular disorder and both disorders have sleep dysfunction as one of the main symtoms.

The only other physical condition that I have personally noticed people talking about dp is inner ear/vestibular disorders which has been discussed here many times.
I know for myself there is an absolute connection.I'm also lucky enough to have a vestibular disorder.Motion increases my dizziness which increases my dp.

Cheers all,Shelly


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## gimpy34 (Aug 10, 2004)

There was a lot of speculation about DP being a result of NMDA receptor malfunction after a trial with Lamictal (regulates glutamate function) yielded semi-positive results, and researchers thought they were on to something. A second trial proved Lamictal ineffective for treating disassociation, so I don't know if that theory has been axed or what. There are a lot of ways they try to treat CFS, from Provigil to B12 injections to whatever.


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## gimpy34 (Aug 10, 2004)

There was a lot of speculation about DP being a result of NMDA receptor malfunction after a trial with Lamictal (regulates glutamate function) yielded semi-positive results, and researchers thought they were on to something. A second trial proved Lamictal ineffective for treating disassociation, so I don't know if that theory has been axed or what. There are a lot of ways they try to treat CFS, from Provigil to B12 injections to whatever.


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## Guest (Sep 29, 2004)

man fuck all this MDMA, Serotoinin, Receptors, Brain Lobe bullshit!

why the fuck am i tired all the time! ughhhhhhh

shit is frustrating as hell


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## Guest (Sep 29, 2004)

man fuck all this MDMA, Serotoinin, Receptors, Brain Lobe bullshit!

why the fuck am i tired all the time! ughhhhhhh

shit is frustrating as hell


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## pfpc (Aug 22, 2004)

I have CFS too, although 99% recovered. Trust me: DP and CFS are two completely different animals.

Paolo


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## pfpc (Aug 22, 2004)

I have CFS too, although 99% recovered. Trust me: DP and CFS are two completely different animals.

Paolo


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## nemesis (Aug 10, 2004)

Thanks for clearing that up guys!


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## nemesis (Aug 10, 2004)

Thanks for clearing that up guys!


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