# Another Melbourne Update



## Guest (Dec 24, 2004)

Hi to those who remember me from a while ago and hi to all those who don't ...there's a lot of new names since i've been here.

I'm currently back home for christmas (for three weeks). Just wanted to share my story so far as it's quite positive and may give people hope.

The short version is, before moving interstate to Melbourne I suffered agoraphobia (frequent panic attacks), obsessive thoughts, and episodic dp and dr for several years. I was afraid of everything. I moved to Melbourne as a last resort to improve my life by turning it completely upside down. I was quite convinced that I may well die of fear by moving there and having to face all my phobias ALL AT ONCE (my phobias were...FLYING, public transport, crowded places, being away from my family, being home alone, being outside the house basically).

Well, I am happy to report that by taking the step and moving...I have overcome every single (insert very rude word here) phobia I ever had. And dp and dr are a thing of the past. I quite simply cannot believe it. Imagine if I had stayed home and let my fear dictate my life. I worry I come across as glib and preachy here, like Im bragging or trying to sell you something but I just wanted to share. I'm just so relieved. It is very possible to overcome fear by walking straight towards it.

Another thing too, since I've gotten home, I've noticed some of my worries and anxiety sensations return. I figure that there are a lot of triggers here that are putting me in the same head space I was in when I had the anxiety so i don't let it worry me too much although it's not a nice experience. Just goes to show we condition our environment to trigger anxiety over time. That's why it's good to get out there and shake things up by doing different things that keep our brains occupied.

Anyway, I hope to hear from any of you who has helped to get my scared arse over to where I am. Thank you.

Merry Christmas to you all,
Monika


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## Guest (Dec 24, 2004)

cool post


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## Guest (Dec 24, 2004)

What job do you have now in melbourne?

How was the flight there?


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## Guest (Dec 24, 2004)

Oh, merry christmas to you too!


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## Guest (Dec 24, 2004)

I worked as a customer research interviewer. It was not a dream come true but it allowed me to be as emotionally uninvolved as I wanted to be. I use the past tense as they fired me the day after I arrived back home. Apparently I lack attention to detail. It was a shock as I have never been fired before and also because I did not see it coming. Apparently they can do that to temps. Anyways, it was their little Christmas present to me. Bless their little hearts.

The flight to Melbourne was OK. I had valium especially for the occassion and it helped. The flight back home was really good. I actually enjoyed myself!!! I even looked out the window towards the end when we were landing. Again, the valium helped.


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## g-funk (Aug 20, 2004)

That is brilliant Monika! I am so pleased for you and thank you for posting a successful story. Have a brilliant Christmas xxx


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## Guest (Dec 24, 2004)

> it allowed me to be as emotionally uninvolved as I wanted to be


Yeah interestingly I would also do just jobs that don't require any emotional involvement whatsoever.

I think this is very important because it ensures that the job is just something that exists outside seperately from ourselves.

I personally prefer doing things without any concentration. Something stubborn. Works best for me since everything else leads to mental exhaustion.


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## Guest (Dec 24, 2004)

Also don't worry about the job.

Given what you have achieved for yourself already the loss of the job isn't even worth a thought. After all who cares what they think.


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## kenc127 (Aug 10, 2004)

Monika

I remember very well some of the fears that you discussed on the board back then. I'm so happy to hear that you conquered them all. I know how crippling agoraphobia can be and it VERY encouraging to hear that you conquered it. Have a great holiday, and thanks for sharing.

Ken


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## sleepingbeauty (Aug 18, 2004)

wow. this is such an interesting post. i actually tried that twice and it didnt work i just got worse.. but im pretty sure my circumstances were a bit different. now i really have a fear of leaving home because ive already done it and fell flat on my arse. i know i cant stay here though. being home is very unhealthy and what you say about triggers is true. theres too many lingering ghosts that i have to contend with here that just f#ck me all up. and everytime i come back i fall into that hole that i was in before i left. right now im deep in that hole with my head buried enough so that i can barely see the world anymore.

i think those triggers that you mention have alot to do with expectations. at least for me they are. im supposed to be a certian way and act a certian way in front of my family and my home town because they know me and they expect things out of me. unfortunately that person is not who i really am and ive had to hide the true me. thats why i long to leave because if im not here i can finally be myself and do what i want without being treated like a wierdo and dissapointing my parents. being here literally feels like highschool. like im hanging with the in crowd and i have to look and act a certian way so that i wont be shuned. even so.. i keep failing at doing it even though i try so hard to be someone else i just end up being a dissapointment. my whole life ive done nothing but dash my families hope and dreams of me down the toilet. i was supposed to be ms hawaii i was supposed to go to kamehameha school and on to UH as a star volleyball player so that they could watch me on tv and brag about me. that of course never panned out and i havent heard the end of it since. but im still supposed to fit this profile of me that they have in their minds, and because of my want to make them happy ive become someone else, someone that i absolutely lothe. thats enough to give anyone mental illness.


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## Guest (Dec 25, 2004)

> my whole life ive done nothing but dash my families hope and dreams of me down the toilet


Well that is something too.

In fact, it takes courage to do that.

I myself am proud that I don't meet anyone's expectations.

I was always proud of being against it. Whatever it is. Dashing it down the toilet is always appropriate.


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## Guest (Dec 26, 2004)

Too much beer and Christmas cheer...ugh. Feeling a LITTLE bit seedy today.

Sleeping Beauty,
The family expectations you talk about...it was like reading about myself. I always feel judged by my family as we are all overinvolved in each others lives and my parents try to be very controlling. I have disappointed them hugely because I completed university and after working in my profession I gave it all away because it was very bad for my mental health. My mother still tries to encourage me to change my mind. Its hard to not feel like a failure.

You also said that when you tried to leave home you fell on your arse. Well, had I tried leaving home 6 months ago, I would have fallen on my arse also. I just wouldn't have been ready. I had a lot of counselling for just over a year and gradually I arrived at a different place emotionally and mentally. I went from "I'm terrified of moving and I can't and won't do it" to "I'm very very scared of moving but there is a HUGE chance that I won't cope and a chance that I will cope". I did have SOME belief that I would be able to do it.

I wish i'd had more faith in myself. It would have saved me a lot of fear before leaving. I am sick of having very little faith in myself. That is something I have to work on because I hate the way it spills over to every aspect of my life. Anyway, I can relate to you. You will move when you feel strong enough. It truly is only a BELIEF that you have that is holding you back. It has nothing to do with how capable you are because you are capable. But really, if you think you can't do it, then it is a very powerful mental suggestion and programming you are giving yourself. Everytime you think "I can't do it" you are also listening and learning "OK, I can't do it". It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. You can do it. You can. But you need to do it when you are ready. Oneday you will be. Then you will know. And because you will quietly believe that you can do it, you will.

I think we should start a 12 step program here for Adult Children Recovering From Parents Who Love Too Much.


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## sleepingbeauty (Aug 18, 2004)

for some it may seem like a stupid idea. how can you love your child too much? you most certianly can.. cause there are DIFFERENT types of love. there is conditional love.. and love that goes by a certian set of standards. and if you dont meet those standards or if you do something unexpected.. the love may be strong enough to keep you part of the family unit.. but it doesnt keep them from giving you the HARDCORE VIBE. :?

if i do something wierd.. my dad will get either angry or disgusted and hell put me down so hard that ill never speak of it again. my mom on the other hand.. if i do something that she dislikes or doesnt understand.. she presses her lips together and its like her whole demenor changes. i can literally see her energy get darker and more intense. the worst thing is that i can feel it and its the worst feeling i feel like there are icy hands around my throat and my words get choked out i start stumbling over them until i change the subject and never speak of it again. now that im in therapy i recognize it right away and ive been trying to tell her when she does it and how it makes me feel. of course she denys it.

i find is so much easier to just be who they want that way i can actually have a good relationship with them. but ive been doing it for so long that its come to the point of no return. either i start being my TRUE self or im just going to completely fade away.


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## Guest (Dec 26, 2004)

Brilliant news Monika and Merry Christmas 

A "customer research interviewer"I'm scratching my head lol
great attitude you have about the job,sounds a bit dull anyway,attention to detail indeed,oh my if they only knew your past LOL.
I guess you really are better just no good at detail any more............... now that you see the bigger picture.

I couldn't be more pleased for you,Monika.
Hell if I thought moving to Melbourne would fix me up,I'd start packing now but I just can't take their winters.Nope guess I'll just have to stay crazy in the sub tropics.

All the best Shelly


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## Guest (Dec 26, 2004)

"she presses her lips together and its like her whole demenor changes. i can literally see her energy get darker and more intense"

That is so like my mother. I ask her "what's wrong? You look upset. And she says nothing is wrong. Its a total head***k. Twisted communication. Double meanings. I'm surprised Im as sane as I am, frankly. Another thing. About that "hardcore vibe" you mention. Well, I was seeing an art therapist and I was describing a feeling I get when my mother gives off that vibe. The therapist asked me to visualise my feeling using quite a lot of detail etc. I visualised hundreds of little brown onion-like objects floating independently in the air. My therapist then asked me to crack one open mentally. As soon as I went to do this, this really horrible mean evil face flashed before my eyes, male and very threatening expression on his face. I felt a flash of sharp fear, horrible deadly fear and then a flash of dp. Then I moved past that very quickly and this huge grief and sobbing came out of me. It was so cleansing to get that shit out. I felt so good and centered afterwards...really grounded and unafraid and safe in myself. It makes me sad to think of all the hundreds of little onions I have that i still havent cracked and I wonder whether these are going to continue to cause anxiety in my life. God, I must be carrying so much grief. But anyway, i learned a lot from that experience. None of which makes me feel any better or makes me have better mental health really but I thought it was very interesting how that evil face appeared, as if to scare me away from feeling my grief...and that the dp felt very much as though it was the opposite of FEELING, a nasty distraction that is so compelling that it can block almost anything out. Huh...

Anyway, parents have so much power if we let them...god-like. The capacity to turn on deep shame and feeling of wrongness with a single facial expression. My psych tells me i have internalised my mother and her criticism and perfectionistic expectations. I agree.

My new years relolution is to get her out of my head and to replace her with my own voice...a compassionate, forgiving, gentle, UNCONDITIONALLY loving voice. Im gonna do it if i put my mind to it.

And to Shelly, Hello! I was hoping to find you here! It's good to be back on the board. i wish I had more access to the internet in Melbourne. Now, where is Terri?


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## enngirl5 (Aug 10, 2004)

Monika, I'm so happy for you. I can completely understand how facing all your fears has helped you. I moved just 45 minutes away and it made a world of difference for me. I started driving again, going to school, etc. But this week has been hard. I had one little bout of bad dp Monday and felt like I was gonna have a panic attack (I wasn't eating right) and ever since then all week I've been on the edge (dizzy, nervous, feeling like I'm gonna have a panic attack any minute). I can't really figure out what's wrong other than maybe that moment of panic has just made me feel like I'm gonna have more panic attacks. The panic cycle. And it had to happen the week of christmas.  But I felt ok yesterday so that was some relief. Anyway, I really am proud of you because I remember talking to you and all that you were going through. You're a strong person and you should be proud of yourself. :wink:


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## sleepingbeauty (Aug 18, 2004)

wow monika! that therapy story is incredible sounds like its working for you. i think once we can visualize just what it is that is killing us.. not our parents.. but what our parents have DONE. to see the knife in their hand even though its invisible and they deny deny deny. the denial itself is another knife because it confuses the hell out of you and makes you doubt yourself. if they would just acknowledge the pain they have inflicted i think it would make such a huge difference. instead they just throw more salt into the wound. that is why we have to take charge of our healing and not make it worse by giving into their expectations. we shouldnt fear them we should always see them as being on the SAME EXACT LEVEL as us. and if they do something fuckedup we should just tell them right off.. HEY.. what you just did totally hurt me. god did not put me on this earth to impress you.

i actually told my dad that. ive been saying things like this to him alot and he always cracks up at me even though im being serious he thinks its some kind of joke.. but even so i can see that hes absorbing it. im making alot of breakthroughs with both my parents though we still have a long road ahead.. and im sure that we will NEVER get to patch up all the damage... but at least i can say that im not going to have to cut them off completely. i love them both terribly and i want to have a good solid relationship with them both. since ive been going through intense therapy on all fronts.. i can see that in the future that will be possible.

good luck with your healing monika


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## Guest (Dec 27, 2004)

Dear Enngirl, 
Thank you for your kind words. It's great news that you are also doing better. I had a lot of setbacks whilst recovering and you are right...sounds like the panic cycle. You know, since I have moved to Melbourne i stopped engaging in panicky thoughts because I knew if I entertained those thoughts I might have a really big attack and I was so far from home, I actually did not give myself permission to build up the panic attack in my head. I just cut those thoughts right out. What I mean is, everytime I had a thought like that, for example "I'm feeling panicky, I wonder if that means I will have an attack", I told myself "NO, I am NOT going there. The ONLY difference between me and all those panic-free people I envy is that I have these THOUGHTS and they don't." So how I approached the panic cycle is that I copied the thought patterns and behaviour of people who don't have a panic disorder. And you know what, I simply got out of the habbit of having those thoughts. Within three weeks I simply stopped having ANY panicky thoughts. It is is bloody anticlimatic after all of those years of believing that it would take a miracle to stop my panic disorder only to find that the cure for the panic cycle is so basic. It kind of makes me angry that i didn't do it sooner but I know it's understandable. The good news is, it's nice to know that our brains are capable of gathering momentum in the direction of recovery so that after a while, recovery takes on a life of it's own and with a little bit of maintanance (ie CHOOSING to refute panic-friendly thoughts as they arise on occassion), recovery can become easy.

Sounds like you are recognising the reason for your setback. You are identifying the thought processes that led you to feel worse. Those are the building blocks of recovery from panic disorder as far as I understand and once you are aware of this you can never go back entirely and you will only improve with time. Once you notice, over and over how it is your own thought process that causes the panic in the first place, you CANNOT help but recover as you will start to make more and more choices to NOT participate in the panic cycle. You will come to believe that the panic cycle is NOTHING OTHER than something that YOU create with fearful expectations. You will feel safer about the whole thing.

The panic cycle I understand but the next step for me is to identify why anxiety or panic thoughts get triggered in the first place. For me its also to do with not eating right or when I feel a bit insecure in my relationships or when I'm about to challenge myself and I don't really believe that I am a capable person. Do you know what set off your dp in the first place? Is it the not eating right? I think blood sugar levels have a lot to do with my anxiety. That is why I try to eat protein every three hours.

SleepingBeauty, good luck with your recovery as well. We will get there eventually I think. What other choice do we have?


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2004)

Monika, does the panic have to do with caffein?

I realized that when I am in a period of tiredness and unstable mood coffee triggers bad panic when I don't eat a lot in addition.

When I eat during the day after I had a cup of coffee in the morn I am only unstable emotionally and depressed, but no panic.

When I don't have coffee there is no panic even if I eat very little.


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## enngirl5 (Aug 10, 2004)

The first big panic attack I ever had was a New Years Eve and my best friend and I were tired and knew we were gonna be up all night so we went to McDonalds and got a huge cup of coffee, strong Fast Food coffee. I was never a big coffee drinker and I think this played a part in my panic attack that night. I haven't drank coffee since then. It's been 3 years. But of course that wan't the main cause of my panic disorder, I was going through severe life stressors at the moment. But in my experience coffee can exascerbate anxiety. But I drink lots of caffeine daily in the form of Coke so who knows.


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## enngirl5 (Aug 10, 2004)

Also, thanks so much Monika. Having panic and dp and dr is the most lonely feeling in the world because you feel so far away from everybody and so scared. Hopefully it will pass soon. But again, congratulations on your accomplishments. Take care. :wink:


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2004)

Hi, 
I chose to give up caffine up altogether. It's a stimulant and I think that it makes my anxiety much worse. I think maybe you would feel less anxious if you stopped dringing coke. The caffeine in it is probable as strong as if you drank coffee, especially if you drink it in large quantities. Also coke has a huge amount sugar. Sugar is known to increase the amount of adrenaline in our bodies by four times. That can't be helpful when you are trying to calm yourself down during a panic attack.

I am so boring now. I gave up alcohol for 3 years, smoking and coffee and coke. I am addicted to nicorette gum which I know overstimulates me and if therefore not good for my anxiety however I have cut down a lot. I wish I could quit.


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