# Head injury



## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

At the age of nine I had a severe bang on the front of my forehead when I was hit by a car.

I had never experienced dp before then.

I was wondering if anyone believes/thinks/has evidence that their dp is related to brain trauma/injury?


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## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

I see there have been no takers, so far.

I have found this interesting article

http://neuro.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/c ... l/14/2/141

I don't know if my relatively mild head injury - had anything to do with my subsequent DP.

An EEG five years after my continuous DP started showed "non-specific independent right and left temporal focal abnormalities but no clear epileptic features"

Once I get some ink for my printer, I'll explore some other articles e.g.

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/con ... /144/4/508

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_o ... a9a3764862

This may affect treatment possibilities/options.


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## Absentis (Jul 10, 2007)

Depersonalization (and other dissociative symptoms) can be a symptom of a traumatic brain injury. Pretty much any disorder/symptom can be induced by some kind of brain injury.

Now, before you start obsessing over this, you have two options. One, go to a doctor and get an MRI/some kind of neuroimaging. Secondly, this kind of damage may not show up on a traditional brain scan, so you could see a neuropsychologist. They're currently better at picking up on "minor" brain damage that doesn't show up on any available neuroimaging techniques. (for example, sheared myelinated nerves.)


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

ED! I am so glad i found you! I was knocked unconcious last december and have been suffering from chronic DP/DR as of february (14th of all days). At first i didn't know what was going on but afterwards i went to a therapist and when i told her that i had been hit in the head in december she suggested i get an MRI and EEG. None of those showed anything and im my opinion were pointless to begin with because they are 2D and don't show where the damage is. Soooo i get a SPECT scan, rather expensive but shows 3D pictures of the brain and also chemical imballences. My scan (which was about 5 months after the injury) showed mild damage to the prefrontal cortex, left and right temporal lobe). It also showed severe anxiety and depression which i never experienced before the head injury. Pretty interesting. I've had the DP/DR for about 9 months now, had to drop out of school, and have been through many rough times. Doesn't seem like there's anyone out there who knows what to do/how to help.

Kenny


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## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

Dear Surfing,

I'm still largely in the dark and partly speculating. I don't know if my DP is yet to do with the relatively mild head injury and the anomalous EEG but am going to make further inquiries. If it is because of these it may affect which possible medications/strategies are effective.

I may contact Dr Mauricio Sierra at the Depersonalisation Research Unit at the Institute of Psychiatry with my details, as he has an interest in this (as you can see from some of the research papers), if I can't get satisfaction from my doctors

http://www.iop.kcl.ac.uk/departments/?l ... ntext=main


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

how bad was the injury? were you knocked unconcious? For me i was knocked unconcious but didn't begin experiencing symptoms until 2 months later. The doctors said that most likely what happened in my case was that slowly some of the pathways in my brain shutdown and that is what led to the DP. Still a tricky one to figure out though. Did you experience symptoms right after your injury?


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## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

I didn't experience symptoms until years after my injury.

I was hit by a car when I was nine and bashed my forehead on the tarmac, knocking me unconscious and requiring stitches and hospitalisation for about a week.

My first - fleeting - experience of DP was when I was about 12, and again when I was 17. When I was 19 I went into severe DP and depression and was hospitalised. Between the ages of 19 and 22 I had three major periods of depression and one of mania (too high) interspersed with periods of DP and panic attacks/disorder.

Since the age of 24 I've had chronic DP.

As I say, I'm still exploring this in my own case (as a possible long shot?), but interestingly enough, the article "The Spectrum of Organic Depersonalization: A Review of Four New Cases" by Lambert, Sierra, Phillips and David, says that, "Patients with the most minor head injuries (no loss of consciousness or unconsciousness for less than 30 minutes) were more likely to develop DP/DR (67%, compared with 11% of those unconscious for more than 30 minutes)."


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

That is really interesting. Have you read the book from dpmanual.com? I have been to so many doctors for help and nothing has been able to help me except this book. I would encourage you to check it out.


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## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

Dear Kenny,

What are the positives about the book?

I've read two books that have helped lately, Daphne Simeon's "Feeling Unreal"

http://amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_ss_b/202-9 ... =13&Go.y=4

and "Overcoming Depersonalisation and Feelings of Unreality" by various

http://amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_ss_w_h_/02 ... =10&Go.y=1

and am going to present their suggestions to my doctor.

I'll also present the need for further neurological investigation and possible use of carbamazepine or alprazolam as indicated by papers such as this

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/con ... /144/4/508

Ed.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

Dear Ed,

Until I read the book I was totally confused and in the dark with what was going on inside me mentally. The book really helpled me to see the bigger picture of what was happening to me, why, how to deal with it, and how to get it. I have been 100% in the dark about what to do until i read this book. I would recommend it to everyone that has dp. Everything you need to know about dp and how to get out is in this book. I just finished reading it and already feel alot of peace and have already improved within the last few days. Hope that helps.

Kenny


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## peachy (Feb 9, 2008)

edit


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

It's possible...I've ruled out brain injury as to what is causing my DP. Usually with a concussion the brain is able to heal itself. Also you don't ever hear of anyone who has been knocked unconscious getting depersonalized. If this were the case everyone would be walking around with helmets and sports like football and boxing wouldn't exist. I'm not saying it's impossible but just seems like it would be a very uncommon thing. I had a brain scan done and the doctor told me that my concussion (3 months prior to DP) is what is causing my problems...hah...a year later and it is only getting worse...makes no sense. I just started looking into lyme disease and it makes alot of sense in my case. Be careful what you believe because if it's wrong it may cause you years of loss. Best of luck.


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## peachy (Feb 9, 2008)

.


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## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

I'm only exploring possibilities. I take your point about boxers and American football players. But everyones' head and brain are different and sometimes a head injury can have more serious consequences if it happens to a child, whose brain is still in a state of development.

With some people it may be caused by head injury and stress (this may be a possibility for me), with others drug abuse, with others Lyme disease, with others a genetic fault.

Do a Google for epilepsy and depersonalisation, or head injury and depersonalisation for medical papers. At least they are highly suggestive.

I'm still exploring this - the neurologist I saw recently doesn't think I have classical epilepsy but that doesn't mean that DP is not related to head injury and incipient epilepsy in some way. DP is often involved in the aura of temporal lobe epilepsy and some epileptic drugs are already recommended for DP by e.g. the London research group. Lack of sleep, alcohol, stress and other factors can make for worse epilepsy and DP.

The neurologist is giving me a 24-hour EEG. I felt somewhat better when I was on Lamotrigine - an anti-epileptic drug - a few years ago, and may go back on it. I'll keep you posted re any developments.

I bought this book which may be helpful to some

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Treating-Epilep ... 673&sr=1-7

and I got this one out of the library - highly suggestive in a good sense -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Neuropsychiatry ... 828&sr=1-2

Ed.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

wow that is really interesting that you experienced all of that right after your concussion. have you heard of the amen clinic? they do SPECT scans that show if your brain is damaged and what not. may be worth taking a look at. http://www.amenclinics.com.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

ed that sounds interesting as well. keep me posted on your results.


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## peachy (Feb 9, 2008)

.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

same goes for you  glad we can all support eachother


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## JaoDP123 (Sep 3, 2005)

My DP/DR was likely triggered by head trauma too. I've been really interested in Chiari Malformation now as head injury can bring cause it and the symptom list is right on for me. Check it out...

http://www.chiaricare.com/index.php/Lea ... tigue.html


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## Strange_Visitor (Apr 18, 2008)

JaoDP123 said:


> My DP/DR was likely triggered by head trauma too. I've been really interested in Chiari Malformation now as head injury can bring cause it and the symptom list is right on for me. Check it out...
> 
> http://www.chiaricare.com/index.php/Lea ... tigue.html


Jao

Chiari Malformations are congenital. They can't be caused, by injury or any other trauma. The brain malformations are developed before birth while still in the womb.

The site you mention refers to the fact that some people with this malformation may be asymptomatic, especially in childhood, but develop symptoms in adulthood or after head trauma. Head trauma aggravates the condition, producing symptoms, but the malformation must be present in the first place for this to happen.

I have hydrocephalus, and have had 4 brain operations, all of which are so invasive, you could describe them as head trauma. The condition itself can cause brain damage while uncontrolled, and is often associated with Chiari malformation, although I haven't had that particular diagnosis.

I believe that brain injury may cause DP/DR, but not mild trauma such as concussion (which isn't associated with brain damage). However, as I've only experienced DP when very anxious, for me, that is the cause. But my DR has been constant since an operation for hydrocephalus when I was 12, so that could be a factor in my DR.


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## hurricane12 (May 22, 2008)

my dp was triggered after a fight were i got hit multiple times in my forehead i noticed symptoms of dp right after the incident
and the doctors said i had a concussion. so dp can be caused by brain injury i think maybe some people have a better chance of getting it then otheres because before the fight i always felt like i was in a dream but i figured it was all in my head and it really didnt affect my life but after the fight it got worst its so bad that i cant even go outside anymore and my own room doesnt look the same anymore and also i always felt depressed and anxiety but never told anybody so that probably heightned my chances of getting dp after the injury.


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## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

I'm still exploring this. I've had a full overnight video-monitored EEG in hospital. I still do not have the results.

If agoraphobia is getting you down, I have the good news that I have found over the last few months that the agoraphobia and anxiety can be successfully treated by Cognitive Behaviour Therapy using the techniques of progressive and systematic desensitisation/graded exposure.

My DP had led to really bad agoraphobia for bridges, wide open spaces and open spaces generally. Over the last few months I have made great progress by following the techniques under the supervision of a psychologist. I still have the DP/DR, butI'm becoming free of the agoraphobia and at last have a handle on anxiety.

I thought I would have to get rid of the DP in order to conquer agoraphobia/social phobia, but this has not proved to be the case. The agoraphobia used to lead to very low self-esteem but I'm just happy I'm coming out of it after about five years.

Now that my anxiety levels have decreased, I also notice the DP/DR less. Don't think that you have to get rid of the DP/DR in order to get rid of agoraphobia. CBT may help you.

I'll post this in other relevant areas also.

My tentative hypothesis is that the bump on the head at age nine affected my temporal lobes and made me more susceptible to DP/DR when I was anxious. My anxiety levels were very high at uni and this lead to dp/dr, a massive and terrifying panic attack and depression. I can't be certain.

Ed.


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## kirbyking (Feb 20, 2008)

Yeah i think thats a reason for dp/dr because you were prob so scared it knocked you out of reality.
I'm not sure i got dp from drugs.


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## ed (Sep 27, 2007)

I have found that getting rid of agoraphobia/anxiety through CBT, makes the DP/DR - although it is still there - much less troubling/noticeable.

So far I haven't currently gone for anti-epileptics like lamotrigine, and am continuing to make progress mainly with CBT. I feel I am getting stronger; I'm maybe 60% better.

I think in many cases anxiety and depersonalisation/derealisation are two sides of the same coin both related to the temporal lobes and epilepsy.

The more anxious you are, the more troubling your DP will be and vice versa. Anxiety is amenable to treatment by CBT and if the anxiety is appropriately tackled the DP/DR will get less or at least be less troubling/anxiety-provoking. I didn't seek psychological help for my anxiety until seventeen years after I got DP/DR and that was because the anxiety had come to a head as agoraphobia five years ago. A few months after starting CBT, I'm feeling better than I have for seventeen years.


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## adamadimos (Mar 11, 2011)

Head injury is very serious incident. It may include different types like bone break, brain hemrage etc. The most common cause of driving accidents, including head injuries and sports, and falls. careful treatment of all head injuries, Because it may lead to serious effect on mental health.


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