# A Diatribe



## Guest_ (Sep 17, 2005)

It has come to my attention that Atheism is the new 'It' belief. In the long stream of 'Intellectuals' who are the leaders of the counterculture (for the sake of the act) it seems everything us 'Old fashioned folk' believe- I didn't know that beliefs aged - has become so damn convenient. And its a known fact convenience is an enemy to the philosophers.

Let me clarify before I begin, that I myself am agnostic.

It bugs me when I see books dedicated to nullifying gods existence, youtube videos containing youth confessions that he/she doesn't believe in god (how in vogue), and a general consensus among the pretentious scholars who are supposedly so open minded to new, big ideas, that they are willing to be closed minded to others.

What happened to tolerance? Why is it such a intellectual faux pas to have a desire to transfer my pain into a higher being/force. Go get DP/DR and then tell me to man up. If I go to bed at night, and can't latch onto anything tangible, anything emotional, then why is it so wrong to latch onto something beyond both of these. It is so innately human, and possibly beautiful, to have a moment of catharsis during a submission to the infinite.

So if atheists think that what I am doing is absurd, close-minded, and ultimately, Dumb, then all of the outspoken atheists can go fuck themselves to the thought of their own elitism and self indulgent opinions.


----------



## enngirl5 (Aug 10, 2004)

I agree with what you're saying. And, I think it's important to have a spiritual connection to life. I don't think it's any more naive to think that there are other forces out there than to think we're all alone in the universe. The truth is none us us can really be sure. I think organized religion gets a bad rep because it is often used as an excuse to spread hate and prejudice. Against gay people, women, unmarried people, people of different regions, cultures, etc.

But when you meet people who use religion in a wise way, for example my grandparents (I always use them as an example), they use it for love and comfort. They're traditional Southern Baptists, from a long line of Southern Baptists and it's just what they've always known. They don't hate gay people, or supposed sinners or any of the above. They don't go around picketing abortion clinics or funerals, and find the behavior just as despicable as the next person. Talk about kicking someone when they're down. My grandparents, like many so called "religious people", believe God gives us blessings, helps us through hard times, gives a purpose to life, makes us complete, physical, emotional, spiritual. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that. There are just as many delusional Atheists out there as any other religious group so I think they should also get a clue and quit judging everyone when they don't have any more facts on the matter than anyone else. We're all entitled to our beliefs and opinions, because we all see life in a different way. I just think people should learn to respect others beliefs and drop the holier than thou attitudes.


----------



## CECIL (Oct 3, 2004)

I see the whole thing as a macrocosm of DP in a way. Think about it - today's society (especially science) is so bent on objective and logical thought. Everything must have a rational and logical explanation or it is deemed unworthy of acknowledgement and dismissed.

In a way, the world has gone and gotten itself into a global state of DP. Or at least wound itself so tight with fear and anxiety that we are making some terrible decisions.

I can't help but think that one meaning in DP/DR is to experience first hand what happens when people embrace this mindset and then learn to move through it. Then what can we do? Heal the world, one person at a time (i.e. ourselves)


----------



## PPPP (Nov 26, 2006)

I think that it's interesting how much belief atheists have in their own ideas. (I guess that's not just atheists really.)
I could never say I know for sure that way.
I mean... how do you know for sure?
?

I don't think that it matters what path you follow as long as you try to do the right thing and be a good person.
I don't think that people are becoming atheist because they think it's cool. I think that their experiences and beliefs lead them in that direction.
It doesn't really bother me at all.
Brother Jim standing on the corner and yelling at me that I'm going to hell bothers me alot more. (lol he doesn't even know me after all) :roll:
I just don't have that kind of solid belief in my own ability to understand the workings of things. I could never say that I know for sure.


----------



## Guest (Feb 1, 2007)

> I just don't have that kind of solid belief in my own ability to understand the workings of things. I could never say that I know for sure.


Every conclusion we arrive at, every decision we make is based on our limit of comprehension.
Every living thing has its limit of comprehension, so I think it is a little naive to think we have, even a basic understanding of how life/reality really is.
I personally think it is beyond our level of understanding.
I truly believe there is more to this, I am not referring to dp, I am talking about
life itself.
What would a dogs reality be like, how do you think a dog would view reality?

G.


----------



## Rozanne (Feb 24, 2006)

Atheism is just another faith. I think it must be harder to believe something that is possible is _not there_, that is why I am always bemused by the ferocity of atheists.

I believe anger on the part of atheists is largely a politic backlash due to not wanting to be told how to live their lives. If this reactivity way taken away, I wonder how many atheists would for a moment consider the possibility of there being a divine entity beyond what we can immediately see in the world.

I also suspect that atheists are less blown away by the miraculousness of anything existing at all, regarding science as "normal".

Take for example the issue of natural selection. I have the impression that many atheists would think the battle was "won" if the theory of natural selection was proved as irrefutably true. But a knowledge of the mechanism of selection does not answer the question of how the genetic material came into existance in the first place, in order to be selected.

The discipline that atheists universally say they "believe in" is science. And yet, even scientists and mathematicians have theorised on the illusory nature of reality, for instance, that time doesn't exist, and that everything is made up of energy.

Those are my 2 cents.


----------



## CECIL (Oct 3, 2004)

miss_starling said:


> I also suspect that atheists are less blown away by the miraculousness of anything existing at all, regarding science as "normal".


Haha, yep. To paraphrase Terry Pratchet: "Great A'tuin was enormous. But most people get caught up in being amased at how BIG the turtle is, rather than the fact that a Turtle exists at all".



> I have the impression that many atheists would think the battle was "won" if the theory of natural selection was proved as irrefutably true.


Considering I studied Science in University I feel qualified to address this point  Its a very big misunderstanding that Science proves anything. The Scientific Model is just that - a model. A limited explanation based on what we understand now. Its basic premise is that a Hypothesis can never be proven, only disproven. In other words, its accepted until proven wrong. Every scientific experiment is designed to prove a certain hypothesis wrong, since you can't ever prove one right.



> The discipline that atheists universally say they "believe in" is science. And yet, even scientists and mathematicians have theorised on the illusory nature of reality, for instance, that time doesn't exist, and that everything is made up of energy.


Yep, very high level physics is now dealing with the idea of a holographic universe and they've even done experiments showing that matter/energy in seperate areas of the universe (i.e. not linked in any way we can currently measure) is affected by changes in different areas. I probably butchered that explanation, lol.

The trouble is that the general mentality of the population is still very focussed on Newtonian physics. i.e. Everything is material and solid and can only be affected by physical means. It takes a long time for this science to fiilter down into every-day consciousness.

Considering we as a planet now utilise electrical and magnetic fields in just about all of our technology, is it so much of a leap to believe our brains/minds are connected in the same way?

I think not.


----------



## Guest (Feb 2, 2007)

CECIL said:


> its accepted until proven wrong


As is religion. "All" is a guessing game, but it would seem this isn?t enough for the human brain? we must have answers even if they prove wrong in the future.


----------



## Guest (Feb 2, 2007)

Personally I think It is totally naive and egotistical to think we can answer
questions about this, about now, about why are we here etc etc.
It really is laughable when you think about it.
Why do stars have a predetermined life span?
Why does a dog live for 10 to 15 years?
Why do some insects only live for 2 hours?
Why do we ask these questions?
Why do we question reality?
Where does it end?
Why do we question if all this is a dream?
In my opinion, it makes us feel special, think about it, if it were a dream we would be THE most special person in the universe.
End of the day, we all what to feel special.

G.


----------



## Guest (Feb 2, 2007)

Im still the same person said:


> we all what to feel special.
> 
> G.


But I am special


----------



## Guest (Feb 2, 2007)

> But I am special


*Puts hand out to offer an uncomfortably long hand shake*
And says "You are the most special person on this site"

G.


----------



## Guest (Feb 2, 2007)

Im still the same person said:


> > But I am special
> 
> 
> *Puts hand out to offer an uncomfortably long hand shake*
> ...


Don't offer me your hand, i'd be putting your index finger in my mouth :wink: :lol:

Good come back mate.... *Thumbs up*... lol


----------



## Pollyanna 3098 (Dec 12, 2006)

> Why do we question if all this is a dream?
> In my opinion, it makes us feel special, think about it, if it were a dream we would be THE most special person in the universe.
> End of the day, we all what to feel special.


Interesting theory.

3098


----------



## Martinelv (Aug 10, 2004)

I'm deeply ashamed that I missed this post. And seeing as it's not on the spiritual forum, I feel free to unleash the full fury...well, not fury, mild annoyance really, of my atheism.



> What happened to tolerance?


Pardon? Is this a joke? A few kids do some videos on YouTube and a couple of people write atheistic books, and you are getting all uptight? Is this a backlash I smell? Yes, I think it is. It is a backlash, not particually against atheism, but the percieved 'unromanticness' of atheism. You couldn't be more wrong there. Atheists, generally, are as romantic as anyone else. We shudder in awe at the marvels in the universe. We love our partners and friends, maybe more so, because we know this life is the only one we get. We don't fly planes into buildings. We don't kill doctors who perform abortions. We don't slaugher whole communities because of our (lack of) belief....etc. Tolerance? Excuse me while I laugh. Atheists tolerate religion, unless it interferes with their life. We regard it as nothing, but we keep our mouths shut out of 'respect', and the world taboo regarding religion. I still think that to deserve respect, it has to be earnt. But still.



> Why is it such a intellectual faux pas to have a desire to transfer my pain into a higher being/force.


Because it is. It's intellectual cowardice, but if you want to, need to, then fine.



> outspoken atheists can go flower* themselves to the thought of their own elitism and self indulgent opinions.


 :lol: :lol: :lol:

Outspoken atheists? LOL! What does that mean? Do you mean an atheist who DARES to say something that contradicts religious mantra? Deary me. And why do you assume that atheists are elitist and self-indulgent? Why is that? Are you saying that all atheists are intellectuals? LOL. Sorry, this is just too funny for words. Self-indulgant?

I'll stop there. I've haven't got my daiper on.


----------

