# ARGHHHH!



## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

So I'm frustrated as hell again. I have just been feeling like absolute shit for the last couple weeks. Its so hard to describe. I'm done with the DP/DR thing almost completely except for the odd episode. So I guess I should be thankful for that.

The medications I am on also seem to help with the obsessions - while I still feel like something is wrong with me, I am not spending all my time worrying about schizophrenia or if my memory is working correctly, etc.

But whether it is the medication or just a phase going through I feel like physically ill from my mental health if that makes any sense. I have just these AGONIZING levels of irritibility, lethargy, anxiety (like horrible anxiety that I feel physically in the pit of my stomach in in my tense shoulders), horrible depression. These feelings are bringing my symptoms back as I find it hard to concentrate, figure out whats going on around me, etc.

The positive as I mentioned is that I am not obsessing about these symptoms. I just can't deal with this constant influx of emotions. It's seriously like i'm in agonizing mental pain. Like there isn't any physical manifestation but I feel just awful mentally nearly 24/7.

Any thoughts? Are meds doing this to me? Is this just another phase in the progress of my mental health issues?

I thought if i stopped obsessing about my fears I would be better - but that has been steadily improving yet I am still frustrated. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Note: The only time I feel better is when I go up from my 0.5mg daily dose of Clonazepam to 1mg of that. But I am doing this too often now - I know that all that can come of this is that soon 1mg will not be enough and i'll have to boost again. I also have this suspicion that as much as Clonazepam is helping with the anxiety and allowing me to function it is leading to the depression, irritibility, and lethargy i constantly feel.


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## Guest (Mar 29, 2009)

This is just a worthless, anonymous-intertube-guy-with-no-medical-training-whatsoever guess, but based on what you said about feeling better when you up your dose of Clonazepam, have you thought that maybe you've developed a tolerance to it?


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## scylla (Nov 5, 2008)

hey Matt,



Matt210 said:


> So I'm frustrated as hell again. I have just been feeling like absolute shit for the last couple weeks. Its so hard to describe. I'm done with the DP/DR thing almost completely except for the odd episode. So I guess I should be thankful for that.
> 
> The medications I am on also seem to help with the obsessions - while I still feel like something is wrong with me, I am not spending all my time worrying about schizophrenia or if my memory is working correctly, etc.
> 
> ...


this is exactly the way I felt a couple of weeks ago, remember what you told me? You said it will be better and that it probably has to do with the meds...and you were right. It's the meds, I stopped Xanax, I suppose that's like you developing tolerance to Clonazepan. It is improving now, so I'm sure it will be better for you too in a week or so.

It's a shity feeling you have and I hope you'll feel better pretty soon.


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

I think you are both right. I think I most certainly have developed a tolerance to Clonazepam. I just don't know what to do - i'm sure it is most people's frustrations with Benzos and why they don't really work. If I start going up to 1mg every day and not just when I feel horrible - then its only a matter of time before i build up a tolerance to that.

I know plenty of people on this site use Benzos every single day and have for years - I am curious as to how they do this. Don't they find it stops working after a while?

I think i'm going to try stopping the Clonazepam slowly. I imagine that is going to give me the week from hell but I just for experiment's sake want to see that after the withdrawal, etc. how I feel. Just to know if it is responsible for the horrible mood swings and absolute crap I am going through, or if it is the SSRI, or neither. Clonazepam is just the easiest to stop because my doc doesn't want me to stop Cipralex without being under doctor supervision.

The last two days I had taken 1mg. So today and tomorrow I think i'll just take my daily dose of 0.5mg and then i'm going to cut my pill in half for the rest of the week at 0.25mg and then get off them for a week. I can't promise myself i'll actually manage to do this, but I just want to see how I feel when I am not on a daily dose of Benzos. I know you are supposed to get off Benzos when you feel strong enough, but i'm worried they may be keeping me weak.

I'll keep updated on if i'm actually able to do this and if the withdrawal is bad for me, even at my low dose.


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## scylla (Nov 5, 2008)

good luck Matt.

Keep very busy, and try not to be alone when you cut the dose.

(((hugs)))


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

scylla said:


> good luck Matt.
> 
> Keep very busy, and try not to be alone when you cut the dose.
> 
> (((hugs)))


Thanks yeah, I'll make sure I have plenty of company and distraction.

I'm probably making a bigger deal out of this than I need to - I know people are on 4mg per day and miss a dose and are fine. But I have such an addictive personality, and more than just losing out on the Benzo - I am also losing my safety net. I like having the Benzo there to know I can take it if things start to get out of control anxiety-wise.

I still have the Benzos so I know if I can't stand it I can take one - but it will be difficult. How was getting off Xanax for you? I hear it is quite addictive - any withdrawal symtpoms?


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## Guest (Mar 29, 2009)

When anxiety is extremely high along with depression etc the mental anguish can feel like a physical thing that everyone can see and like something you want to literally surgically remove or something, hard to explain but I wondered if you were trying to describe something I remember having also.

Benzos do become a nasty cycle. See, what happens when you increase your dose occasionally but then take the usual dose at other times is you end up getting rebound anxiety. It's better to stick to the same dose at _exactly_ the same times each day or it just makes anxiety worse in the long run. If you are chopping and changing your doses quite alot on a regular basis it could explain why you feel worse.

I was addicted to benzos several times. Coming off of them and working on my anxiety in other ways was the best thing I ever did, but you have to be ready first, if you feel you have gotten your obsessive thoughts under control enough now and to a point where you can calm yourself down and out of an episode then stopping might be a good idea.

Every now and again if I'm feeling very anxious I will still take a benzo, it's rare, but sometmes I have to.

Things always feel as though they are getting alot worse when they first start getting better Matt, it just works that way, it's because the motivation and certain feelings return to us-the ability to feel returns and as it does it can hurt and throw alot of stuff up. It's not necessarily a bad sign but can be a good one. The agitation can be a sign that things are shifting. My recovery was like that.....progress and then hell, progress....and then hell......frequent trips to the psych ward...the mood shifts became more rapid as I worked things out too but eventually it all evens itself out and comes into balance and the bad bits become less intense.


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

Spirit said:


> When anxiety is extremely high along with depression etc the mental anguish can feel like a physical thing that everyone can see and like something you want to literally surgically remove or something, hard to explain but I wondered if you were trying to describe something I remember having also.


That describes it QUITE well. Better than I explained it anyways.

I need to let your post sink in a bit more, but I think it is quite helpful - so thanks for responding.

I'm going to give it a go without the Benzos for a bit - see how long I last. I figure it can't hurt - if I can't deal I just go back to them - can't see any harm coming from taking a little break.


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## Guest (Mar 29, 2009)

Make sure you wean off of them properly.


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

Spirit said:


> Make sure you wean off of them properly.


Yep, im not even sure exactly what that means but i'm going to do it my way - two days on 0.5mg (without taking the extra 0.5mg in the evening), then 5 days on 0.25mg just to make it a solid week. Then i'll come off completely next week depending on how it goes.

Any recommendations on other things to calm me down in the absence of benzos? Teas? Herbal products? I think i'm going to exercise daily.

Should be an interesting little experiment


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## konstantine02 (Mar 12, 2009)

Hey your experience with the Benzos is why I am fearing them. I haven't taken Ativan in...a week actually, and I'm slowly beginning to manage my anxiety. I have my "emergency" Ativan in case I have a complete breakdown (mostly if I'm working and start freaking out), but I won't use it unless I am seriously thinking I'm going crazy/start crying/start having that nagging anxiety.

My doctor recently prescribed Klonopin as well, but I don't think I'm going to try those out until they put me on an SSRI and I have to deal with those side effects (I think in a couple of weeks they are going to give me Zoloft or something). I'm trying my hardest to really work on the anxiety stuff. I just keep telling myself that I need to just deal with the DR and that it's not harming me. Even though of course I keep thinking I'm losing my memory and am blacking out and am having random feelings go in and out. However, last month I was a complete mess crying every day and now this month I've cried maybe twice in the week and was able to work four days. It's a slow improvement, but possible.

I'm stubborn too. I'm sure you will be able to handle getting off the Benzos. It's a nice safety net, but I wouldn't continue it if tolerances build up. In group therapy it seems as though the addicts are having just as hard of a time as us depressed/anxious/disassociated people. I would want you, or me, to deal with an addiction AND DR. The thought of that could give me an anxiety attack.


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## egodeath (Oct 27, 2008)

My k-pin ran out on Friday. My shrink said he'd call in the refill, but I have to remind him, I guess. We can both have a couple days of hell.


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## konstantine02 (Mar 12, 2009)

egodeath said:


> My k-pin ran out on Friday. My shrink said he'd call in the refill, but I have to remind him, I guess. We can both have a couple days of hell.


Hey if you lived around here I would hook it up haha. I have 60 tablets just sitting in a drawer waiting to be taken.


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## Conjurus (Oct 25, 2008)

I've been easily angered lately too. Someone at my work said drownded and it just pissed the hell out of me.


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

Conjurus said:


> I've been easily angered lately too. Someone at my work said drownded and it just pissed the hell out of me.


That might make me angry on even my best days haha.

So I decided not to wait around and just cut my dose of Klonopin in half - the logic of doing another day at my usual dose didn't really make any sense so here we go! Feeling okay so far, granted i'm only 5 hours beyond where I would usually take my full dose.

Let the great experiment BEGIN!


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## Guest (Mar 30, 2009)

Matt210 said:


> Any recommendations on other things to calm me down in the absence of benzos? Teas? Herbal products? I think i'm going to exercise daily.


There's a few things that you might like to try, I'm not sure they'll make a huge difference where benzo withdrawal is concerned, but maybe worth a shot. Chamomile tea, Bach flower rescue remedy, I'm a bit dubious about mentioning lavender essential oil with Darren back on the forum incase this turns into a discussion about man boobs......but it is very relaxing, just sprinkle some on your pillow at night and inhale. It wouldn't be a good idea to try other herbal products if you are on other medications. Those are my three essential things that help me, the rescue remedy is really good, I know there's lots more things but my mind is blanc at the moment, if I think of anything I'll post it here.

Goodluck Matt.


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## dreamingoflife (Oct 22, 2006)

I sometimes get the feeling you are trying to describe and I am on xanax but only on as needed basis. I notice when I take a xanax the next day or even the same day after it has worn off a little I will get this mental pain/anguish. It's like a big ball of emotions combined into one and it's very frustrating. This feeling alone has made me dread when I need to take a xanax. I guess this is the baggage attached to depending on medicine. I am with spirit try and taper off of it but at a slow pace and see if this feeling goes away. It will be a rough period while coming off the medicine but I think you will notice that feeling diminish the more you wean off it.


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

So this is day 3 of being on my pathetic little 0.25mg dose of Clonazepam. I'm doing alright - actually my mood has been quite elevated. The depression, irritability, and mental anguish vanished the first day I lowered my dose.

I have quite a bit of anxiety which is be expected - and I am a bit troubled by the fact that I feel a bit manic. Like I feel almost obnoxiously happy - but I can't actually enjoy it because my anxiety keeps telling me that it is mania, which in turn scares me. I don't know if feeling a bit manic is normal for coming off of a benzo, but i'm hoping it goes away as I come off completely.

I've had two good days, and am feeling positive. Hopefully I keep moving in this direction.


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## Guest (Apr 1, 2009)

I'd take the mania and run with it. Even though you know it's part of a withdrawal symptom. Hell, it could be worse; it could be a deep funk or something. In fact, the more I think about it, I'd kill for a bit of mania right now.

It's interesting that your depression seems to've lifted upon lowering the dose. This is why I don't take benzos unless I've been awake for a few days and desperately need to sleep. They have a palpable negative impact on my mood.

Anyway, good luck with the rest of your experiment. Without wanting to jinx you, after three days and still doing well, it looks like you might've have 'got away with it'. Huzzah, huzzah.


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## egodeath (Oct 27, 2008)

Shit. One k-pin left. Told doc to call in prescription a week ago. Shit.


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## Ajax DR (Feb 10, 2009)

Well Matt I can tell you I'm experiencing the same exact symptoms as your going threw (or was) I can tell u though I dony believe it is your meds. Because currently I am not on any meds and never have been so I can tell you it's not your meds. I had the same exact thoughts as you my sciso fear was dying down a little and started to worry less about it but with it I started suffering from horible physical proplems over sleeping, aching muscles, extremely bad depression that felt to the letter like yours. So I just wanted to let you know that I know what your going threw and I hope your doing better hang in there and do what you can to pick your spirts up cause god knows we need something to help us to be les misrable. Do u have some kind of hobbie to take your mind off of it? cuz my drumming helps me a good amount.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

50% off for all DP sufferers! send addresses in PM


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## egodeath (Oct 27, 2008)

surfingisfun001 said:


> 50% off for all DP sufferers! send addresses in PM


what are you selling?


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

egodeath said:


> Shit. One k-pin left. Told doc to call in prescription a week ago. Shit.


Hang on to that one until you really need it.

I'm officially on day #1 off Benzos - ahead of schedule I might add. Imagine that - waking up and feeling like I don't need one.

Small victories.


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## Surfingisfun001 (Sep 25, 2007)

egodeath said:


> surfingisfun001 said:
> 
> 
> > 50% off for all DP sufferers! send addresses in PM
> ...


it's a joke


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## Guest (Apr 2, 2009)

Matt210 said:


> I'm officially on day #1 off Benzos - ahead of schedule I might add. Imagine that - waking up and feeling like I don't need one.
> 
> Small victories.


That's awesome Matt, really good going.


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## Conjurus (Oct 25, 2008)

Matt210 said:


> egodeath said:
> 
> 
> > Shit. One k-pin left. Told doc to call in prescription a week ago. Shit.
> ...


Congratz man. This will be the third night of work in a row without any Vistaril, although I meant to take one tonight but forgot. Wish me luck.


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## Matt210 (Aug 15, 2004)

Conjurus said:


> Congratz man. This will be the third night of work in a row without any Vistaril, although I meant to take one tonight but forgot. Wish me luck.


Good news as well. Nothing against medication at all - but it is obviously always great to be on as little as possible.

I am only today feeling full withdrawal effects of the Clonazepam - I think the last of it would have been gone from my system as of this morning. I slept poorly last night - felt hot, sweaty, and generally had aches all over my body. Today I have major headaches and high anxiety.

But i'm feeling good enough still that i'm determined to power through this. I understand more than ever that Benzos are not a long term solution for me. They might be for some people - but I can tell now that some of the symptoms that made me think I wasn't doing well - depressive thoughts, irritability, and so on were caused by the Clonazepam. Will certainly not hesitate to take them in the future again if I need them - nor will I hesitate to take one on a very irregular basis if I need one, but ultimately i'd like to be off of them.


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## lcich (Mar 14, 2009)

Matt210 said:


> I have quite a bit of anxiety which is be expected - and I am a bit troubled by the fact that I feel a bit manic. Like I feel almost obnoxiously happy - but I can't actually enjoy it because my anxiety keeps telling me that it is mania, which in turn scares me. I don't know if feeling a bit manic is normal for coming off of a benzo, but i'm hoping it goes away as I come off completely.


I have had this feeling sometimes and I don't know if it my body trying to tell me that I am feeling better, but I usually do chalk it up as maybe I am going insane and I won't be able to control myself, so I repress it. I have often wondered if this happening is really my body feeling normal and I just don't know it because I have felt out of it for so long or if I actually am losing my mind...


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