# 'excessive' sudden sobriety - increased DP/DR?



## MajorTom (Dec 17, 2008)

Hi all

I am new here and just wanted to say it's great to see a community of people who understand and are supporting each other through this nightmarish, exhausting trip through a stage set... 

I have looked for some answers to my questions and have seen a couple of possibilities but wondered whether my current situation was worsening my DP/DR.

I am on Lamotrigine 450mg and Quetiapine 600mg as well as Diazepam prn.

I changed AP at the beg of 2008 (I need to be on one for bipolar I) and my DP/DR began again after a long remission. I controlled the fear with Lorazepam which helped at times. Gradually it improved after several months and i went back to work (lots of other stuff kept me off sick too). I had a lot of mood swings due to problems at work that were affecting all of us in the team.

I gave up smoking in early October and came off the patches just over a week ago. I have to stress that this is the first time in over a decade that I have gone this long without nicotine in my system and I mean over a week here! I used to get hooked on the nicotine gum if I didn't smoke :roll:

I also decided to stop drinking for at least a few weeks as I was knocking back over half a bottle of wine a night and much more when I went to bars with friends. My mood was very depressed and i was sure it would improve without alcohol for a while as it was a rare couple of nights that I didn't drink. I haven't had a drink since the 26th Dec. Although I don't feel the utter anguish of before (still depressed ) now that I am not drinking, my DP/DR has gone crazy! I am cutting down the Valium too, but I was only taking 2mg every two days. It's been 3 days since my last dose. It sounds obvious and stupid, but would all these together make DP/DR worse? I was advised to increase the seroquel XR to 600mg from 550mg and thought this could worsen it too. However, it looks like benzos and alcohol can worsen DP/DR too, judging by one of the lists of possibly exacerbating meds on this board.

Any ideas anyone?

Thanks so much and please excuse the long post - my brain and everything else is too numb to summarise!


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## Ecorvi (Oct 31, 2008)

I quit drinking too and I feel me better. Not about my DP/DR but I was drinking a lot coze I didn't feel me good.
My psychiatrist said that alcohol is good against anxiety at the begin but it's the opposite after, you feel more anxious.
Now, you have quit a few time ago, it can be worse at the begin but resist, marijuana, tobacco and alcohol are craps, AD too but some of us need it. But you don't need tobacco, alcohol or pots!
Stay strong!


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## Mark (Jul 21, 2008)

Oh boy.
This is a good one.

Drinking too much really messes with DP.
Good thing to stop for a while.

Stopping smoking can be stressful for months and months.
Way to go. Keep it up! Soon the stress is replaced with pride.
seroquel XR - the dose that you are on could take down a elephant.
100mg will f-ck up my day.
600mg is for a psychotic - do you hear voices? Are you having visions?
So, I take it at night only and just 100mg.

I think you should go on Wellbutren, clonazepam and the serequel before bed.
The epilepsy drug that you are taking is interesting but I an not sure it has worked for anyone.

Tell me I am wrong.

I think clonazepam is better that valium.

You may be being put to sleep.

That makes me very anxious.


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## MajorTom (Dec 17, 2008)

Thanks, I really appreciate the input.

Yes, am finally starting to feel my mood really improve without alcohol. Felt good this a.m! Wow. Unprecedented. Still DP/DR in the city centre but that would never surprise me...What is surprising is how easy it was to give up cigs last year. Not complacent at all but i don't really think about it anymore and haven't had a craving for ages. You're so right, Ecorvi, just have to stay away from anything that f**** with the brain chemistry. WE have enough to deal with with prescription drugs!
Thanks, Mark. Yes, I do think the Seroquel is too high and have talked to my psych about reducing it. TBH, i have heard that the lower the dose of seroquel the more conked out people get. I take it all at night and increased from 25mg to 600mg in a year, noticing that any grogginess in the a.m (and being knocked out at night as with a sledgehammer!) disappeared quite quickly. As for the psychs , I don't think they always realise that these drugs can make things worse. I was psychotic in the late nineties but haven't had that since. 'Just' mood swings (bad bad depression), DP/DR and HPPD. I am cutting down as of tonight. 
I know Klonopin is the gold standard for DP/DR/HPPD in North America from what I have heard. Here in the UK, they wouldn't give it to me. They gave me Ativan for a few months then made me go onto Valium so as to taper off eventually. 
Lamotrigine - can't say if it does anything for DP/DR as I was free of it back in 2003 when i started it, but it killed my suicidal depression and for that I will be forever grateful...
What is def true is that when you stop drinking and smoking you need less of these kind of meds (and caffeine) much of the time and one can feel more of the side effects sometimes, apparently. I also read that this happens after quitting cigs due to nicotine and/or all the other shit in them making the body metabolise the drugs more quickly, hence the need for a higher dose if drinking and smoking.

So another good and incidental side-effect of staying away from cigs and alcohol! Need less medication and it is also more likely to work.
Thanks for the advice and hope today is being good to you.


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## Mark (Jul 21, 2008)

Hey, you sound great today.

What the f-ck is wrong with the UK and clonazepam??

It is so safe you would have to take 100 and a 40 oz of vodka to kill your self.
You have to take soooo much that you brain stops telling your diaphragm to move.

It is easy to get off if you don't take more than 1.5mg per day and it is extremely effective in low doses.

I was sending my extras to a guy in the UK at one point.
I sent them in a CD case.

One doctor said to me to take as much seroquel as you can handle.
He thought I had ADD - wrong.
If it is keeping any psychosis at bay, and it is not making you tired, then go for it.

It is expensive here.


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## MajorTom (Dec 17, 2008)

Re: Klonopin

I know! It seems to be handed out like candy to everyone with HPPD/DP/DR in the States, but is only licensed for epilepsy here, which seems a bit dodgy since i can't imagine anyone specifically licensing a benzo for long-term control of an illness that can be treated with other non-addictive drugs...weird. Still, I feel safer on Valium than on Ativan as it has a long half life, so c'est la vie.
It sounds like you and so many others see it as a real life-saver. Good for you!


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## Sleepwalker (Dec 4, 2008)

I think Mark is spot on when it comes to Klonazepam. It has the longest half-life of any benzo. This means, simply put, it's effect will wear off more slowly and induce less of a withdrawal syndrome. Mg for mg it's also the most potent. It's time the medical fraternity starts looking at klono's real indications for usage! :x 
I use c.2mg/day average for more than 10 yrs and it's still effective.
I may be the only one here to testify this; *lamotrigine has almost literally* SAVED MY LIFE! It took me out of bed; out of total exhaustion, confusion and depersonalization. 
Soon afterwards, I was able to take a two-year mechanical technicians course and passed! Before that couldn't add 2 and 2. Long live LAMOTRIGINE!!! (and klono)
(although, still Dp'd)


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